JFK Assassination Forum

TG-

In addition, Malcolm Blunt said Solie was all over Clay Shaw and New Orleans. Why?

John Newman says Solie was running LHO.

Is it really "Case Closed" who influenced, instigated or manipulated LHO?

Dear "BC",

Beats the heck out of me.

-- "TG"

Of course I have seen that document and I quote often from it in my last book.

So what?

The HSCA took little interest in Nagell. They had NO interest in having him testify.

Just as the ARRB realized that the Nagell story was ridiculous.

The CIA may have isolated some stuff related to CIA offices, etc., but they had nothing to hide about Nagell.

Have you read my book?

fred

Dear Fred,

Have you ever considered the possibility that one of the reasons the HSCA "had no interest in having Nagell testify" was because probable KGB mole Bruce Leonard Solie (look him up) had withheld from said committee certain Office of Security files on him?

-- Tom

I’ll cheerfully admit, I have no interest in, or patience with, TG’s Boris-and-Natasha Spy vs. Spy KGB Boogeyman posts that I loosely characterize as his “KGB stuff.” For those who share my non-interest, here FWIW is an interesting 15-page article that nicely summaries what it’s all about and how wacky it is:

https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/JAMES%20J.%20ANGLETON%2C%20ANATOL%5B15725929%5D.pdf

To anyone actually interested in TG’s KGB stuff, this article is surely familiar – but to those who share my non-interest it’s a short, readable and authoritative orientation to the topic. Oddly, Google returns few citations, and I don’t find it discussed on JFKA forums at all.

It was published in the December 2011 edition of Studies In Intelligence, which is a peer-reviewed academic journal on intelligence published by the Center for the Study of Intelligence within the CIA. The journal contains both classified and non-classified articles. Since this was approved for release in 2019, I assume it was originally classified (or perhaps it’s just this version with the reviewer’s annotations and redactions that was classified).

It is entitled “James J. Angleton, Anatoliy Golitysn, and the ‘Monster Plot’: Their Impact on CIA Personnel and Operations.” The apt description before the title is, “A Fixation on Moles.”

The author is Barry G. Royden, who worked for the CIA for almost 40 years and was the Director of Counterintelligence from 1998 to 2000. He later taught counterintelligence at the Department of Defense’s Joint Military College. (He's also in the Bradford (CT) Sports Hall of Fame!)

The gist of the piece is that Angleton was possibly even more obsessed with the KGB than TG. Royden explains that Angleton was convinced of a “vast, complex  Communist conspiracy” that had been in operation for decades, with the KGB as a fantastically capable “10 feet tall” Superman, “head and shoulders ahead of the CIA in the intelligence profession,” with its tentacles everywhere, specifically in the form of moles throughout the U.S. and allied intelligence communities. What Angleton called the Communist “Master Plan” came to be derisively referred to as the “Monster Plot” within the CIA by those who saw the damage Angleton’s paranoia had done.

TG will now explain to us (well, not to me, but to those who read his obsessive posts) how Royden was in fact a KGB stooge and how Tenant Bagley (whose book Spy Wars is briefly mentioned in the article) was the real deal. I’m sorry to post this since it will inevitably set TG off on one of his rants, but I did stumble upon it while waiting in Room 247 at Langley for my annual performance review and found it worthwhile.

Dear Fancy Pants Rancid,

I will endeavor to enlighten you later (and in a different thread) on the finer points of Royden's par-for-the-course, full-of-misstatements screed.

For now, please be aware that the term "Monster Plot" was coined by a CIA operations officer by the name of John Limond Hart*, who wrote an article titled "The Monster Plot: Counterintelligence in the Case of Yuriy Ivanovich Nosenko" in 1976 and who, in 1978, was delegated by clueless CIA Director Admiral Stansfield Turner to defend to the HSCA the "bona fides" of putative KGB staff officer and false-defector-in-place-June-1962-in-Geneva / false (or perhaps rogue) physical defector to the U.S. in January 1964, Yuri Nosenko. Hart did so by avoiding altogether Nosenko's contradictions, palpable lies, and ever-changing stories, and by concentrating instead on how "stupidly" Tennent H. Bagley and his Soviet Russia Division boss, David E. Murphy, had misunderstood Nosenko, and how "sadistically" they had treated the stressed-out, forgetful, hard-drinking and language-challenged "defector." 

Bagley, having resettled in Brussels after his gig as Chief of Station naturally expired there, petitioned G. Robert Blakey to be allowed to rebut Hart's scurrilous charges, and permission was granted.

Here's Bagley's 170-page (40 pages written-in-advance) HSCA testimony, in which "Pete" rips Hart a "new one."

Enjoy!

https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/docid-32273600.pdf

PS The other point I'd like to make right now is that James JESUS Angleton, brilliant though he was counterintelligence-thinking-wise, seems to have had a Father Figure Obsession, as evidenced by the fact that he was duped by both Kim Philby and his confidant, mentor, and mole-hunting superior, Bruce Leonard Solie, in the mole-hunting Office of Security.

It interesting to note that during a long 29 June 1964 meeting, during which Angleton and Murphy were trying to get Golitsyn to resume cooperating with Solie, Angleton said that Solie's office (he was Deputy Chief of the Security Research Staff and Chief of its Research Branch) was the only one in the CIA that he wasn't afraid was penetrated by the KGB.

LOL!

How ironic.

*Hart's wife, Katherine Colvin Hart, was, "ironically," the boss of probable KGB mole Leonard V. McCoy and sketchy Robert Lubbehusen (look him up) in the omniscient and omnipresent Soviet Russia Division's Reports & Requirements section.


-- Tom

-- If, as gun experts claim, the dented shell found in the sixth-floor sniper's nest could not have been used to fire a bullet during the assassination, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

The fact that the dented shell could not have fired a bullet during the assassination is undeniable. See "The Dented Bullet Shell: Hard Evidence of Conspiracy in the JFK Assassination," https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ihue8a0GmN_Ptl38bPjpu1F99nqU0Z6f/view.

Not at all, laddie. The two-shot scenario is not only plausible but makes the LN scenario stronger. Think.  Your linked article, not unsurprisingly, misses the salient point.

The lone-gunman theory of the JFK assassination is an extremely fragile house of cards. If just one of the hundreds of credible accounts that lone-gunman theorists refuse to accept is true, the theory collapses. If just one of the items of evidence that lone-gunman theorists dismiss is true, the theory collapses. Here are just a few examples:

-- If the accounts of a bullet striking the grass near a manhole cover on the south side of Elm Street are valid, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

-- If the accounts and the photographic evidence that an unidentified federal agent recovered a bullet from the grass near the manhole cover are valid, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

The evidence that a bullet did indeed strike the grass near the manhole cover and was recovered is credible and convincing by any reasonable standard. See "Extra Bullets and Missed Shots in Dealey Plaza," https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WRwhDQ9HMydf5pICsHwgtkoNKw0YSO8T/view.

-- If Dr. James Young was correct when he reported that a misshapen bullet was recovered from JFK's limousine in DC and that he saw and handled the bullet, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

Dr. Young's account is credible and convincing by any reasonable standard. In fact, Dr. Young simply assumed the misshapen bullet was one of Oswald's alleged shots, and he assumed the bullet was discussed in the Warren Commission's (WC's) report. He only came forward with his account when he learned that the WC did not address the bullet. See "Extra Bullets and Missed Shots in Dealey Plaza," https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WRwhDQ9HMydf5pICsHwgtkoNKw0YSO8T/view. See also Milicent Cranor's article, “Navy Doctor: Bullet Found in JFK’s Limousine, and Never Reported,” https://whowhatwhy.org/politics/government-integrity/navy-doctor-bullet-found-jfks-limousine-never-reported/.

-- If the several eyewitness accounts that prove Oswald could not have been on the sixth floor during the shooting are valid, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

If this were virtually any other case, the eyewitness evidence that prohibits Oswald from being on the sixth floor during the shooting would be viewed as compelling. I recommend Barry Ernest's book The Girl on the Stairs. See also Joseph Green and James DiEugenio's extensive review of Ernest's book: https://www.kennedysandking.com/john-f-kennedy-reviews/ernst-barry-the-girl-on-the-stairs. See also https://www.pennlive.com/entertainment/2016/11/harrisburg_man_appears_in_docu.html. And see also "Faulty Evidence: Problems with the Case Against Lee Harvey Oswald," https://drive.google.com/file/d/1R1CZaCZfLA5QFjTCHNINcKxTH4cBiPfw/view (pp. 27-30).

-- If the dozens of witnesses who reported seeing a large wound in the right-rear part of JFK's head were correct, the lone-gunman theory collapses. These witnesses included two of the Parkland nurses who cleaned JFK's head and packed the large wound with gauze after he was declared dead, a Secret Service agent who got a prolonged close-up look at JFK's head wound twice in the space of 10 hours on the day of the shooting, the three morticians who reassembled JFK's skull after the autopsy, a Dallas funeral home worker who held JFK's head in his hands while he helped place the body in the casket, the Parkland neurosurgeon who examined JFK's head when he entered the ER, several of the medical technicians at the autopsy, and the two FBI agents at the autopsy. One of the morticians and the FBI agents drew diagrams of JFK's wounds and placed the large head wound in the back of the head, several inches farther back on the head than the wound seen in the JFK autopsy photos.

-- If Dr. James Humes, the lead autopsy doctor at JFK's autopsy, was correct when he told JAMA that 2/3 of the right cerebrum were blasted out, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

Dr. Humes's statement has been confirmed by hard scientific evidence: multiple optical-density (OD) measurements of the JFK autopsy skull x-rays have established that the x-rays show about 2/3 of the right brain to be missing. Dr. Fred Hodges, one of the nation's leading radiologists in the 1970s, reported to the Rockefeller Commission that the AP autopsy x-ray shows "a goodly portion" of the right brain to be missing. We know that bits of JFK's brain were blown or fell onto 16 surfaces. We also know that Jackie Kennedy brought "a large chunk of brain" into the Parkland ER and handed it to Dr. Jenkins. Yet, the alleged autopsy brain photos show "less than" 1-2 ounces of brain tissue missing.

-- If the Zapruder film does in fact show reactions to at least six shots, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

See "Reactions to Six Shots in the Zapruder Film," https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nnp3Vch_KMOB_qufAhlQOCLTTS9jqNV0/view.

-- If Governor John Connally was correct when he insisted he was certain he was not hit before Z229, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

He most certainly was correct. See "Reactions to Six Shots in the Zapruder Film," https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nnp3Vch_KMOB_qufAhlQOCLTTS9jqNV0/view.

-- If, as gun experts claim, the dented shell found in the sixth-floor sniper's nest could not have been used to fire a bullet during the assassination, the lone-gunman theory collapses.

The fact that the dented shell could not have fired a bullet during the assassination is undeniable. See "The Dented Bullet Shell: Hard Evidence of Conspiracy in the JFK Assassination," https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ihue8a0GmN_Ptl38bPjpu1F99nqU0Z6f/view.