Gus Rose

[Martin Weidmann]

As I explained earlier, I reported the correct source note for the answer to the question that Colin asked.

Can the LNs please send their A team back in..... the currently line up is losing credibility fast.

[John Iacoletti]

The source notes are properly done. And the time is noted in the testimony.

Not much help there:

Mr. FRITZ. Let's see, I have it right here. Oswald was arrested at 1:40 and I think he was taken to the city hall about 2:15 and I started talking to him probably a little bit after that.
Mr. BALL. About what time?
Don't you have a time marked in your report there?
Mr. FRITZ. I think so.
Mr. BALL. Of 2:25.
Mr. FRITZ. 2:25?
Mr. BALL. On page 237 of your report, your report of Sims and Boyd refers to a time that he was brought to your room, and I believe 165.
Mr. FRITZ. My report, my report should have a report right there that should show it. This shows here 2:15 and I don't think that is right.
Mr. BALL. Mr. Baker's report on 165 gives the time also.
Mr. FRITZ. The nearest that I have here then would be shortly after 2:15 p.m.
Mr. BALL. You will notice that Sims and Boyd make it, state they brought him from the conference room to your office at about 2:20.
Mr. FRITZ. That might be all right because I have 2:15 here but I think 2:15 may be 5 or 10 minutes too early.
Mr. BALL. It was soon after you got there?
Mr. FRITZ. Soon after I got there.
Mr. BALL. That you brought him into your office?
Mr. FRITZ. Yes, sir.
. . .
. . .
Mr. BALL. How long a time did you sit with Oswald and question him this first time?
Mr. FRITZ. The first time, not but a few minutes.
Mr. BALL. That was the time Hosty and Bookhout were there?
Mr. FRITZ. That is right. But sometimes when I would leave the office to do something else, it is hard to imagine how many things we had happening at the one time or how many different officers we had doing different things without seeing it but we were terribly busy.
I had called all my officers back on duty and had every one of them assigned to something, so going back and forth kept me pretty busy running back and forth at the time of questioning.
I don't know when I would leave, I suppose Mr. Bookhout and Mr. Hosty asked him a few questions, but I don't believe they questioned him a great deal while I was gone.
Mr. BALL. You said just a few minutes, what did you mean by that, 15, 20, 25?
Mr. FRITZ. It would be pretty hard to guess at a time like that because we weren't even quitting for lunch so I don't even know, time didn't mean much right at that time. For a few minutes, you would think 30 or 40 minutes the first time.
Mr. BALL. Thirty or forty minutes?
Mr. FRITZ. I am guessing at that time.

How Bugliosi bracketed that entire interrogation between 2:25 and 2:30 is anybody's guess.

[Charles Collins]

Not much help there:

Mr. FRITZ. Let's see, I have it right here. Oswald was arrested at 1:40 and I think he was taken to the city hall about 2:15 and I started talking to him probably a little bit after that.
Mr. BALL. About what time?
Don't you have a time marked in your report there?
Mr. FRITZ. I think so.
Mr. BALL. Of 2:25.
Mr. FRITZ. 2:25?
Mr. BALL. On page 237 of your report, your report of Sims and Boyd refers to a time that he was brought to your room, and I believe 165.
Mr. FRITZ. My report, my report should have a report right there that should show it. This shows here 2:15 and I don't think that is right.
Mr. BALL. Mr. Baker's report on 165 gives the time also.
Mr. FRITZ. The nearest that I have here then would be shortly after 2:15 p.m.
Mr. BALL. You will notice that Sims and Boyd make it, state they brought him from the conference room to your office at about 2:20.
Mr. FRITZ. That might be all right because I have 2:15 here but I think 2:15 may be 5 or 10 minutes too early.
Mr. BALL. It was soon after you got there?
Mr. FRITZ. Soon after I got there.
Mr. BALL. That you brought him into your office?
Mr. FRITZ. Yes, sir.
. . .
. . .
Mr. BALL. How long a time did you sit with Oswald and question him this first time?
Mr. FRITZ. The first time, not but a few minutes.
Mr. BALL. That was the time Hosty and Bookhout were there?
Mr. FRITZ. That is right. But sometimes when I would leave the office to do something else, it is hard to imagine how many things we had happening at the one time or how many different officers we had doing different things without seeing it but we were terribly busy.
I had called all my officers back on duty and had every one of them assigned to something, so going back and forth kept me pretty busy running back and forth at the time of questioning.
I don't know when I would leave, I suppose Mr. Bookhout and Mr. Hosty asked him a few questions, but I don't believe they questioned him a great deal while I was gone.
Mr. BALL. You said just a few minutes, what did you mean by that, 15, 20, 25?
Mr. FRITZ. It would be pretty hard to guess at a time like that because we weren't even quitting for lunch so I don't even know, time didn't mean much right at that time. For a few minutes, you would think 30 or 40 minutes the first time.
Mr. BALL. Thirty or forty minutes?
Mr. FRITZ. I am guessing at that time.

How Bugliosi bracketed that entire interrogation between 2:25 and 2:30 is anybody's guess.

He didn’t. Take a look. Don’t trust my word.

[John Iacoletti]

He didn’t. Take a look. Don’t trust my word.

Fair enough.  How Bugliosi decided that Oswald definitely told Fritz his Beckley Street address and did it between 2:25 and 2:30 is anybody's guess.

[Colin Crow]

So kind of you to question my honesty Charles. While the questioning of Fritz does not make it clear, it certainly implies that an officer indicated Oswald has an address on Beckley prior to Oswald confirming it. Fritz did not remember whether that information was passed on prior to commencing the first interrogation or during that event. It occurred outside his office.

We know that about 15 minutes after the arrival of the cops at the Paine’s, Walthers related the roominghouse phone number back to Decker and the address was cross checked from that. Surely it is possible that this was how Fritz was informed. Alternatively the was a mystery officer who knew about the Beckley address independently. As I said, it is unfortunate that the officer was not identified so that we could be certain how the information was obtained.

Charles, I was not questioning the recollections expressed by Rose in your original post, merely when they occurred. The 3.30pm time frame makes no sense to me and I question the need for a 40 minute wait. I can find no other documentation to suggest it occurred.

The point I would like to pursue is the notion that information was being passed from Irving to Dallas by phone. Do people think that there was information flow the other way? Specifically information about the crime scene. The rifle, the lunch, the long sack and that Frazier had taken him to work. I wonder if the other TSBD employees had notice whether Buell had driven him to work that day.

As you have implied I was not acting in good faith I would appreciate a response to my post above. Did Bugliosi suggest anywhere that there might have been an alternative for Fritz finding out about Beckley other than from Oswald? If not, I gather we grant him "poetic licence" but acknowledge it as such. It seems he was not complete too. I take my point as proven.

Bugliosi fails to tell the complete story, when the material is questioned the questioner's honesty is called. I seem to remember you live in an area that supports Trump. Looks like consistent style.

[Charles Collins]

Yes, and if you randomly connect dots or ignore some of the dots, or add extra dots that aren't there then you get the wrong result.

CTs only try to convert the dots into question marks. Problem is they don’t have any ink (evidence) to put in their pens.

[Colin Crow]

Mrs. PAINE - I can proceed. I recall my feeling of anger with her for not being more upset, or she didn't appear to me to be, any more than reporting a remarkable news item. Then it was shortly after that that the bell rang and I went to the door and met some six officers from the sheriff's office and police station.
Mr. JENNER - Was this approximately 3:30 p.m.?
Mrs. PAINE - Oh, I think it was earlier, but I wouldn't be certain. I know that we had put our children to bed. They were all taking a nap, though I am not certain. Yes, my little girl was asleep also. I cried after I had heard that the President was dead, and my little girl was upset, too, always taking it from me more than from any understanding of the situation. And she cried herself to sleep on the sofa, and I moved her to her bed, and Christopher was already asleep in his crib. June was in bed asleep.
Mr. JENNER - Was Marina emotional at all? Did she cry?
Mrs. PAINE - No. She said to me, "I feel very badly also, but we seem to show that we are upset in different ways." She did not actually cry.
Mr. McCLOY - May I go back a moment there, if I may. You said you were Sitting on the sofa--that she and you were sitting on the sofa. While you were listening or looking at the television, was there any announcement over the television of a suspicion being cast at Lee?
Mrs. PAINE - It had just been announced that they had caught someone in a theatre, but there was no name given.

Mr. LIEBELER. I believe it was Fifth.
Mr. WALTHERS. Yes; and I took our officer, Harry Weatherford, and we met Officer Adamcik that works for the city and Officer Rose and another one of their officers, but I don't recall his name right now--at this address in Irving and when we went to the door, what turned out to be Mrs. Paine just as soon as we stepped on the porch, she said, "Come on in, we've been expecting you, and we didn't have any trouble at all--we just went right on in and stared asking her--at that time it didn't appear that her or Mrs. Oswald, or Marina, who came up carrying one of the babies in the living room--it didn't appear that they knew that Oswald had been arrested at all--the way they talked.

The point is Charles, they didn't know it was Lee at the time the cops arrived. They were listening to the news (of course). It was not at 3.30pm when they arrived.