Two Wallets? Nope.

[John Mytton]

But that's kind of my point. "Were mistaken," given the chaos and confusion, is perfectly understandable and is neither suspicious nor fodder for CT theorizing.

If the preferred answer is "lied," then one should be able to articulate a plausible reason for why they would have lied.

Ditto if there were two wallets. One should be able to articulate a plausible reason.

In short, one should at least be able to provide a coherent answer to my little "What sense would that have made?" questions.

If we admit the answer will always remain a mystery, then the debate is - or should be - at the level of which scenario seems the most plausible and makes the most sense. But that's exactly where those who are making the most noise - looking at you, Martin - don't seem to want to go.

The CT's don't need a reason, it's like Capasse told me a few days ago, he don't need no stinkin' alternate narratives, just pointing out the alleged problems with the evidence is enough proof for him! Personally I find this way of thinking to be extremely unsatisfying, the CT's have accumulated a wealth of allegations so it must lead somewhere, right?
In the case of the extra wallet at the Tippit crime scene, this to the devout CT is the shred of proof they are looking for to claim a conspiracy, because after 60+ years any evidence of conspiracy is virtually non existent so whatever morsel they can come up with is devoured like a rabid dog!
Also to a CT an extra wallet with the Hidell ID could mean that this wallet was swapped with Oswald's real wallet and thus the planted Hidell alias is again proof of conspiracy but planting the Hidell wallet in Oswald's wallet would still fulfil this criteria? The added difficulties in manufacturing, planting and then hiding the Tippit crime scene wallet makes zero sense.
The CT's like to believe that the Hidell alias was invented to cover the "fake" rifle and revolver purchases but as I've said before just linking the name "Lee Harvey Oswald" with these "fake" purchases would be far far easier and probably more convincing because why add extra steps which require a ton of extra work?
Here off the top of my head is the extra steps of planting the Hidell alias into the official narrative, with all the possible problems of this deceit being discovered in a multitude of ways, why bother?

The Hidell ID was manufactured by conspirators
The Hidell ID was planted by the Police
The Hidell ID negatives were manufactured by conspirators
The Hidell ID negatives were planted by conspirators in the Paine residence
The Hidell name was inserted by conspirators into the New Orleans post box application records.
The Hidell name was connected To Oswald's New Orleans Chapter of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee by conspirators.
The Hidell name was used as The "Chapter President" of Oswald's made up Cuba Committee by conspirators.
The Hidell name was forged by conspirators onto Oswald's "Fair Play for Cuba" leaflets
The Hidell name was written on membership cards by conspirators other than Marina, who must have lied.
The Hidell name was a play on "Fidel" according to Marina who must have lied
The Hidell name was forged onto the Klein's coupon
The Hidell Kleins coupon addressed to Oswald was forged onto the Klein's microfilm
The Hidell name was forged onto the Kleins envelope
The Hidell Kleins Envelope addressed to Oswald was forged onto the Kleins microfilm
The Hidell name on on the Kleins Coupon found by Waldman on the night following the assassination was forgotten?
The Hidell rifle was never sent to Oswald's PO box
The Hidell newly manufactured microfilm was substituted at some point with Kleins business records microfilm.
The Hidell ID was admitted by Oswald or Police lied
The Hidell ID was admitted by Oswald or a Postal official lied
The Hidell ID was asked of Oswald or an FBI agent lied
The Hidell name was forged onto Oswald Job applications as a reference
The Hidell rifle was photographed with Oswald by either forgery or trickery
The Hidell rifle was planted on the 6th floor of Oswald's work by conspirators
The Hidell revolver coupon was forged by conspirators
The Hidell name was forged onto the Seaport-Traders paperwork
The Hidell revolver was lied about by the Police
The Hidell revolver was substituted by Police
And on and on it goes!

JohnM

[Lance Payette]

I gave two plausible explanations. Here it goes again:

- someone planted a wallet with Oswald's name and the Hidell ID at the Tippit murder scene

- Oswald carried more than one wallet that day and dropped one at the Tippit murder scene

I think you're confusing or conflating "plausible" with "possible."

Sure, those are "possible" scenarios.

They become "plausible," if at all, when you can articulate what sense they would have made and why they make more sense than more mundane scenarios that seem to me to make far more sense.

When you start talking of planting a wallet at the Tippit scene with a Hidell ID in it, you are automatically in the realm of conspirators who know the Hidell name was used to purchase the rifle in March and for some reason think that including the Hidell ID will further their conspiratorial agenda. I have a difficult time making any sense of that.

[Jon Banks]

I think you're confusing or conflating "plausible" with "possible."

I understand the meanings of "plausible" and "possible".

If I typed "plausible", it was intentional.

[Lance Payette]

Since Martin & The Sock People (was that a rock group?) will not tackle my inconvenient questions, I have been forced to don my swami robe, enter into deep meditation, and attempt to answer them myself. This is a tentative effort, but I find it rather convincing. Team Martin can surely tweak it into absolute conspiracy gospel.

1. The conspirators – we’ll simply call them the Big Boys – realize early on that an ex-Marine former defector with a Russian wife could come in handy down the road. They have no specific plan at this point, but they like to think ahead.

2. In March, the Big Boys order the Carcano rifle from Klein’s using Oswald’s PO box and the Hidell name on the order. Big Boy contacts in the PO make sure the rifle never reaches Oswald. The Big Boys now have a pretty compelling piece of evidence if they ever come up with a plan of some sort. Despite being Big Boys, they aren’t too sharp about firearms; hence the Carcano - or maybe they just think a Carcano seems like something Oswald would order.

3. In the ensuing months, the Big Boys fake the backyard photos and crank out several fake Hidell IDs. Now all they need is a plan of some sort. They're starting to think maybe the plan should be something like assassinating JFK. Yes, that would be Big Boy sort of stuff, and JFK is kind of a nuisance.

4. Oswald, with or without the assistance of the Big Boys, lands a job at the TSBD. Let’s say without, or this will start to sound ridiculous.

5. On November 9, Joseph Milteer makes his famous statement to police informant Somersett. The Big Boys, who are plugged into all police matters everywhere, learn of this and slap their foreheads. But of course! An office building with a high-powered rifle and a dumbass patsy! At last they have a use for the rifle and the Hidell stuff.

6. OK, the Big Boys enlist yet another of their many contacts to befriend Oswald and lure him into a plot to hijack a plane to Cuba. As anticipated, this “sounds good” to Oswald, and he’s “on board” (a pun, you’ll notice – the swami is big on puns).

7. The Big Boys arrange for JFK’s motorcade to make the turn at Houston and Elm. This is child’s play because the Big Boys are, in fact, Big Boys. Their tentacles, figuratively speaking, are everywhere.

8. Oswald is instructed to visit Marina the night before since, let’s face it, he may not be seeing her again. He’ll need an excuse for the Thursday visit, so let’s say curtain rods. He’ll need to have some sort of curtain-roddy package the next morning, even if it just contains Ruth Paine’s new 35" Spalding Cash-In putter. This all sounds good to Oswald.

9. Oswald is instructed to lay low in the TSBD until 12:30 or so, at which time his fellow hijackers will “create a ruckus” allowing him to exit the TSBD. Oswald, being fairly sharp, wonders why a ruckus is necessary – why can’t he simply go to lunch at noon? No, no, no – the Presidential visit is a perfect distraction for an aircraft hijacking, and a ruckus will make it even more distracting. Oh, OK.

10. The ruckus occurs. Oswald is a bit surprised at the magnitude of it, but he guesses the hijackers know best.

11. Oswald is instructed to be at his rooming house no later than 1 PM and to retrieve his pistol. (“Why can’t you just provide pistols?” the perceptive Oswald wonders. JUST DO IT, DICKHEAD. OK, I’m on board.)

12. When everything is in place, a police car will toot its horn in front of the rooming house. Oswald is to leave immediately and proceed calmly down the sidewalk. A police vehicle will stop and ferry him to his hijacking contact at the Texas Theater. (“Gee, this seems awfully complicated,” the perceptive Oswald says. JUST DO IT. OK, I’m on board.)

13. Poor young Oswald has, of course, been duped. The police vehicle stops, but Big Boy Sock Puppets appear out of nowhere and gun down Tippit. No one is more surprised than Oswald – well, perhaps Tippit, who just thought he was being paid $50 to be a mysterious taxi for 15 minutes. Now the perceptive Oswald realizes something isn’t quite right. Nevertheless, he MUST get to the Texas Theater and rendezvous with his hijacking contact.

14. With Oswald gone, the Big Boys plant an Oswald wallet at the murder scene, including the nice touch of a fake Hidell ID. If this weren’t clever enough, they have made sure – somehow, we don’t need all the details – that Oswald’s actual wallet also includes a fake Hidell ID. Or maybe they don’t – maybe the fake Hidell ID is just in the murder scene wallet, or the Texas Theater wallet, but anyway it’s there somewhere. Because they are Big Boys, they realize that two wallets could raise some pretty obvious red flags, but getting the fake Hidell ID tied to Oswald is worth the risk because … well, BECAUSE IT JUST IS, OK?

15. At this point, of course, the DPD officers are clueless about all of the above. There are two Oswald wallets, at least one and perhaps two with fake Hidell IDs and, well, WHAT THE HECK? The Big Boys have to work fast now, but money talks. Such DPD officers as are deemed necessary are paid Big Bucks by the Big Boys to say and do silly things that make THEM seem suspicious and ensure the two-wallet confusion will never be resolved.

16. With all that done – whew! – the Big Boys get on with hypnotizing Ruby, altering JFK’s body and such other conspiracy stuff as seems appropriate to tidy up loose ends.

I mean, it’s PERFECT – is it not? Is this not what we can be pretty sure ACTUALLY HAPPENED? When Martin & The Sock People have tightened it up, is it not the stuff of which conspiracy gospel is made?

If it’s not – please, tell me. Prove you can do better!

[Bill Brown]

Don't hold your breath Bill.  "Martin" from "Europe" is all talk.   He will come with a thousand reasons not to debate you.  A real coward.

Agreed, Richard.  He wants to criticize me for "not answering" his questions all while asking me how Bardin came to be in possession of the Oswald/Hidell wallet.  The reality is, Bardin was in possession of TIPPIT'S WALLET when it was taken from Tippit's body at Methodist.  If this sort of thing is what I can expect in any sort of a debate, then perhaps it's best for Weidmann to continue to run from said debate.

Weidmann seems to believe that when he says "jump", I must ask "how high?".

[Martin Weidmann]

Agreed, Richard.  He wants to criticize me for "not answering" his questions all while asking me how Bardin came to be in possession of the Oswald/Hidell wallet.  The reality is, Bardin was in possession of TIPPIT'S WALLET when it was taken from Tippit's body at Methodist.  If this sort of thing is what I can expect in any sort of a debate, then perhaps it's best for Weidmann to continue to run from said debate.

Weidmann seems to believe that when he says "jump", I must ask "how high?".

Trying to ridicule me, Billy? 

If this sort of thing is what I can expect in any sort of a debate, then perhaps it's best for Weidmann to continue to run from said debate.

Only in your arrogant imagination do I "run" from a debate, when in reality you have proven over and over again that there is no point to have a debate with you.

I can only wonder why you are so desperate to debate me. Do you have something to prove?

Weidmann seems to believe that when he says "jump", I must ask "how high?".

Actually, Weidmann believes that a self declared "expert" (which you clearly pretend to be) would be able to answer a simple question or two. Too bad that all you do is run from any question!

[John Iacoletti]

Oswald's wallet, along with both Westbrook and Barrett, were inside Westbrook's office once Oswald was brought in. Let me say that again... All three (Oswald's wallet, Westbrook & Barrett) were inside Westbrook's office after Oswald was brought in. I believe Barrett is being honest when he says Westbrook asked him about Oswald/Hidell identifications inside a wallet. I just think Barrett is misremembering where it was that the brief conversation took place, i.e. inside Westbrook's office versus at Tenth & Patton.  All of this is covered in "With Malice" by Dale Myers.

People always "misremember" things at Bill's convenience.

[John Iacoletti]

It is, isn't it? Are we to interpret your response as "Thinking logically is beneath me" or "I have no answers"?

Perhaps you can provide the "logic" behind ordering a gun using an alias, killing the president with it, and carrying around an ID that day with that very same name on it.

Or is it only CT scenarios that have to pass the Lance Payette "logic" test?