Then went outside to watch P. parade ( Parts 1 & 2 )

[Alan Ford]

It is 2pm. Mr Oswald (blue arrow) has just been brought into the Homicide Office. Behind the door the officer is about to open (purple arrow) is Mr Bill Shelley, who is giving his first affidavit statement.



Mr Shelley's presence delays Mr Oswald's entry into that room, which must be cleared.

Now! Two things to note here:
1----------------------Mr Oswald is about to see Mr Shelley, who is his supervisor at the Depository
2----------------------Mr Shelley's first affidavit makes no mention of Mr Oswald


Here's what will happen:
--------------Mr Shelley will be asked to give a second affidavit, one that discusses Mr Oswald. Mr Shelley will tell whoever is taking this second affidavit that Mr Oswald was near him on the front steps at the time of the shooting.
--------------This information being unacceptable to the 'investigating' authorities, that second affidavit will tell us all about Mr Oswald with the exception of the single most crucial question: Did Mr Shelley see Mr Oswald at the time of the shooting? That question will be completely fudged through strategic omission.
--------------Mr Oswald, meanwhile, in his first interrogation in the back room will tell Captain Fritz that he went outside to watch the P. Parade. And he will mention Mr Shelley, whom he has just seen in what is now his interrogation room and is therefore someone who can be easily asked, as a witness who can back up this claim.
--------------The first OFFICIAL interrogation report for that session will
a) fudge the all-important question of where exactly Mr Oswald claimed to have been at the time of the shooting ("on the first floor")
b) make NO mention of Mr Shelley (whom Mr Oswald mentioned)....... but at the top someone will write in the name of He Who Cannot Be Named in the report itself, i.e. a man whom Mr Oswald named as a supporting witness for his alibi for the shooting



 

[Walt Cakebread]

Why can't Mr Oswald have simply lingered at the front entrance for a couple of minutes after the shooting, as others did?

Why can't Mr Oswald have simply lingered at the front entrance for a couple of minutes after the shooting, as others did?

If you're a LNer that would fly in the face of your tale that Lee was fleeing the scene....

However I believe that Lee said that he stood around outside for a few minutes before telling Shelley that he was going to take the afternoon off because there wouldn't be any work done that afternoon.  I believe there are photos that show Lee Oswald standing on the street in front of the TSBD.  He has his hands in his pockets ( just like the photo taken in Minsk) and he's watching the activity in the railroad switch yard. He's wearing a brown shirt and gray trousers. 

[Zeon Mason]

If Oswald was “lingering for several minutes” out front on the steps after meeting Baker/ Truly then

1. Oswald is NOT in much hurry to leave the TSBD to return to his boarding room at this point in time.
2. If not in a hurry, therefore, would not Oswald consider going to get his jacket left somewhere inside the TSBD, before he begins his trip to return to his boarding house?
3. Since it’s Mr.Kaiser linked to this story of finding CE 163 in the Domino room , then if the clip board story is suspect, then so is the jacket in Domino room story
4. Did Oswald perform his type of work lifting and moving boxes while carrying /wearing items such as his bracelet, ring, keys to house /room and P.O. Box , his wallet with possibly 13$ (= $100 in 2021) , on his person in loose shirt and pants pockets?
5. A plausible answer to 4. Is that Oswald took these items and placed them in his jacket pockets for safe keeping to avoid accidental loss while performing his job.
6. It’s plausible that Oswald therefore placed his jacket somewhere in TSBD that he thought to be more secure than in the Domino room.
7. One place could be the 2nd floor lunchroom closet or a room adjacent to lunchroom
8. If Carolyn Arnold saw Oswald at 12:15 in the 2nd floor lunchroom, it is therefore plausible that Oswald may have left his jacket there after leaving to go back down to the Domino room where it’s likely he was at 12:23 so as to have  heard/seen Jarman/Norman returning thru back door of TSBD.
9. 12:25, Oswald moves to the front lobby without his CE 163 Blue jacket, having left it in 2nd floor lunchroom closet or other adjacent storage room.
He may have been seen here also by Carolyn Arnold given that she never really categorically denied the 12:25 FBI report when she made her later 12:15 FBI statement.
10. The probability factor that Oswald could have been such an obstruction in front of the TSBD door that it caused a collision with a DPD cop with his gun drawn and subsequent Mr.Truly having to vouch for Oswald, and this event  was totally unnoticed   by Mr Williams, Mr Shelley adjacent and Pauline Sanders also, makes this an scenario defying reasonable probability and thus less plausible than other possibilities.
11. An alternative possibility that does not require one to have to result to label Baker/Truly as abject liars, does not require a leap beyond reasonable probability, yet preserves the principle PM=Oswald theory, is the Oswald Follows After Baker/Truly scenario, and is predicated on the passenger elevator being used by Oswald to 2nd floor which allows a more probable coincidental timing of an 85 sec post shots sighting by Baker of Oswald in the 2nd floor lunchroom.

[Alan Ford]

Why can't Mr Oswald have simply lingered at the front entrance for a couple of minutes after the shooting, as others did?

If you're a LNer that would fly in the face of your tale that Lee was fleeing the scene....

However I believe that Lee said that he stood around outside for a few minutes before telling Shelley that he was going to take the afternoon off because there wouldn't be any work done that afternoon.  I believe there are photos that show Lee Oswald standing on the street in front of the TSBD.  He has his hands in his pockets ( just like the photo taken in Minsk) and he's watching the activity in the railroad switch yard. He's wearing a brown shirt and gray trousers.

Can you point us to this photo, Mr Cakebread?

[Alan Ford]

10. The probability factor that Oswald could have been such an obstruction in front of the TSBD door that it caused a collision

No collision. Officer Baker had a v. fleeting exchange with the man before Mr Truly took over. Scarcely ANYONE on those steps even noticed---or was willing afterwards to say they noticed---either Mr Truly or Officer Baker come running up.

I reckon several people saw the LHO-Baker-Truly encounter but shut up about it-------steering clear of trouble by claiming not even to have noticed Officer Baker's or Mr Truly's running up the steps and going through the glass door!

with a DPD cop with his gun drawn and subsequent Mr.Truly having to vouch for Oswald, and this event  was totally unnoticed   by Mr Williams, Mr Shelley adjacent

So Mr Shelley is still on the steps?

and Pauline Sanders also,

Who didn't even notice Mr Truly come running up

Thankfully the v. fleeting incident was noticed by Mr Lovelady and whoever spoke about it afterwards to DPD, who reported it to the press that same day.

makes this an scenario defying reasonable probability and thus less plausible than other possibilities.
11. An alternative possibility that does not require one to have to result to label Baker/Truly as abject liars, does not require a leap beyond reasonable probability, yet preserves the principle PM=Oswald theory, is the Oswald Follows After Baker/Truly scenario, and is predicated on the passenger elevator being used by Oswald to 2nd floor which allows a more probable coincidental timing of an 85 sec post shots sighting by Baker of Oswald in the 2nd floor lunchroom.

Nope--the encounter happened at the front entrance. The lunchroom encounter is a fiction created by the 'investigating' authorities.

If you still disagree, do you believe Mr Oswald bought TWO cokes in the lunchroom----------one pre-motorcade, the other just after the assassination? Because that's the only way one can even begin to reconcile how the lunchroom is covered in the Hosty draft interrogation report and how it's covered in the later Bookhout solo interrogation report (both covering the same interrogation session)

Much simpler and more logical solution: Mr Oswald's claims (visited the lunchroom pre-motorcade, then went down to one, then went outside to watch P. Parade) were true-------and had to be buried

[Walt Cakebread]

Can you point us to this photo, Mr Cakebread?

One of the photos is printed on page 68 of Groden's TKOAP. It is the color photo at the top of the page. I believe Billy Lovelady is standing beside Lee Oswald.

[Zeon Mason]

Where is Lovelady on record having stated something specific about seeing Oswald encounter Baker and Truly at the entrance door of TSBD?