If Oswald Was The Assassin, Did He Plan His Escape From The TSBD Very Well?

[Tim Nickerson]

Great. My next question would be about Shelley and Lovelady.

In Adam's testimony it says that she saw both men as she arrived on the 1st floor, but we know from Shelley's and Lovelady's testimony that both men were at the front of the building, near the main entrance, when the shots were fired. We also know from the same testimony that Lovelady saw Officer Baker running towards the building  and entering it with Truly, at an estimated 30 seconds after the shots were fired. Shelley and Lovelady also tell us that they first went to a little traffic island and then down the dead end road running parallel to the TSBD towards the parking lot on the west side of the TSBD where they stayed for a while. They did not re-enter the TSBD until 12.35, just prior to it being sealed off.

All this means that Shelley and Lovelady could physically not have been anywhere near the stairs in the north west corner of the TSBD at around 1 minute after the last shot, right?

We also know that Sandra Styles re-entered the TSBD through the main entrance at the front of the building at roughly 12.35 and that Victoria Adams stayed outside for a short while to talk to co-workers. She then heard a radio broadcast at 12.36 and tried to re-enter the building which by then had been sealed off. She had to talk her way in, went up the stairs to the 2nd floor, walked through the office space towards the freight elevators in the back of the building and went up to the 4th floor with two men she thought were police officers or secret service.

The only location where Shelley & Lovelady and Styles & Adams possibly crossed paths was at or near the parking lot at the end of the dead end street. Shelley and Lovelady said they were there before entering the building at the west side and Adams and Styles passed there when they were making their way to the front entrance.

So, the question is; could it be that Adams was mistaken in her testimony and that she saw Shelley and Lovelady (possibly as the first persons she knew) as their paths crossed at the parking lot?

It's possible that Adams was mistaken about seeing Shelley and Lovelady but I doubt that she was. She recalled it on two separate occasions.

[Martin Weidmann]

It's possible that Adams was mistaken about seeing Shelley and Lovelady but I doubt that she was. She recalled it on two separate occasions.

Okay, can you find a way that she possibly could not have been mistaken when we know, from their testimony, that Shelley and Lovelady were outside the building when the shots were fired and did not return to the 1st floor until 12.35, just prior to the building being sealed off.

We also know that Victoria Adams re-entered the building through the main entrance at the front, after hearing a DPD radio message at 12.36. She went up the stairs to the 2nd floor, walked through the office space to the freight elevator at the back of the building and went up to the 4th floor with two police officers.

I take it that you agree that if it is physical impossible for two people to be in eyesight of eachother at a particular time, it is impossible for one of the people to have seen the other, right?

When and where exactly do you propose Adams could have seen Shelley and Lovelady inside the building?

[Dan O'meara]

Just working on a potential exit strategy for the assassin (assuming it's not Oswald). The assassin has to get from the 6th floor to an exit, presumably on the first floor. The front entrance is not an option. Adams tells us their is a police officer at the Houston Street dock exit. IMO the best option is the side-door on the west of the TSBD, the same door Shelley and Lovelady enter the building.
When Truly and Baker reach the elevators they look up to see them both on the fifth floor. By the time they reach the fifth floor the west elevator is gone. In his affidavit Jack Dougherty states he brings the elevator down from the fifth to the first and then back up again. Assuming it takes the elevator 30 seconds to get from the 5th to the 1st floor and 30 seconds to go back up again Dougherty's trip to the first floor cannot take place before Truly and Baker arrive there. I'm assuming the assassin is with Dougherty, he travels down to the first floor and leaves the building via the shipping room side-door.
The trip to the first floor must take place between Truly and Baker arriving at the elevators initially (40 to 50 seconds after the last shot) and their arrival at the fifth floor. A rough guesstimation for Truly/Baker reaching the 5th floor = 3 to 4 minutes (let's say 3.5 minutes)
Therefore the trip down takes place between 1 and 3.5 minutes after the final shot with the elevator taking 30 seconds to make the trip.
A reasonable estimate for the elevator arriving on the 1st floor would be 3 to 3.5 minutes after the final shot. This would have the assassin arriving at the side-door within seconds of Shelley and Lovelady opening the same door.
This seems to have some interesting possibilities, especially as this may well be the exit taken by the man Roger Craig sees. Still work to do perfecting the various timelines.

[Dan O'meara]

It's possible that Adams was mistaken about seeing Shelley and Lovelady but I doubt that she was. She recalled it on two separate occasions.

Although I've not read it yet I'm given to understand that in Barry Ernest's "The Girl On The Stairs" Adams categorically denies ever having made this statement and that it is a complete fabrication. She states the brief encounter was with a young African-American man. Sandra Styles denies the encounter with Shelley occurred. In his WC testimony even Shelley doesn't acknowledge it happening and Lovelady's testimony concerning this is a joke. The timelines are only confirming this reality.

[Martin Weidmann]

Although I've not read it yet I'm given to understand that in Barry Ernest's "The Girl On The Stairs" Adams categorically denies ever having made this statement and that it is a complete fabrication. She states the brief encounter was with a young African-American man. Sandra Styles denies the encounter with Shelley occurred. In his WC testimony even Shelley doesn't acknowledge it happening and Lovelady's testimony concerning this is a joke. The timelines are only confirming this reality.

All that is true, but the fact remains that in her WC testimony Adams does say she saw Shelley and Lovelady as she arrived on the 1st floor. Let's stick with that for the moment and see what Tim comes up with.

[Tim Nickerson]

Okay, can you find a way that she possibly could not have been mistaken when we know, from their testimony, that Shelley and Lovelady were outside the building when the shots were fired and did not return to the 1st floor until 12.35, just prior to the building being sealed off.

We also know that Victoria Adams re-entered the building through the main entrance at the front, after hearing a DPD radio message at 12.36. She went up the stairs to the 2nd floor, walked through the office space to the freight elevator at the back of the building and went up to the 4th floor with two police officers.

I take it that you agree that if it is physical impossible for two people to be in eyesight of eachother at a particular time, it is impossible for one of the people to have seen the other, right?

When and where exactly do you propose Adams could have seen Shelley and Lovelady inside the building?

I already agreed that it is possible that she encountered them outside the building. I say possible but it's not plausible because of the particulars that she provided during her testimony.

[Tim Nickerson]

Although I've not read it yet I'm given to understand that in Barry Ernest's "The Girl On The Stairs" Adams categorically denies ever having made this statement and that it is a complete fabrication. She states the brief encounter was with a young African-American man. Sandra Styles denies the encounter with Shelley occurred. In his WC testimony even Shelley doesn't acknowledge it happening and Lovelady's testimony concerning this is a joke. The timelines are only confirming this reality.

Sandra Styles did not rule out the encounter. She just said that she couldn't remember it.