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Author Topic: Motive  (Read 3122 times)

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Motive
« Reply #80 on: June 05, 2019, 04:22:04 PM »
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What I see here is you, assuming that I'm assuming the Warren Commission conclusions about what happened are true. John, I've studied and researched this case for almost 30 years now. Over that time I gradually came to the same final conclusion as the WC, certainly not all of it, the reports far from perfect but yes, I do agree with the final conclusion. It's been hard work, it's cost me money and many a sleepless night. Please don't patronise me by "assuming" I've ever 'assumed' anything about this case. I'll admit my assessment of the facts regarding this case may well be wrong. But if they are it's because I've misinterpreted those facts NOT because I ever assumed anything incorrectly. I've said this before John, you're far too arrogant for your own good. Stop assuming that anyone who's reached a different conclusion than yourself is a total bloody idiot!

Denis, I didn't call anybody an idiot -- least of all you.

You simply cannot ascribe a motive to Oswald without pre-assuming that he committed the crime.  Assumptions based on research and interpretation are still assumptions.  It's not an insult to call them that.

Online Bill Chapman

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Re: Motive
« Reply #81 on: June 05, 2019, 07:04:54 PM »
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Denis, I didn't call anybody an idiot -- least of all you.

You simply cannot ascribe a motive to Oswald without pre-assuming that he committed the crime.  Assumptions based on research and interpretation are still assumptions.  It's not an insult to call them that.

Denis, I didn't call anybody an idiot -- least of all you.
>>> Yeah, you prefer 'lemmings'

You simply cannot ascribe a motive to Oswald without pre-assuming that he committed the crime.
>>> Since when are suspects in a criminal investigation exempt from the 'Motive' check box?
« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 07:37:13 PM by Bill Chapman »

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Re: Motive
« Reply #81 on: June 05, 2019, 07:04:54 PM »

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Motive
« Reply #82 on: June 05, 2019, 09:24:46 PM »
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Denis, I didn't call anybody an idiot -- least of all you.
>>> Yeah, you prefer 'lemmings'

Denis is no lemming.  That's reserved for people like you who only parrot the WC and Bugliosi like they are some kind of gospel.

Probably.


« Last Edit: June 18, 2019, 11:56:38 PM by John Iacoletti »

Online Bill Chapman

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Re: Motive
« Reply #83 on: June 06, 2019, 09:33:14 AM »
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Denis, I didn't call anybody an idiot -- least of all you.

>>> Yeah, you prefer 'lemmings'

Denis is no lemming.  That's reserved for people like you who only parrot the WC and Bugliosi like they are some kind of gospel.

Probably.

OMG. Now I'm a parrot, alongside a lemming and a sheep. No biggee, though.. I can play my now-continuing role of a lemming by dint of simply flying off any given cliff with my brand-spanking new parrot's wings.

Can't remember the last time I mentioned Bug... catch me up.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2019, 09:37:06 AM by Bill Chapman »

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Re: Motive
« Reply #83 on: June 06, 2019, 09:33:14 AM »

Online Bill Chapman

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Re: Motive
« Reply #84 on: June 10, 2019, 09:57:17 AM »
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You owe me an apology too, over Chapman
I have not seen the great Rob Caprio  on in a while, maybe you caused him to leave due to your bigoted mouth, you talk about rudeness and nastiness when you are one of the biggest culprits, licking the yanks asses hoping to get a visa out of it.

Duncan is not keeping a tight ship on here, in spite of John Mytton thinking he is , he comes across as taking sides in some instances and ignores quite a bit of this behavior

Caprio broke forum rules and was suspended.

Duncan is more than fair in letting people get away with stuff that is officially a 'no-no' here; in effect leaving it up to individuals to lodge complaints.

In a way he indeed doesn't run a tight ship here... it's more a case of him giving people enough rope to hang themselves.
 ;)


Online Charles Collins

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Re: Motive
« Reply #85 on: June 15, 2019, 01:59:29 AM »
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What Oswald was trying to sum up, was about the special relationship, and how it caused society in America to be so cruel, because it was so aligned to British imperialism which had kept a massive foothold in America in spite of losing the war there, and Oswald wanted to stand up against it.


J.F.K stood to ruin this special relationship as well, because he had more allegiance to the Republic of Ireland than he did to royal Britain, so Oswald had no motive, to kill him as Kennedy was standing up against the U.S society from being British influenced, through bringing about good civil rights/foreign policies, and this suited Oswald as Marina said Lee liked Kennedy.

But those trying to protect the special relationship had the most motive and they were willing to kill the President to keep it.
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The Special Relationship was perhaps tested the most severely by the Skybolt crisis of 1962, when Kennedy cancelled a joint project without consultation. Skybolt was a nuclear air-to-ground missile that could penetrate Soviet airspace and would extend the life of Britain's deterrent, which consisted only of free-falling hydrogen bombs. London saw cancellation as a reduction in the British nuclear deterrent. The crisis was resolved during a series of compromises that led to the Royal Navy purchasing the American UGM-27 Polaris missile and construction of the Resolution-class submarines to launch them.[74][75][76][77] The debates over Skybolt were top secret, but tensions were exacerbated when Dean Acheson, a former Secretary of State, challenged publicly the Special Relationship and marginalised the British contribution to the Western alliance. Acheson said



I do remember a lot of paranoia concerning the nuclear threat. Backyard bomb shelters and such. The final scene of the movie “Dr Strangelove” with Slim Pickens riding on the falling bomb was pretty scary to my younger cousin.

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Re: Motive
« Reply #85 on: June 15, 2019, 01:59:29 AM »

Online Allan Fritzke

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Re: Motive
« Reply #86 on: June 15, 2019, 06:12:26 AM »
When considering motive, it must be considered where LHO received his financing from over the years.  He made a trip to Russia and Mexico.  The first trip paid for by saving money during the time of service as a US marine.   There is no account of how he convinced the Russians to give him a factory worker job in Minsk and how he was able to live comfortably there and be repatriated later, especially after serving in the US Marine Corp.   

Conveniently this dead man's tax records or bank accounts? are left hidden so you are unable to determine who was paying him for sure when he returned to his life in the US.  His W-2s should have been proof for all the various jobs he held after coming back.   Did he not pay taxes and have wages withheld by his employers?   That proof has never been provided.   He seemingly could never hold a job until he got the TSBD job where his boss Truly said he was "an above average employee"!  Those short employments would have created tax liabilities and records which any sane investigator would have investigated.

The records such as his W-2s would prove/disprove who was bankrolling him on his endeavors.   It is possible he kept all his money "in his pillow" but if he had a repatriation loan when he moved from Russia to the US for $435.71 on June 1, 1962, how did he pay it back or did it remain outstanding?  This record may not have clarified whether or not he was on the CIA's "non-taxable" payroll but it certainly would have been looked at to confirm W-2s and tax records from his various places of employment to verify the accuracy of the statements made by his employers.

Furthermore, this US Marine achieved a 191 score as "marksman" in 1959 but yet failed to hit his stationary target Edwin Walker at 100 feet - so the story goes ,unconfirmed but presumed!   This same gun was "assumed" to be the one to kill JFK, his shooting ability much improved by this time, able to land at least 2 shots from a bolt action rifle on a moving target in a few seconds at a much greater distance!   

If his IQ was fairly low, he may have been convinced by his handlers to go along with the charade.    Some people are gullible and can be led down a garden path, told they are the greatest double agents on the earth and follow orders in a spy/espionage game where they think themselves heroes and great patriots.  Unbeknownst to them, they then find themselves tied into the plot and framed to become the patsy.   Then it is too late to end the game and they are the pawn.   Take out the pawn and the story never has to be revealed, case closed!
« Last Edit: June 15, 2019, 06:16:33 AM by Allan Fritzke »

Online Richard Smith

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Re: Motive
« Reply #87 on: June 15, 2019, 06:21:49 PM »
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When considering motive, it must be considered where LHO received his financing from over the years.  He made a trip to Russia and Mexico.  The first trip paid for by saving money during the time of service as a US marine.   There is no account of how he convinced the Russians to give him a factory worker job in Minsk and how he was able to live comfortably there and be repatriated later, especially after serving in the US Marine Corp.   

Conveniently this dead man's tax records or bank accounts? are left hidden so you are unable to determine who was paying him for sure when he returned to his life in the US.  His W-2s should have been proof for all the various jobs he held after coming back.   Did he not pay taxes and have wages withheld by his employers?   That proof has never been provided.   He seemingly could never hold a job until he got the TSBD job where his boss Truly said he was "an above average employee"!  Those short employments would have created tax liabilities and records which any sane investigator would have investigated.

The records such as his W-2s would prove/disprove who was bankrolling him on his endeavors.   It is possible he kept all his money "in his pillow" but if he had a repatriation loan when he moved from Russia to the US for $435.71 on June 1, 1962, how did he pay it back or did it remain outstanding?  This record may not have clarified whether or not he was on the CIA's "non-taxable" payroll but it certainly would have been looked at to confirm W-2s and tax records from his various places of employment to verify the accuracy of the statements made by his employers.

Furthermore, this US Marine achieved a 191 score as "marksman" in 1959 but yet failed to hit his stationary target Edwin Walker at 100 feet - so the story goes ,unconfirmed but presumed!   This same gun was "assumed" to be the one to kill JFK, his shooting ability much improved by this time, able to land at least 2 shots from a bolt action rifle on a moving target in a few seconds at a much greater distance!   

If his IQ was fairly low, he may have been convinced by his handlers to go along with the charade.    Some people are gullible and can be led down a garden path, told they are the greatest double agents on the earth and follow orders in a spy/espionage game where they think themselves heroes and great patriots.  Unbeknownst to them, they then find themselves tied into the plot and framed to become the patsy.   Then it is too late to end the game and they are the pawn.   Take out the pawn and the story never has to be revealed, case closed!

There is a full and complete accounting of Oswald's finances and how he got his job in Russia.  Do you really believe that if Oswald was on someone's payroll to assassinate the president that this income would be reflected on his W-2s?  Whew.  Oswald only failed to hit Walker because his bullet deflected off of a window frame.  Oswald was trained to shoot a rifle in the USMC.

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Re: Motive
« Reply #87 on: June 15, 2019, 06:21:49 PM »

Online Bill Chapman

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Re: Motive
« Reply #88 on: June 15, 2019, 07:13:57 PM »
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I do remember a lot of paranoia concerning the nuclear threat. Backyard bomb shelters and such. The final scene of the movie “Dr Strangelove” with Slim Pickens riding on the falling bomb was pretty scary to my younger cousin.


Online Charles Collins

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Re: Motive
« Reply #89 on: June 15, 2019, 08:08:04 PM »
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Yes, we were both accustomed to the typical happy endings of movies geared toward kids. And we had no idea what kind of movie we were going to see. Only that the title was intriguing. So that ending came as quite a shock!

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Re: Motive
« Reply #89 on: June 15, 2019, 08:08:04 PM »

 

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