My memory is pretty good, folks. I remembered this thread started by Duncan at the Ed Forum in 2015: "Prayer Man is a Woman," https://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/22243-prayer-man-is-a-woman/#comment-314580. In retrospect, rather prescient. The howls of protest, especially from Robert Prudhomme, are still echoing. In an interesting sidelight, Jimbo pressed Duncan to reveal who John Mytton really is! (In the ultimate insult - to John, not me - shortly after I joined here it was suggested that this Lance punk is in fact a sock puppet of JM's.)
Prayer Man is not a scam, not by a longshot.
Prayer Man cannot be Sarah Stanton, because the Large-Framed Figure standing on Buell Wesley Frazier's left is Sarah Stanton. Frazier himself said Stanton was standing on his left. Pauline Sanders also said Sarah Stanton was standing on Frazier's left. The figure on Frazier's right is Prayer Man.
Greg Doudna and Andre Stancak, two very careful researchers, have examined this issue in great detail. I first quote from some of Doudna's research on the subject:
It is astonishing to me that I do not see prior proposals that Large-Framed Figure (LFF) to Frazier's immediate left, in the Darnell film, is Sarah Stanton. The width of LFF's body frame corresponds to Sarah Stanton's obesity. The height of LFF at 5'6" (hair included) agrees with Sarah Stanton's height. And LFF is in exactly the position that Buell Wesley Frazier said Sarah Stanton was, and Pauline Sanders said Sarah Stanton was, to Frazier's left as Frazier explicitly said (not to his right where Prayer Man was)--no, LFF is exactly where Frazier located Sarah Stanton to his immediate left, with whom Frazier exchanged words back and forth as she stood next to him. Large-Framed Figure is exactly a match to Sarah Stanton. . . .
It is usually assumed that the Prayer Man photograph in Wiegman was taken a few seconds before the fatal head shot of JFK of Z312. While that may be correct, it is possible that photograph was taken an unknown number of seconds after the shots were fired, according to a technical analysis of Stancak although Stancak does not draw a post-Z312 Wiegman conclusion directly. Stancak presents an argument that there was frames removal of some sort in the Zapruder film on the basis of comparison with two checkpoints in Wiegman, and discrepancies between Altgens6 and a conventional assumption of match to the time of a frame in Wiegman. . . .
The reason this might matter is, on the one hand, Oswald said in his interrogations that he had gone to the second floor to get a coke with his lunch before the assassination, then (following that) he went out front "to watch the P. Parade" (Hosty notes) or "out with Bill Shelley in front" (Fritz notes). . . .
For according to Sarah Stanton's family, Sarah Stanton met Oswald on "the stairs", where she had "went down" from the second floor, to see the President "on the stairs".
Rosa: "That, uh--she [Sarah] said, 'I went down because they said that, uh, the--that the President was going--they were already coming, but not--not there yet.' So she wanted to prepare herself and be on the stairs--where--where she met Oswald". . . .
It is probably not correct to claim that "no one" saw Oswald out at those front steps. I have just cited two arguably credible claims from TSBD employees who said they did (in Sarah Stanton's case as remembered by her family, interpreting "stairs" as changed in the telling from Sarah Stanton's meaning of the TSBD's front steps).
Neither of these two women, Carolyn Arnold or Sarah Stanton, were called to testify by the Warren Commission.
If Oswald was "in front" (Fritz notes) and "outside to watch P. Parade" (Hosty notes) after eating his lunch on the first floor, not only might those two women have told of seeing him there, but it might even have been captured on camera. It would be surprising if it were not captured on camera.
This makes Bart Kamp's website and book Prayer Man: More than a Fuzzy Picture one of the most important issues in any current discussion of the JFK assassination (because if Oswald was Prayer Man, he did not assassinate President Kennedy, and that would be, to put it mildly, a game-changer, an Innocence Project genre outcome for the ages). (https://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/29481-prayer-man-more-than-a-fuzzy-picture/page/17/#findComment-515283
Stancak's research can be found here:
https://thejfktruthmatters.wordpress.com//?s=oswald&search=Go
Here's an excerpt from his analysis:
Prayer Man in the full view shows two important features that shed light on his identity. In Figure 3 the yellow contour along the PrayerMan’s left face highlight his hairline. Prayer Man’s hairline shows a recess on the downward course of the hairline. Figure 3 also shows Lee Oswald’s hairline in a photograph taken during the time when he was in the custody of Dallas Police. The similarity of Prayer Man’s hairline and Lee Oswald’s hairline is uncanny and strongly supports the possibility that Prayer Man was Lee Harvey Oswald.
Another distinguishing feature on Prayer Man’s head was an oblique line running from the left eyebrow toward the hairline recession (Figure 4). The shape of this line-like feature on Prayer Man’s left temple was compared with photographs of Lee Oswald taken while he was in the custody of the Dallas Police, as well as with photos taken prior to President Kennedy’s assassination. This comparison showed that Lee Oswald had prominent forehead veins on both the left and right forehead-temple areas, with a vein pattern similar to the line-like feature on Prayer Man’s left forehead and temple.
I stress that these quotes are only a small portion of Doudna's and Stancak's research on Prayer Man. I encourage interested readers to read their analyses.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Paulina_Luna
......
Luna was subsequently elected to the U.S. House of Representatives in 2022, with the endorsement of then-former president Donald Trump in the Republican primary. Luna was re-elected in 2024.
Luna serves on the House Committee on Foreign Affairs, and the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform. During her congressional tenure, Luna has maintained a conservative voting record of 98%, according to Heritage Action.[2]
I have a better image but I can't seem to work the image feature...
Doudna learned a lot of what he knows from myself without crediting me...He enjoys the benefit of appearing as if the material originates from himself because of my being censored and unable to comment in all the places where it is posted...The Altgens 6 frame shows the people across the top platform of the front steps fairly clearly...From left to right they are Lovelady, Sanders, Shelley, and Molina...The first frames of Wiegman were taken at about the same time as Altgens 6 from a 90 degree perspective to Altgens 6...This stereoscopic cross perspective enables a view of the areas between the people on the top platform...The first frames of Wiegman show nothing but empty space between Lovelady and Frazier at the time of Altgens 6...This proves that the Dutch promoter's claim that Stanton is to Frazier's left is wrong...If Stanton were to Frazier's left you would see her there in either Altgens or Wiegman...
Pat Speer claimed that I stole my claim that Prayer Man was a woman from him...Anyone who reads my stuff knows that is preposterous, as Richard Gilbride can attest...Speer gloated when I was segregated...
The original animated Gif.
(https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/Enhancedchris.gif)
(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjxQhBRDWWHOu4wCmKhUtFx5cd2fPvfkxm2k8RLeVglIvJWvUlFIX-gwWGetfmQjjffKO0hX-o7T5266uZaqwmCtopHJp8vi4Al2ypQ-nrTfA9rc0EPW3kW3KSOVT4g2lFeib-4ErBoKZ4vXDpUerHPFyIBCH_nrEtRbMD-dLXGn0Tk4wJbfZnmVCGlkmE/s6000/TSBD-Front-Steps-11-22-63.gif)
http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/Prayer (Wo)Man Discussions (https://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2015/09/jfk-assassination-arguments-part-1031.html)
The above clearly shows Lovelady still standing on the TSBD Steps as Officer Baker runs across the Elm St Extension. So exactly WHERE did those "2 Guys" walking alongside the car and down the Elm St Extension come from? They came from inside the car. There is no other place they could have come from in that scant amount of time following the kill shot.
"Clearly" my you-know-what.
(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjxQhBRDWWHOu4wCmKhUtFx5cd2fPvfkxm2k8RLeVglIvJWvUlFIX-gwWGetfmQjjffKO0hX-o7T5266uZaqwmCtopHJp8vi4Al2ypQ-nrTfA9rc0EPW3kW3KSOVT4g2lFeib-4ErBoKZ4vXDpUerHPFyIBCH_nrEtRbMD-dLXGn0Tk4wJbfZnmVCGlkmE/s6000/TSBD-Front-Steps-11-22-63.gif)
Even you are now doubting the "two guys" being Shelley/Lovelady. This is progress.
Dear Storm Trooper Storing,
I guess reading comprehension isn't your forte.
You posted:
"[The Darnell clip] clearly shows Lovelady still standing on the TSBD Steps as Officer Baker runs across the Elm Street Extension."
I replied:
"'Clearly,' my you-know-what."
-- Tom
Yes, I understood your post above. It is difficult for you to openly admit, but you are now considering who those two guys might have been.
Dear Storm Trooper Storing,
That's a suggestion I refuse to accept.
-- Tom
You're now painfully in denial. It takes time to remove the scales from your eyes. But it is currently happening.
I cannot navigate the image posting for some reason...
I would also have to cast a vote for the Kelley, Murphy thread that ended up being about Prayer Man.
That discussion ended up being a milestone in the history of this forum. And it was a long one.
It really altered some perspectives. To think that the early researchers spent all that time on Lovelady and ignored PM.
I eventually found someone who tried to get to Garrison about this. Bart Kamp mentions him on his encyclopedic site. But that was about it for the early research on this issue.
Can't figure out how to produce a URL from the images in my "Photos" file...
The issue of Prayer Man is one of those issues that does not lend itself to being resolved in a few replies in a debate forum thread. To gain a sufficient understanding of the issue, you need to take the time to read the extensive research that has been done on it, and then make up your own mind. Below I provide numerous links to much of this research.
Anyone who is genuinely interested in the issue of Prayer Man should first consider the impressive evidence that Oswald was not on the sixth floor during the shooting. This evidence does not prove that Prayer Man is Oswald, but it does show this is a possibility, not to mention the obvious fact that it proves Oswald did not fire shots from the sixth-floor window.
Why would anyone be "genuinely interested in the issue of Prayer Man". When he CTs obsess over something this inane, we know the carcass of the JFKA conspiracy "research" has been picked clean to the bone. There's obviously nothing important left that is worth talking about.
Rod Stewart had a hit song titled "Reason to Believe". CTs should have an anthem titled Reason to Disbelieve. They seem to have no interest in figuring out who was responsible of the JFKA . Their whole focus seems to be on coming up with reasons not to believe the WCR. That's why we have so many inanities like Prayer Man, One Glove Cop, Huge Gates, etc. They search High and low for things for which there is no apparent explanation and to them, that is reason enough to dismiss the WC finding that Oswald fired the shots that killed JFK and that there was no credible evidence he had even a single accomplice. It's like they're panning for gold and they get really excited when they find one shiny little yellow flake, not realizing it is fool's gold.
(https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=3149195215264071&set=p.3149195215264071)
The Davidson Enhancement of the clearest Wiegman frame came out in 2016 and should have ended the issue for anyone daring to sell himself as a Kennedy Assassination researcher worth listening to...The face was obviously female and therefore not Oswald...Once I managed to get Sarah Stanton's family photo showing her obesity the chubby-ness of the face in Davidson was obviously that of Stanton - not to mention the height that matched the 5 foot 4 Stanton was according to her grand daughter Wanda...Stanton can be seen looking down in to her purse (which appears as a black shape) in the Davidson Enhancement...That purse was recognized by her grand daughter Wanda who sent me a family photo of the purse she thought it was...This wasn't good enough for the Prayer Man people however who brought technical examination "expert" Andrej Stancak in to create made to order excuses for all this damning evidence...The Prayer Man people simply honored these rubbish claims by Stancak and ignored my undeniable proof...I was then shown the door and followed-through with destruction as a researcher...They don't stop at just banning...They come after you with personal destruction and intentional ignoring of your evidence...The Prayer Man world they created through ignoring and censorship is the same one DiEugenio deludes himself with in his quotes above...Knowing they were in trouble the Prayer Man group quickly formed the original films request strawman and stuck to it and nothing else...If they called for the originals they could avoid admitting to themselves that they had been out-argued on the already-available evidence...
This is the guy who Bart surfaced who first sent his work to Garrison. RIchard Bernabei.
Bernabei, a skilled sketch artist, was the first to really discern the PM figure and be able to illustrate his observations with distinction. He called the figure “Man in the Shadow”. Kamp is to be congratulated for giving Bernabei—who died in 1979-- the recognition he belatedly deserved.
For decades Bernabei’s writings and sketches lay like lost gems in a treasure chest at the bottom of the sea. In reality they were at Queen’s University archive. But they were bereft because the subject did not really resurface until the new millennium and the online revolution.
I do Not believe Prayer Man is Oswald. That said, all of us can only gain knowledge with the release of early generation copies of the Original JFK Assassination Films. Why for 62+ years running are the Networks NOT releasing their Original Copies and Not granting permission for early generation copies to be released publicly? I am still waiting for the Sixth Floor Museum to release the 2nd half of the Darnell Film. That 2nd half of the Darnell Film will give us a very good look at: (1) The Train Yard, (2) The Passenger Train Cars, (3) The Bogus DPD Motorcycle Cop, and (4) The Elm St Extension. The current images of these areas of interest are scant and poor.
I do Not believe Prayer Man is Oswald. That said, all of us can only gain knowledge with the release of early generation copies of the Original JFK Assassination Films.
The networks have probably figured out that the JFKA is a dead issue among most Americans and the few people who think it is still worth researching are on a snipe hunt. Everything there is to know about the JFKA that is knowable is out there. If people can't figure out what happened with the body of knowledge we have now, they will never figure it out. There is no metaphoric smoking gun hidden away that will give the CTs the answer they have pursued for 62 futile years.
There will always be a few unknown items that will forever remain unknowable, the biggest being Oswald's motive. Other than these few unknowns, nothing new is going to suddenly pop up. No one reading this forum is going to learn something about the JFKA that isn't already known by many of others. The body of knowledge is what it is. It isn't going to grow. If you think there is more to it, you will continue to be frustrated until the day you die, as other JFKA junkies were who went before us.
Have a nice day.
In 2018 I exchanged e-mails with Oliver Stone's technical producer Rob Wilson...He instructed me that the Wiegman and Darnell films that NBC currently licenses were originally made off the film originals...That the original Wiegman and Darnell films were scanned with the best scanning technology available at the time and the current digital files of the films that are available for licensing were made off of them...
When I passed this information forward during the Task Force it was totally ignored and no action was taken on it...This was information that could have led to the originals being located but all the main people involved in the Task Force had no interest in it what so ever...The reason for that is because, although they praise themselves as practicing the highest research practices and free speech philosophy, the research community is actually a dirty little clique of bullies that enforce protection of the clique through freeze-outs and intentional ignoring...Once they get their dirty banning it is collectively followed-through to the kill by destroying you and ignoring everything that comes from you...Even if it solves the conspiracy...Wilson could have contacted NBC and gotten the names of the people involved in the original scanning...They could have been contacted and the location of the original films could have been traced...This wasn't done because the favored members over on The Education Forum have exclusivity as their main agenda...They really don't practice what they preach...They get much more with less effort out of cheating and the moderators know it...These are the same people who are telling Luna not to obtain the 6th Floor Museum's 1st generation copy...
"Kamp is outright lying when he said Stanton and Frazier both located Stanton to Frazier's left" ...(https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/scratch.gif)
(https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/scratch.gif)Oswald's Friend Buell Frazier Gestures That Sarah Stanton Was Standing To His Left
Is she visible in the Darnell or Wiegman clips?Probably :)
Why does anybody care who Prayer Man was. Do we need to identify every spectator in Dealey Plaza to figure out who shot JFK?
Kamp knows that when Frazier said Stanton was to his left he was talking about when she first came out on to the front steps...Yes Stanton was to Frazier's left for what was probably the majority of the time she was out there, however my post made clear that the only thing that matters is where Stanton was during the time of the Prayer Man photography...Kamp is not honest, and Gardner & Frame are not competent interviewers, because they do not admit, or bring to Kamp's attention, that both Lovelady and Frazier put Stanton in the Prayer Man spot in their statements...Kamp is deliberately trying to mislead - which is the same as lying...Again, if I were allowed the fair air time I have earned in a debate with Kamp he would not get away with that with me as a fellow podcast guest...Lovelady made more than clear that Stanton was in the Prayer Man spot at the time the limousine passed by the front steps (Hughes and Wiegman)...Kamp is fishing for confirmation and hoping to deceive the public with a deliberately out of context quote and he is being assisted by delinquent podcast hosts (like usual)...Frazier said that after Calvery told them the president has been shot that he and Stanton were "staring at each other in shock for the longest time"...That time period Frazier is referencing is the exact time period shown in Couch/Darnell and it negates the false reference Kamp makes of Frazier saying Stanton was to his left...Kamp tries to ignore the other layer upon layers of confirming evidence that makes Stanton Prayer Man like her height, elbow-length sleeves, and dress neckline...Like the fact she said she could not see the limousine at the time of the shots (Prayer Man cannot see the limousine because of the west wall of the portal)...Nor can Kamp show us Stanton to Frazier's left in the clear Altgens 6 frame in stereoscopic juxtaposition to the first Wiegman frames...If Stanton was to Frazier's left in the photography in question we would see her there in Altgens and Wiegman...Frazier said Stanton was in the deepest part of the shadows on the front steps...The deepest part of the shadows is exactly where Prayer Man is standing...These are the operative evidence points and Kamp has failed to answer them...
The Prayer Man people are avoiding obtaining the original film copy of the Hughes Film because High Tech enhancement like that done by Chris Davidson will most-likely bring out the obese body of Sarah Stanton exactly in the Prayer Man spot...The research world has been hijacked by the Prayer Man people and they are dishonestly directing what evidence is pursued and what is not...These are people who accept the Cinque-like claim that the dress neckline in the 1st generation copy of Darnell is a CIA forgery...
Kamp is lying when he libels in public that I do not show any evidence...
What documentation is there that the Prayer Man Spot, "....cannot see the limousine because of the west wall of the portal"? That landing is now deeper than it was on 11/22/63
Plain as day in Altgens 6...It is not even a question...
It makes Prayer Man Stanton...
Period...
Anyone who looks at the Altgens 6 blow-up can see that the west wall of the portal blocks Prayer Man's line of sight of the limousine...
What you are saying goes against what the photography you called for clearly shows...
I also believe that the best digital tech enhancements of the Hughes Film will show Stanton right up behind Lovelady in the Prayer Man spot he put her in his statement...
This pic is from five years ago when I visited Dealey Plaza. Not the best vantage point to watch the parade.
(https://i.postimg.cc/R0TRV74y/prayerman.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/cKrYF8KB)
The point stands that the line of sight from the Prayer Man position to the limousine is blocked by the west wall of the portal...This is evidence that Prayer Man is Stanton since she said she couldn't see the limousine at the time of the shots...
Frazier saying Stanton was deepest in to the shadows on the front steps...
Stanton not being seen to Frazier's left in Altgens 6 and the first frames of Wiegman...
The Hughes Film showing Stanton up behind Lovelady in the Prayer Man spot...
Stanton in Owens matching Prayer Man's height...
The Davidson Enhancement showing Stanton's chubby face on Prayer Man in Wiegman...
And the 6th Floor Museum's 1st generation copy of Darnell showing a dress neckline on Prayer Man all pretty much cinch it...
Minute mark 40:52 -
Frazier ends the issue...
Totally ignored by the Prayer Man cheaters...
When Frazier remembers talking to Stanton after Calvery shouted they have shot the president he shifts his body language and eyes to his right...
I called the clerk at the Culpepper, Virginia National Audio Visual Preservation Center and he told me they only handle NBC's entertainment films...He told me the Wiegman and Darnell films were News so they would be stored at the Bergen, New Jersey NBC warehouse...
Schnapf already did the foot work on this and they told him the films weren't there...However I suspect whoever looked for the films went to the storage shelf for those films, didn't see them, and simply told Schnapf or Luna that they didn't have the films...
Oliver Stone's technical producer Rob Wilson told me the current digital files of the Wiegman and Darnell Films in NBC's possession were scanned off the original films when they made the digital files...What that means is someone at NBC handled the original films when they made those digital files...Those people are probably on record and probably could be contacted to ask them about the location of those original films...Those employees would have much more direct knowledge of the films since they were the last to handle them...Even though this is the best information in obtaining the films, because it originates from me the banning/ignoring savages are making sure that it gets ignored and no action is taken on it...Rob Wilson has the clout through Stone to probably get some action out of NBC in approaching them for the names of the digital file-makers...It is gross malfeasance and incompetence to NOT do so...
Nobody sits on anything for 62+ yrs just because they can. There's a reason.
In my pursuit of debunking the Greg Parker-originating Prayer Man theory I discovered, with Richard Gilbride, that one of the Prayer Man films was freely available at the Brooklyn Library in the 1970's...Also, Southern Methodist University film professor G William Jones managed to make a 1st generation film to film copy of Darnell that is now currently available at the 6th Floor Museum and, I am certain, would be sent by said institution to the Luna Task Force if requested...So the Prayer Man films were not tightly held in the past...The main bottleneck is the Prayer Man hijackers who have managed to channel everything through themselves and the crooked Mary Ferrell managers who work with them...
If we look at The Education Forum and JFK podcast community, they are very much trying to ignore the progress of the correct evidence on Prayer Man and are consciously using intentional censorship and persecution to avoid admitting the correct evidence...They are using banning (and false reasons for banning) to avoid allowing any discussion that practices the implied "debate" The Education Forum encourages...Any correct evidence that demands a response is met with shunning, ignoring, and silence - all achieved by the cowardly device of blocking/banning and organized group dishonesty...Although they claim to practice the highest level of academic discussion they have a mob that they turn you over to when you out-argue them on the evidence...Even when the main gate-keeper offending moderator is removed the Prayer Man gang and its proxies still maintain that censorship...
Because the proprietary copyrights still lay with NBC...
The real question here is why would a research community that is pretending to seek the best copies intentionally avoid the 6th Floor Museum copy when it is the best extant copy that has already proved its worth by showing the dress neckline?...And why are we not allowed to ask this question on The Education Forum?...
Do you know if NBC has validated the Darnell Film copy that the Sixth Floor Museum currently has? At this point, "Prof G. William Jones" claims to have made a Darnell Film "1st generation film-to-film copy" and the Sixth Floor Museum currently has that "1st generation film-to-film copy". One man's "word" regarding the bona fides of this Darnell Film copy inside the Sixth Floor Museum is simply Not sufficient.
Gary Mack knew about the film and said it was a 1st generation copy...
If we went by your standard of evidence nothing could ever be proven to be valid and we could just quit because no evidence would ever be good enough...
The layers of supporting evidence tells you there was no manipulation of Sarah Stanton's features, nor would there be any reason to alter Stanton's clothing...The neckline is clearer because it is a film to film copy...
Again - the fact that other objects in the 6th Floor Museum copy improve in clarity means that the neckline is valid because CIA is not going to sharpen other objects in that copy because there would be no reason to...
One of the biggest things the Prayer Man people exploit is the fact the actual people involved are dead and can't refute their ridiculous gratuitous doubt...
OK, so let's go at this another way. How did Prof G. Wiliam Jones "manage" to make a, "1st generation film-to-film copy of Darnell"?
And the say-so of Gary Mack carries absolutely no weight. He was Wrong on: (1) Badge Man, (2) The McKinnon/Mumford ID, and (3) The Acoustic Evidence.
Professor Jones probably made his copy in the 1970's when it was easier to simply approach NBC and order a copy...At the time Jones made his copy the technology was film to film copying...We know Jones made his copy film to film because the 6th Floor Museum copy is probably a celluloid copy...But most importantly we know Jones made his copy film to film because that was the only way the features could get sharper in the actual images...In short, what we see from the 6th Floor Museum copy with its better detail is proof in itself that the copy is film to film...One thing we know for certain is that the Prayer Man people will never look in to any of this because they are dishonest and they avoid pursuing anything they know will disprove them...
Mack was there and he probably talked to Jones about his copy...Or saw it in person...Again, the Prayer Man people will do no inquiry or seeking on this because they are trying to avoid admitting that the Jones collection copy is 1st generation and therefore possesses technical reasons why the dress neckline is real and therefore refutes the bogus Greg Parker Prayer Man theory...They could approach Jones' son but won't...
The images being clearer/sharper on the Darnell Film currently held by the Sixth Floor Museum proves nothing.
The time that Jones made the copy was at a time when the only copies were film to film...Jones was a film professor...He would only make a film to film copy because he was aware that would create the best copy...Video transfer was primitive back then and you would see a video copy right away...In other words, it had to be film to film and the 6th Floor Museum might have the Jones copy in their possession...
You can't explain what other method Jones would have used in the 1970's to produce the clearer copy he had in his collection...
The dress neckline is a real and accurate image of Prayer Man's clothing...Unless, of course, you believe Larsen's Cinque-like CIA forgery claim...The Education Forum pretends to have very high standards, however they don't seem to mind Larsen's obvious excuse-making lie...
We have yet to see Chris Davidson's digital enhancement process applied to the original Hughes Film to bring out Stanton up behind Lovelady in the Prayer Man spot...This is prevented with the disingenuous strawman of calling for the original Prayer Man films...
Gary Mack was doing camera work for a local Dallas TV station in the early 1990's when Jones was still alive...Mack's professional expertise was film when he would have gotten knowledge of Jones' copy...Mack had to have a reason for saying it was film to film...
In The Education Forum's re-organization Moderator Mark Knight is in the process of figuring out how all the moderators who banned the guy with correct evidence on Prayer Man are going to deal with the re-organization of the site...And no, it isn't a clique of friends that is being left to judge its own wrongdoing...It is a serious group making serious decisions...
The provenance of the Jones copy is easily researchable...
Jones died in 1993...This news story about the 6th Floor Museum getting his films was from 1998:
Google: "NBC 5's JFK footage to go to Sixth Floor Museum" for the news video on the 6th Floor Museum getting the films...
The only way the features in the 6th Floor Museum copy would be sharper is if it was a 1st generation copy...
The Jones Collection started in 1970 and I assume that was a date where only film to film copies were available...And Jones may have gotten the Darnell Film copy before that...
If you read the "News About The Darnell Film" thread by Roger Odisio on the Education Forum you will see the information about the 6th Floor Museum copy of Darnell...In that thread Pat Speer maligns me and says I was a serial insulter whose posts were full of anger and vitriol...Pat is a dirty player who is intentionally sucking up to James Gordon with that slander for the purpose of not allowing my evidence and for keeping the clique intact...What Speer is really doing is dog whistling to make sure my evidence is never shown on the board that proved I was correct...Vinny Palamara was kind enough to post a request that I be allowed to defend my own work on the forum but that request was denied...The Education Forum prefers to duct tape someone's mouth shut and tie their hands behind their back and only allow one side to post - even if the person being censored was correct...People are best slandered and their evidence ignored when they are censored and can't defend themselves...Even though you could plainly see the female dress neckline in the clips posted by Ulrik the issue was decided by Sandy Larsen who had the last word and said the neckline was a CIA forgery...
"The Darnell Film At The 6th Floor Museum" thread on Bart Kamp's Prayer Man site is informational - however be aware that Kamp's website is fatally biased and excludes information about Prayer Man being Stanton...There is a link on that page showing the history of the film...
Asking posters to document commonly understood things is an obstruction tactic that is used to wear down the opponent...We can safely assume that Jones' copy was a 1st generation film to film copy from all that is known about it...If we lack information on the film's provenance it is directly due to the Prayer Man people willfully avoiding any investigation of that information...I direct people to The Education Forum thread for a good example of organized dishonesty and evasion of evidence under the color of academic discussion...As if a clear image of Sarah Stanton's dress neckline on Prayer Man wasn't good enough...Oh, was I showing "anger and vitriol" there?...
I disagree and the first effort to trace and investigate the 6th Floor Museum 1st generation copy of Darnell will prove it to be a 1st generation film to film copy that shows Sarah Stanton's dress neckline on Prayer Man and ends the issue...The only reason this hasn't happened is because the Prayer Man people dishonestly don't want to be the people who disprove their own theory...The main means this is achieved by is Mark Knight lying and saying I have committed horrible offenses that prohibit me from being allowed Education Forum membership...Knight is lying and is abusing his moderator power in order to protect the clique...These people already proved their worth by placing someone who nearly scuttled the forum, by means of his own lack of respect for the Forum, in total control...It is amazing the things you can come up with when you are in charge of judging your own doings...Mark Knight oversaw Stanton's face being clearly shown on Prayer Man in the Davidson Enhancement and reacted by banning the person who presented the correct evidence and siding with those who brought a false theory before Congress...The membership was fine with that disgraceful desecration of good research and traded integrity for posting space...Good research for lies and corruption...
There's something seriously wrong with a research community that sees the neckline emerge organically from the evidence and responds to it with forgery lies and censorship...
Again, by rational logic, the only thing that could result in such a sharper copy at the time Jones obtained his copy would be a 1st generation film to film copy...Doubting this is just taking advantage of time in order for the original individuals to not be able to explain their evidence...The entire Greg Parker BS Prayer Man theory is just a taking advantage of time in order to wait for the people who could tell Kamp he's full of it to die off and not be available...The main thrust of the BS Prayer Man theory is not evidence...It is blocking and banning...
My Prayer Man postings were THE biggest threat to The Education Forum's pet theory...Every post I made was responded to with a barrage of protesting responses...Moderator Gordon rode my back on every post making up false rules and false complaints in order to remove my evidence from the board...I haven't seen any member on that board subjected to such scrutiny ever since...My evidence was such a threat to that board that I was banned for life with a special administrative watch put out for me...Enforced silence...When the progress of the evidence 100% came in in my favor it was dishonestly ignored...
Prior to the Luna Task Force I sent e-mails to Morley warning him about the Prayer Man theory...Morley had the sense to heed my warnings and my input resulted in Morley's disclaimer of the Prayer Man theory in front of the United States Congress...Speer reduces this to "anger and vitriol"...
If you view the "Ciphered Past" video with Bart Kamp you will see I am very much on the mind of the main Prayer Man promoter...And if you have a good idea of human behavior and what people fear you can see Kamp and Ciphered Past are very much afraid of my evidence due to the way they avoid it in their slanderous discussions of myself...These people are very afraid of letting me defend my work on a fair playing field...The dishonest way they deal with me is very much indicative of their awareness of the danger of my research to their BS theory...Kamp himself put it best when he said "This is all because of one person...Brian Doyle"...Their use of cowardly censorship speaks the most and shows they are afraid of letting me show my evidence because of their awareness that it is deadly to their Prayer Man BS...These are cheap hacks however who aren't beneath petty banning and censorship to protect what they know to be a bogus theory...Again, if you have a good sense of things the evidence that makes the difference on Prayer Man is exactly what is being kept off "Ciphered Past" and The Education Forum...That evidence is my evidence as I credibly apply it...My discussions here are no different than anyone else's so why the intense effort to deny me my earned posting space amongst my peers?...The only answer to that is their awareness that my evidence refutes their corrupted false claims and their honor-less willingness to practice cowardly censorship...