Lee Oswald The Cop Killer

[Tim Nickerson]

Well, at least we know that Mr Caprio doesn't know much about firearms or ammunition.

He doesn't know much about the Constitution either. In fact, he's pathetically ignorant about most things.

[Walt Cakebread]

If I understand Hill's history with his own statements

 He calls in at 1.40 and reprts automatic shells

Denies this at the WC

30 tears later says he did find the automatic shells

 My opinion is that does not make his story completely untenable since a lot of folks tended to change their initial stories for the WC

I believe that Hill was one of the key conspirators on the DPD......He's a liar.

[Mitch Todd]

He doesn't know much about the Constitution either. In fact, he's pathetically ignorant about most things.

This time, it's a case of getting himself in trouble by knowing a little about something when knowing a little doesn't help you a lot. Ammunition designed to be used in rovolvers really does tend to use rimmed cases. This allows the gun manufacturer to headspace the cartridge against the back of the cylinder. By doing that, the gun manufacturer only has to run one boring operation per chamber, which saves them a lot of money (though some revolvers actually do overbore the butt end of each chamber just enough to contain the cartridge rim). However, there is no mechanical reason that forces them to do so. Most automatic/semi-auto pistol-caliber ammo is either semi-rimmed or rimless and  headspaces the cartridge at the case mouth instead of the rim. The purpose of doing it this way is to make the kinds of magazines used in these weapons easier to design and manufacture. Again there isn't an inherent mechanical reason preventing the use of rimmed cartridges in automatic and semiautomatic weapons. In fact, the .303 British and Russian 7.62x54R are both rimmed rifle-caliber cartridges that were fired from machine guns by the zillions (and possibly even gazillions) over several decades and a couple of World Wars without too much trouble.

I'm told that, over the years, a number of manufacturers made semi-auto pistols chambered for .38 special. The most famous of these were the versions of the Colt M1911; thousands were made, and they were often used for target competitions. Competitors who liked using the 1911, but preferred a lighter recoil than the original .45 ACP snapped them up. Conversely, various concerns have made revolvers chambered for "auto" rounds. I hear that Taurus in particular has taken to offering a wide range of revolvers chambered for .380 ACP, 9mm, etc.
   
see here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Headspace_%28firearms%29 if you don't know what "headspace" refers to.

[Martin Weidmann]

That's right. And you said No. You were wrong.

Why only bold that part?

Particularly if it's a non-fungible item. If the defense has something concrete to present to the jury once the evidence has been admitted then fine. However, they will not be allowed free reign to spout unsupported claims against the evidence. Not in any properly run court anyway.

You're right. It is a bit difficult for me to understand. Post the transcript. That should help.

That's right. And you said No. You were wrong.

No. It's clear by now that you and I attach a different meaning to the word "authentication". In a trial setting a judge will basically admit any evidence that he feels the jury should see because it has a significant connection to the case. However, the admittance alone does not mean the evidence is validated on it's probative value. It's a bit like a judge ruling, based on basic information from the prosecution that there is enough material to justify that somebody should be held over for trial. That alone doesn't mean that the person is guilty, it only means the judge wants his guilt or innocence to be determined in a trial. The same goes for admitted evidence.

Why only bold that part?

Particularly if it's a non-fungible item. If the defense has something concrete to present to the jury once the evidence has [sic] been admitted then fine. However, they will not be allowed free reign to spout unsupported claims against the evidence. Not in any properly run court anyway.

Great, so you accept that your basic implicit argument [that evidence admitted at trial is already authenticated and needs no further chain of custody] is incorrect?

[Martin Weidmann]

This time, it's a case of getting himself in trouble by knowing a little about something when knowing a little doesn't help you a lot. Ammunition designed to be used in rovolvers really does tend to use rimmed cases. This allows the gun manufacturer to headspace the cartridge against the back of the cylinder. By doing that, the gun manufacturer only has to run one boring operation per chamber, which saves them a lot of money (though some revolvers actually do overbore the butt end of each chamber just enough to contain the cartridge rim). However, there is no mechanical reason that forces them to do so. Most automatic/semi-auto pistol-caliber ammo is either semi-rimmed or rimless and  headspaces the cartridge at the case mouth instead of the rim. The purpose of doing it this way is to make the kinds of magazines used in these weapons easier to design and manufacture. Again there isn't an inherent mechanical reason preventing the use of rimmed cartridges in automatic and semiautomatic weapons. In fact, the .303 British and Russian 7.62x54R are both rimmed rifle-caliber cartridges that were fired from machine guns by the zillions (and possibly even gazillions) over several decades and a couple of World Wars without too much trouble.

I'm told that, over the years, a number of manufacturers made semi-auto pistols chambered for .38 special. The most famous of these were the versions of the Colt M1911; thousands were made, and they were often used for target competitions. Competitors who liked using the 1911, but preferred a lighter recoil than the original .45 ACP snapped them up. Conversely, various concerns have made revolvers chambered for "auto" rounds. I hear that Taurus in particular has taken to offering a wide range of revolvers chambered for .380 ACP, 9mm, etc.
   
see here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Headspace_%28firearms%29 if you don't know what "headspace" refers to.

Mr. Todd, it would be nice if you made an actual contribution to this forum instead of simply attacking people who clearly disagree with you.

I'm told that, over the years, a number of manufacturers made semi-auto pistols chambered for .38 special.

If your words are to be believed, you seem to be well connected to all sorts of unidentified people who seem to "tell you" all sorts of things. It's either that or you are simply full of hot air.

And using Wikipedia to make a point is a bit pathetic for a guy who claims being told things?.. just saying!

[Zeon Mason]

How did the shells stay in Oswalds loose brown shirt pocket all thru the entire "falling into the seats" struggle with McDonald?

Why is a nearly pristine condition experied bus transfer pass in Oswald brown shirt, if he CHANGED his shirt at his boarding room?

How did that bus transfer pass remain unbent, or twisted, during all that struggling, the outside of the theater where Oswald looks like his brown shirt is about to be taken off him by the DPD?

Why are there no fingerprints from McWatters or Oswald on the bus transfer ticket. Its PAPER, and paper easily retains persperation, oil, and sodium chloride, and even if the persiration evaportates, silver nitrate will react with sodium chloride particle that remain (up to days, weeks, years old).

[Mitch Todd]

Mr. Todd, it would be nice if you made an actual contribution to this forum instead of simply attacking people who clearly disagree with you.

I'm told that, over the years, a number of manufacturers made semi-auto pistols chambered for .38 special.

If your words are to be believed, you seem to be well connected to all sorts of unidentified people who seem to "tell you" all sorts of things. It's either that or you are simply full of hot air.

And using Wikipedia to make a point is a bit pathetic for a guy who claims being told things?.. just saying!

If you think I am full of hot air, you are free to demonstrate it. So is Mr Caprio. And anyone else who wishes to do so. However, I do not see either one of you actually making such an effort.

Sometimes, I say "I'm told that...." because I ask, and the people I ask either think my interest in the JFK case is a pointless waste of time, or simply don't care to be quoted because they don't want another JFK obsessive wasting even more of their time than I do. I also have a lot of normally useless firearms knowledge, partly from shooting off and on, partly from knowing a number of serious shooters, gun collectors, etc. I've also read a fair amount on guns, rifles, and pistols, though that is mostly tied directly to the assassination. Sometimes it runs together, so it's hard to specifically cite a particular source. Once in a while, I say some half remembered thing where I remembered the wrong half. I welcome being set straight in those cases, but it has to be straight. 

If you doubt me about a .38 special version of the Colt 1911, you can look here:

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2014/06/13/38-special-colt-1911/

[For that matter: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_%26_Wesson_Model_52]


And if you don't think anyone makes revolvers in "auto" calibers, you can look here:

https://www.taurususa.com/gun-selector-results.cfm?series=905&toggle=tr
https://www.taurususa.com/gun-selector-results.cfm?series=380&toggle=tr

Speaking of non-traditional revolver ammunition, these guys also make revolvers chambered for .410 gauge shotgun shells:

https://www.taurususa.com/gun-selector-results.cfm?series=JPD&toggle=tr

Probably useful if you need to safeguard you're prone to attack from doves and pigeons.


BTW, Just for reference, this is what Rob C has had to offer as his part in this particular exchange:

"Baloney. Automatic and pistol shells look nothing alike. An experienced officer like Hill wouldn't make that mistake."

"Blah, blah, blah. Even Dale Myers said the automatic shells showed 'AUTO' and the revolver shells showed '.38 Special'.You would have to think that Hill couldn't read to think he made the mistake claimed."

"Just so everyone knows Todd is playing games. Automatic shells and revolver shells look differently and are marked differently. Todd must be saying that Hill was majorly incompetent to confuse the two."

Mostly, he just baldly asserts stuff then pointlessly accuses me of "playing games." The only source he references at all is Dale Meyers, who I doubt would be considered a firearms expert in any way. And not one word from you.