Author Topic: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?  (Read 160276 times)

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Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Reply #406 on: July 28, 2026, 08:18:30 PM »
Shelley on the first floor:

"And after the third shot, following that, the third shot, I went to the back of the building down the back stairs, and encountered Bill Shelley and Bill Lovelady on the first floor on the way out to the Houston Street dock."

What evidence exists supporting her constant insistence that she left the window she was looking out of within seconds of the shots?
Below is a plan of the fourth floor of the TSBD building. Adams worked in the office of Scott Foresman Co., where she watched the motorcade pass with Sandra Styles, Dorothy Garner and Elsie Dorman. The red box indicates the 5 double sets of windows for that office. The red "A" indicates Adams' location as the Presidential limo passed by. Her colleagues crowded around that double set of windows with Elsie Dorman filming the approaching limo.



Below is a photo taken by Tom Dillard. The red box indicates the same windows. Adams was stood at the open window marked with a red "A".



When we take a closer look at the window we notice that there is no-one stood where there should be four women watching the motorcade. We can see the figure of one woman standing in the window to the left of that. It appears Vicki had left her position by the window by the time this pic was taken.




The question is - how long after the assassination was this photo taken?
This is what Dillard has to say about the picture (quotes taken from Pat Speer's website):

"Bob Jackson, a photographer in my car, said, There's the rifle in that open window. In the three or four seconds it took me to locate the particular open window and make a picture, the rifle had been withdrawn."
"Bob Jackson said, “There’s a guy with a rifle up in that window.” I said, “Where?” I had both cameras around my neck, loaded, focused, cocked…Bob says, “In that window up on that building right there, it’s that top window.” I shot a picture with the wide-angle camera. I said, “Which window?” He said, “It’s the one on the right, second from the top.” By that time, I had the 100mm camera up, shot a picture of that window…."


Clearly this is literally a few seconds after the shooting has occurred as he just missed the rifle being drawn back into the window. On Mark Tyler's Motorcade Mapping website the Dillard pic is taken 11 seconds after the headshot. The limo has barely got out of the Triple Underpass

The Dillard picture is incredibly strong evidence that Adams took off running about 10 seconds after the last shot. This decision was made before the limo even reached the Underpass.

"As the car came back into view I saw that something was wrong and watched as Mrs. Kennedy appeared to be trying to climb out of the car. I saw a Secret Service man jump in and the car began speeding toward the triple underpass. Before it reached that [the triple underpass] I turned to Sandra and I said, 'I want to see what is going on.' We ran to the back of the office and down the stairs."

How long would it take a young women running full tilt in high heels to get down 3 flights of stairs - 30 seconds? 40 seconds?
Let's say her estimate of reaching the first floor one minute after the shooting is conservative, the question remains, what were Lovelady and Shelley doing there?
It must be noted, this mention of Lovelady and Shelley did not first come about during Adams' WC testimony:

 "When the President got in front of us I heard someone call him and he turned. That is when I heard the first shot. I thought it was a firecracker. Then the second shot I saw the Secret Service man run to the back of the President's car. After the third shot I went out the back door. I said, 'I think someone has been shot.' The elevator was not running and there was no one on the stairs. I went down to the first floor. I saw Mr. Shelly and another employee named Bill. The freight elevator had not moved, and I still did not see anyone on the stairs. I ran out the back door of the depository..."
(2-17-64 statement to the Dallas Police Department, box 3 folder 19 file 3 of the Dallas JFK Archive)[Speer]


What is the importance of Shelley and Lovelady lying about their movements after the assassination?
What compelled them to race towards the back of the first floor?

Offline Lance Payette

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Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Reply #407 on: July 28, 2026, 10:01:51 PM »
Hmmm...this superior intelligence you often like to boast about...I've never seen it or anything even remotely like it.
In nearly every interaction we have I make an obvious point and you fall to pieces, often running away.
Sometimes even quitting the forum.
I see you've started with the 'aliens' thing already. I imagine you think this is really clever or something... ::)
Oh, dear, Dan is imbibing his 100-proof angry juice again.

YOU began the post to which I was responding by saying "Just for argument's sake though... Let's say you do have some intelligence and can manage this rudimentary thought experiment ..."

I was good-naturedly tweaking you, as opposed to haughtily pointing out that I have a measured IQ in the 99.7th percentile, scored above the 99th percentile of the Law School Admissions Test, graduated magna cum laude from both college and law school, and, well, whatnot.

There ain't nobody EVER, bub, who has thought they were dealing with a dummy when dealing with me. My posts on this forum speak for themselves. If you want to keep playing this goofy game, be my guest - you're just making yourself look silly, and surely you have sufficient intelligence to understand that. What you think you're accomplishing is beyond me. Do you perhaps actually hate yourself?

Quote
Is Vicki's credibility hanging by a thread, or is that my imagination?

There's so many ways to make a fool of you but I can't let the audacity of you, of all people, bringing up 'credibility'.

That sentence makes no sense. Diagram it and you'll see. Perhaps something like "There are many different ways to make a fool of you, but the sheer audacity of a hopeless cluck like you, of all people, bringing up 'credibility' presents me with an opportunity that simply cannot be resisted." Not great and kind of wordy, but at least it's grammatical.

The rest of your response, including my supposed "lies," has nothing to do with the points I raised about Vicki's credibility or lack thereof, or with the vastly more plausible thought experiment that Occam and I tend to favor.

I believe if you'll check with the local Safeway you'll find that angry juice is available in a 40-proof variety rather than the 100-proof stuff you seem to be imbibing. Just a suggestion.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2026, 10:03:42 PM by Lance Payette »

Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Reply #408 on: July 28, 2026, 10:21:57 PM »
Oh, dear, Dan is imbibing his 100-proof angry juice again.

YOU began the post to which I was responding by saying "Just for argument's sake though... Let's say you do have some intelligence and can manage this rudimentary thought experiment ..."

I was good-naturedly tweaking you, as opposed to haughtily pointing out that I have a measured IQ in the 99.7th percentile, scored above the 99th percentile of the Law School Admissions Test, graduated magna cum laude from both college and law school, and, well, whatnot.

There ain't nobody EVER, bub, who has thought they were dealing with a dummy when dealing with me. My posts on this forum speak for themselves. If you want to keep playing this goofy game, be my guest - you're just making yourself look silly, and surely you have sufficient intelligence to understand that. What you think you're accomplishing is beyond me. Do you perhaps actually hate yourself?

My posts on this forum speak for themselves.

That is exactly the point I was making.
Your silly pretence at being some kind of open-minded free thinker, willing to explore any avenue of research...it's embarrassing.
You're an out-and-out, fully fledged Nutter.
Like all Nutters you believe you have a superior intelligence and that anything you think is a fact - just because you think it!!
#delusional
 ;D I love the way you were only "good naturedly" insinuating your superior intelligence but then can't function without stressing how intelligent you believe you are.
Aren't you smart enough to get that joke?

Quote
That sentence makes no sense. Diagram it and you'll see. Perhaps something like "There are many different ways to make a fool of you, but the sheer audacity of a hopeless cluck like you, of all people, bringing up 'credibility' presents me with an opportunity that simply cannot be resisted." Not great and kind of wordy, but at least it's grammatical.

The rest of your response, including my supposed "lies," has nothing to do with the points I raised about Vicki's credibility or lack thereof, or with the vastly more plausible thought experiment that Occam and I tend to favor.

I believe if you'll check with the local Safeway you'll find that angry juice is available in a 40-proof variety rather than the 100-proof stuff you seem to be imbibing. Just a suggestion.

What a shock.
Yet again, side-stepped the mass of evidence demonstrating how Occam's Razor would have carved up Lovelady's credibility.
Side-stepped your own desperate invention of testimony that never existed.
As I have already pointed out - "make an obvious point and you fall to pieces".

If my watch is correct it's almost time for you to run away  Thumb1:

« Last Edit: July 28, 2026, 10:23:20 PM by Dan O'meara »

Online Tom Graves

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Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Reply #409 on: July 29, 2026, 12:08:20 AM »
I have a measured IQ in the 99.7th percentile, scored above the 99th percentile of the Law School Admissions Test, [and] graduated magna cum laude from both college and law school. 

You must be very proud of yourself, Macho Genius Fancy Pants Rants!

Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Reply #410 on: July 29, 2026, 12:47:00 AM »
You must be very proud of yourself, Macho Genius Fancy Pants Rants!

Your infatuation with Payette is nauseating.

Online Tom Graves

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Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Reply #411 on: July 29, 2026, 12:54:50 AM »
Your infatuation with Payette is nauseating.

Your mental flatulence is shocking.

Offline Lance Payette

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Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Reply #412 on: July 29, 2026, 12:57:02 AM »
You must be very proud of yourself, Macho Genius Fancy Pants Rants!
Considering where I came from and what I had to overcome ... well, yes, kind of proud. I think that's why I get under the skin of some folks here: I don't hate myself - quite the opposite, in fact. I have no false humilty about the abilities with which I've been blessed. I have no false humility about what I've achieved solely through my own efforts despite pretty long odds. I am by no means arrogant; I am simply content with myself and my life, which drives people like you and Dan crazy. At 76, I have no reason to humor nutcases like you or angry buffoons like Dan. I know nothing about either one of you, but my guess would be that life hasn't turned out the way you'd hoped. If someone wants to deal with me on reasonable and reasonably normal terms, that's what they'll get back from me. If they want to play silly games, they'll get their silly games shoved back up their asses because I'm really, really good at it.

You're at least borderline insane - of this I'm convinced. There is something very, very wrong with Dan; I have no idea what it is, but he's consumed by anger and bile completely out of proportion to whatever is consuming him is worth. You both need help - badly - and a JFKA forum is probably not the place to find it. This place is little more than an outlet for your insanity and anger. I wish you well, but your problems aren't my problems and I assure you I will never again respond to anything either of you says. Rant on, but shove it up your Bahookie as far as I'm concerned.