Oswald took 10.2 seconds to fire all three shots.

[Tom Graves]

It looks as though the hole in JBC's shirt is wider side-to-side than it is up-and-down.

[Dan O'meara]

You mean my size-15 little foot?

Should I have said "rotating" or "spinning," instead?

How about "whirly gigging"?


Mr. SPECTER - Before proceeding to the other factors indicating point of entry and point of exit, Dr. Gregory, I call your attention to Commission Exhibit No. 399, which is a bullet and ask you first if you have had an opportunity to examine that earlier today?

Dr. GREGORY - I have.

Mr. SPECTER - What opinion, if any, do you have as to whether that bullet could have produced the wound on the Governor's right wrist and remained as intact as it is at the present time?

Dr. GREGORY - In examining this bullet, I find a small flake has been either knocked off or removed from the rounded end of the missile. I was told that this was removed for the purpose of analysis. The only other deformity which I find is at the base of the missile at the point where it Joined the cartridge carrying the powder, I presume, and this is somewhat flattened and deflected, distorted. There is some irregularity of the darker metal within which I presume to represent lead. The only way that this missile could have produced this wound in my view, was to have entered the wrist backward. Now, this is not inconsistent with one of the characteristics known for missiles which is to tumble. All missiles in flight have two motions normally, a linear motion from the muzzle of the gun to the target, a second motion which is a spinning motion having to do with maintaining the integrity of the initial linear direction, but if they strike an object they may be caused to turn in their path and tumble end over, and if they do, they tend to produce a greater amount of destruction within the strike time or the target, and they could possibly, if tumbling in air upon emergence, tumble into another target backward. That is the only possible explanation I could offer to correlate this missile with this particular wound.

Mr. SPECTER - Is them sufficient metallic substance missing from the back or rear end of that bullet to account for the metallic substance which you have described in the Governor's wrist?

Dr. GREGORY - It is possible but I don't know enough about the structure of bullets or this one in particular, to know what is a normal complement of lead or for this particular missile. It is irregular, but how much it may have lost, I have no idea.

Mr. DULLES - Would the nature of the entry wound give you any indication as to whether it entered backward or whether it entered forward?

Dr. GREGORY - My initial impression was that whatever produced the wound of the wrist was an irregular object, certainly not smooth nosed as the business end of this particular bullet is because of two things. The size of the wound of entrance, and the fact that it is irregular surfaced permitted it to pick up organic debris, materials, threads, and carry them into the wound with it. Now, you will note that Dr. Shaw earlier in his testimony and in all of my conversations with him, never did indicate that there was any such loss of material into the wrist, nor does the back of this coat which I have examined show that it lost significant amounts of cloth but I think the tear in this coat sleeve does imply that there were bits of fabric lost, and I think those were resident in the wrist. I think we recovered them.

Mr. SPECTER - Is the back of that bullet characteristic of an irregular missile so as to cause the wound in the wrist?

Dr. GREGORY - I would say that the back of this being fiat and having sharp edges is irregular and would possibly tend to tear tissues more than does an inclined plane such as this.

Mr. SPECTER - Would the back of the missile be sufficiently irregular to have caused the wound of the right wrist, in your opinion?

Dr. GREGORY - I think it could have; yes. It is possible.

Mr. SPECTER - Would it be consistent with your observations of the wrist for that missile to have penetrated and gone through the right wrist?

Dr. GREGORY - It is possible; yes. It appears to me since the wound of exit was a small laceration, that much of the energy of the missile that struck the Governor's wrist was expended in breaking the bone reducing its velocity sufficient so that while it could make an emergence through the underlying soft tissues on his wrist, it did not do great damage to them.

Mr. SPECTER - Is there any indication from the extent of the damage to the wrist whether the bullet was pristine, that is: was the wrist struck first in flight or whether there had been some reduction in the velocity of the missile prior to striking the wrist?

Dr. GREGORY - I would offer this opinion about a high velocity rifle bullet striking a forearm.

Mr. SPECTER - Permit me to inject factors which we have not put on the record although it has been brought to your attention previously: Assume this is a 6.5-millimeter missile which was shot from a rifle having a muzzle velocity of approximately 2,000 feet per second, with a distance of approximately 160 to 200 feet between the weapon and the victim; and answer the prior question, if you would, Dr. Gregory, with those factors in mind?

Dr. GREGORY - I would fully expect the first object struck by that missile to be very badly damaged, and especially if it were a rigid bone such as the wrist bone is, to. literally blow it apart. I have had some experience with rifle wound injuries of the forearm produced by this type of missile, and the last two which I attended myself have culminated in amputation of the limb because of the extensive damage produced by the missile as it passed through the arm. Considerably more than was evidenced in the Governor's case either by examination of the limb itself or an examination of these X-rays.

Mr. SPECTER - Now, as to the experience you had which you experienced which resulted in amputations, what was the range between the weapon and the victim's limb, if you know?

Dr. GREGORY - The range in those two instances, I concede was considerably shorter but I cannot give you the specific range. By short I mean perhaps no more than 15 or 20 yards at the most.

Mr. SPECTER - Would the difference between the 15 or 20 yards and the 160 to 250 feet make any difference in your opinion, though, as to the damage which would be inflicted on the wrist had that bullet struck it as the first point of impact?

Dr. GREGORY - No, sir; I don't think it would have made that much difference.

Once again Tom, you have confirmed the point I was making.
It's ace debating with you.
As I said, the idea that the bullet "tumbled" was created in order to keep up the pretense that CE399 was the bullet involved.
And you have provided testimony of the moment this happened.
Thanks 

It starts with Specter introducing CE399, a completely unverified bullet, into the testimony - "I call your attention to Commission Exhibit No. 399"
He then asks Gregory if this bullet could have caused the injury to Connally's wrist -   "What opinion, if any, do you have as to whether that bullet could have produced the wound on the Governor's right wrist and remained as intact as it is at the present time?"
Specter reveals that earlier in Gregory's testimony they had been talking about a "metallic substance which you have described in the Governor's wrist?"
Gregory has examined the bullet and, if this was indeed the bullet involved in creating the injury to Connally's wrist, makes a very obvious observation - "The only way that this missile could have produced this wound in my view, was to have entered the wrist backward. Now, this is not inconsistent with one of the characteristics known for missiles which is to tumble."
 
As I said and as you have confirmed with this testimony, the idea of the bullet tumbling was made up out of thin air because that was the only way CE399 could have left metallic fragments in Connally's wrist.
There is nothing in the evidence that supports this made up nonsense.
John's insanely weak attempt to 'enlarge' the hole in the back of JBC's shirt illustrates an extreme mentality that will bend the evidence towards it's desired theory.
The exit hole out of JFK's neck was so clean it was thought to be an entrance wound.
The hole in JBC's back was so clean, Dr Robert Shaw was convinced that JBC was shot directly - this would mean no tumbling involved.
The evidence of JBC's shirt and jacket also support a clean transit of the bullet (until it reaches Connally's wrist where it fragments).

Thanks for once again making my argument for me.

PS: Are you the Tommy Graves who took part in the work identifying Gloria Calvary on the TSBD building steps in the Couch footage?

[John Mytton]

"...it seems to me that the ragged edges on Connally's shirt hole(measured from each extremity to be roughly 3/4 of an inch)..."

As usual, I'm having problems understanding what you're posting.
Either I'm missing something very obvious or you are, once again, talking utter nonsense.
So, according to the picture you posted you believe the hole "measured from each extremity" is ROUGHLY 3/4 OF AN INCH
3/4 of an inch?
The hole ACROSS THE DIAGONAL is less than 1/2 an inch.
That means each side is even less than that.



What am I missing?

Mr. SPECTER - What did the wound of entry look like, Doctor?
Dr. GREGORY - It appeared to me that the wound of entry was sort of a linear wound, perhaps three-quarters of an inch in length with a rounded central portion. Whereas, the wound of exit was rather larger than this, perhaps an inch and a half across.

JohnM

[Tom Graves]

The idea that the bullet "tumbled" was created in order to keep up the pretense that CE399 was the bullet involved.

That kind of bullet fired from that kind of Carcano tends to start yawing (i.e., "tumbling") upon exiting something soft (e.g., a block of ballistics gel or a human neck), as shown by Luke and Mike Haag in the evil, evil, evil PBS NOVA special, "Cold Case JFK."

Perhaps you missed it.

[Dan O'meara]

Mr. SPECTER - What did the wound of entry look like, Doctor?
Dr. GREGORY - It appeared to me that the wound of entry was sort of a linear wound, perhaps three-quarters of an inch in length with a rounded central portion. Whereas, the wound of exit was rather larger than this, perhaps an inch and a half across.

JohnM

Yeah John, there's no need to repeat Gregory's testimony because that's not what's being discussed.
You were saying that the picture you posted of the hole in the back of Connally's shirt showed a hole that appeared to you to be roughly 3/4 of an inch "measured from each extremity".
But the hole in Connally's shirt is nowhere near 3/4 of an inch.
How you can't just hold your hands up and say you made a silly mistake is incredible.
Once again, you're making such a fool of yourself.




The hole is a shade over 3/8 of an inch one way and a shade under 3/8 of an inch the other.
Neither measurement is anywhere near 3/4 of an inch. How you could suggest that is really insane.
That you can't just admit to your mistake is disturbing.

This hole demonstrates beyond any reasonable doubt that the bullet was NOT "tumbling" as it entered JBC's back.

[Dan O'meara]

That kind of bullet fired from that kind of Carcano tends to start yawing (i.e., "tumbling") upon exiting something soft (e.g., a block of ballistics gel or a human neck), as shown by Luke and Mike Haag in the evil, evil, evil PBS NOVA special, "Cold Case JFK."

Perhaps you missed it.

Yeah buddy, and perhaps you're missing all the evidence against a tumbling bullet that's being put right in your face at the moment.
Explain how a yawing bullet created such a small hole in the back of JBC's shirt (or don't bother)
Thanks again for providing the testimony showing when the tumbling nonsense was created.

[Charles Collins]

What John Mytton showed is that the size of the hole in the fabric is not an indication of the size of the bullet (see the high-speed photos of the bullet penetrating the fabric). The fabric stretches as the bullet passes through it. Then the fabric rebounds and the actual hole is smaller than the bullet. Human skin behaves similarly. So does paper to some extent. Here’s a photo of a paper target that I personally shot with (5) 25-caliber pellets through the same hole from a distance of ten meters. I personally measured the actual hole in the paper target with my digital calipers. It measures slightly less than 1/4 of an inch. The margins of the paper around the actual hole are slightly deformed but have rebounded such that the actual hole is smaller. The threads comprising the fabric of the shirt can and do stretch and rebound without leaving deformations that are as obvious (unless you know what you are looking at) as the deformations in the margins of the hole in the paper.