When Was JBC Hit?

[Tom Graves]

None of the things you mentioned, other than the JBC Z164 turn, are definitive signs of a reaction to a gunshot. There are other plausible reasons for those movements. The only reason the Z164 is more compelling is because JBC described how he reacted to the sound of the first shot. We see him do exactly what he said he did. If I am correct that the first shot was fired at Z147-148, JBC would have heard it in the Z149-150 window and his reaction would have been roughly 3/4 of a second. The Z155 jiggle/shake of Zapruder's camera is very similar to his reactions at Z227 and Z318, both closely following when known shots were taken. To me, that is the preponderance of evidence as to when the first shot was fired, even if not proof positive.

You're discounting JBC's quick head turn to his left starting at Z-150.

Rhetorical question: Are there people in the Zapruder who are consciously reacting to your missing-everything shot at Z-147 - Z-148?

[John Corbett]

You're discounting JBC's quick head turn to his left starting at Z-150.

Rhetorical question: Are there people in the Zapruder who are consciously reacting to your missing-everything shot at Z-147 - Z-148?

JBC and Rosemary Willis are seen reacting. Then of course, we have Zapruder reacting.

[Tom Graves]

JBC and Rosemary Willis are seen reacting. Then of course, we have Zapruder reacting.

JBC began consciously reacting at Z-150 when he quickly turned his head to his left (to be caught "looking straight ahead" in the Z-161 Croft photo).

Rosemary Willis began consciously reacting in Z-140 when she began turning her head away from the limo and back towards the TSBD.

Zapruder may have been buffeted by wind and/or Sitzman may have had a bad case of the hiccups.

Rhetorical question: Why did Elsie Dorman involuntarily stop filming the two times she involuntarily stopped filming?


ME: Elsie Dorman involuntarily stopped filming twice during the JFK assassination. Which Zapruder frames correlate timewise with those two instances?

Perplexity AI: The two involuntary stops in Elsie Dorman’s filming line up, in Zapruder‑time, just before Z133 and then at about Z228, with a third [voluntary] stop later around Z411.

Correlated Zapruder frames

Dale Myers’ epipolar geometric synchronization of the amateur films places Dorman’s three camera interruptions as follows:

First stop: 0.12 seconds before Zapruder starts filming the limousine, i.e., just prior to Z133.

Second stop: at the time equivalent to Zapruder frame Z228 (shortly after the “back/neck” shot near Z223).

Third stop: at the time equivalent to Zapruder frame Z411 (roughly five seconds after the last shot).

[John Corbett]

JBC began consciously reacting at Z-150 when he quickly turned his head to his left (to be caught "looking straight ahead" in the Z-161 Croft photo).

What's your proof that was a reaction to a gunshot? Why do you read every head movement during the time in question to be a reaction to a gun shot? Do you think the occupants of the limo would be seating still during the motorcade? If my belief in a shot at Z147-148, Z150 would be too soon after he heard the shot for it to be a reaction. Probably just a coincidence he turned his head at that poiint?

Rosemary Willis began consciously reacting in Z-140 when she began turning her head away from the limo and back towards the TSBD.

Again, you are assuming these head turns are reactions to gunshots. Why?

Zapruder may have been buffeted by wind and/or Sitzman may have had a bad case of the hiccups.

Yes, I have always allowed for that possibility. Not every flinch is a reaction to a gunshot but every gunshot would be followed by a flinch. Based on the flinches at Z227 and Z318, we can expect a flinch 7-8 frames after each shot was fired.

Rhetorical question: Why did Elsie Dorman involuntarily stop filming the two times she involuntarily stopped filming?

I have no idea. Why is that important?

ME: Elsie Dorman involuntarily stopped filming twice during the JFK assassination. Which Zapruder frames correlate timewise with those two instances?

Perplexity AI: The two involuntary stops in Elsie Dorman’s filming line up, in Zapruder‑time, just before Z133 and then at about Z228, with a third [voluntary] stop later around Z411.

Correlated Zapruder frames

Dale Myers’ epipolar geometric synchronization of the amateur films places Dorman’s three camera interruptions as follows:

First stop: 0.12 seconds before Zapruder starts filming the limousine, i.e., just prior to Z133.

Second stop: at the time equivalent to Zapruder frame Z228 (shortly after the “back/neck” shot near Z223).

Third stop: at the time equivalent to Zapruder frame Z411 (roughly five seconds after the last shot).

You are assuming that the stops in filming are reactions to gun shots. That is illogical. You would have a better argument if she had stopped filming immediately after the headshot but she didn't.

[Tom Graves]

Why do you read every head movement during the time in question to be a reaction to a gun shot?

"The time in question" is very short: the half-second between Z-140 and Z-150.

What's interesting is that all five of the passengers (JFK, Jackie, Connally, Nellie, and Kellerman) in the limo start turning their heads quicky during that half-second.

Given that, plus what we see Glen Bennett, George Hickey, and Rosemary Willis doing during that same "time in question" and the fact that Elsie Dorman, standing about thirty feet away from Oswald on the fourth floor, involuntarily stopped filming twice -- 0.12 seconds before Zapruder resumed filming, and again at Z-228 -- it's logical to assume that they were all reacting, consciously or otherwise, to Oswald's first, missing-everything, shot.

[Andrew Mason]

"it's logical to assume that they were all reacting, consciously or otherwise, to Oswald's first, missing-everything, shot”.

It might be reasonable to infer that they were reacting to a shot IF there was evidence that there had actually been a shot just before then.  But you can’t use the head turn as evidence of a gun shot because there are many reason for the car occupants to be turning their heads.

[Tom Graves]

There are many reason for the car occupants to be turning their heads.

Not all five quickly within half-a-second of each other.