The Assassination and Mrs. Paine

[Steve M. Galbraith]

Good analysis Steve.

As you know, this is often like re-fighting the Cold War and debating the legitimacy of the US's response to the Soviets. The conspiracy believers (certainly the Garrison believers like Stone et al.) think all of those post-war actions were unjustified, that they were done by essentially fascists who used the imagined threat from Moscow to hijack America and attain power. JFK threatened them and their power and they killed him in response.

Then everything is reverse engineered from this vieow to prove their conspiracy.

Things large and small are used to support it: Michael had a security clearance that shows he was an agent, Ruth went to Nicaragua to monitor pro-Sandinistas, David Phillips was seen with Oswald who he controlled, JFK was going to leave Vietnam, normalize relations with Castro, dismantle the CIA....these are the big things and the small ones that are all evidence of the conspiracy.

[W. Tracy Parnell]

Are some critics of Ruth Paine prejudiced?

http://wtracyparnell.blogspot.com/2022/07/the-assassination-and-mrs-paine-are.html

[Steve M. Galbraith]

Are some critics of Ruth Paine prejudiced?

http://wtracyparnell.blogspot.com/2022/07/the-assassination-and-mrs-paine-are.html

Where did David Talbot come up with the evidence for this claim?:

"I interviewed both Michael and Ruth Paine for my book The Devil's Chessboard. As I wrote, they were both well-known to former CIA spymaster Allen Dulles, who made a practice of using "white mice" like them."

Where is the evidence that the Paines were "well-known" to Dulles? A Quaker housewife in Ft. Worth, Texas was "well known" to Dulles? "White mice" means what here? I'm not familiar with that term.

I know I'm repeating myself but this is the problem with the JFK assassination conspiracists, the political types who see the Cold War as a lie. Talbot is a text book leftwinger, an anti- anti-communist like Oliver Stone who sees a sinister "secret state" running American foreign policy (and some domestic) during the Cold War. In this version the threat from the Soviets was an illusion, a fable foisted on the American people and used by these fascist like people for power. They really do think the Cold War was caused by us and not Moscow. Morley, Oliver Stone, Garrison and his followers.....

[W. Tracy Parnell]

Their "evidence" is that Michael Paine's mother knew Mary Bancroft who was a mistress of Dulles. But the actual evidence that Ruth or Michael knew Dulles is zero. White mice? I don't know-maybe Talbot thinks they were experiments that Dulles was running? Again-no evidence.

[Richard Smith]

Their "evidence" is that Michael Paine's mother knew Mary Bancroft who was a mistress of Dulles. But the actual evidence that Ruth or Michael knew Dulles is zero. White mice? I don't know-maybe Talbot thinks they were experiments that Dulles was running? Again-no evidence.

Where is Tom Scully now that we need him?  He is a master at playing this CTer Kevin Bacon game.  Someone went to school with a person who married the sister of someone who once lived next door to someone who once attended a funeral of the uncle of Dulles.  Therefore they are complicit in a plot to kill JFK etc.

[Steve M. Galbraith]

Their "evidence" is that Michael Paine's mother knew Mary Bancroft who was a mistress of Dulles. But the actual evidence that Ruth or Michael knew Dulles is zero. White mice? I don't know-maybe Talbot thinks they were experiments that Dulles was running? Again-no evidence.

Thanks. Garrison's "propinquity" without any connection or proximity between/among the individuals. In other words, nothing.

Didn't Paine's mother know Bancroft in college before she (Bancroft) became Dulles's mistress? Did she know Bancroft at the time of this affair? As if that matters. And how the heck would Michael Paine know that a friend of his mother's knew Dulles? Again, as if that matters. In any case, as you point out, there's no evidence that Dulles knew Michael or Ruth Paine much less they were "well-known" to him.

This is a classic example of how some (too many noted ones) conspiracists need to expand their conspiracy when new evidence is found. Does it fit? It doesn't matter, it's just more kindling for the conspiracy bonfire, a fire they just need to keep burning decade after decade. It's not about resolving what happened (although they think they have); it's now a game to keep things going. On and on....

Just to add: Talbot also says RFK was murdered by the assassins of JFK to prevent him from revealing the conspiracy. But of course.

[Bill Chapman]

Thanks. Garrison's "propinquity" without any connection or proximity between/among the individuals. In other words, nothing.

Didn't Paine's mother know Bancroft in college before she (Bancroft) became Dulles's mistress? Did she know Bancroft at the time of this affair? As if that matters. And how the heck would Michael Paine know a friend of his mother knew Dulles? Again, as if that matters. In any case, as you point out, there's no evidence that Dulles knew Michael or Ruth Paine much less they were "well-known" to him.

This is a classic example of how some (too many noted ones) conspiracists need to expand their conspiracy when new evidence is found. Does it fit? It doesn't matter, it's just more kindling for the conspiracy bonfire, a fire they just need to keep burning decade after decade. It's not about resolving what happened (although they think they have); it's now a game to keep things going. On and on....

Just to add: Talbot also says RFK was murdered by the assassins of JFK to prevent him from revealing the conspiracy. But of course.

It's not about resolving what happened (although they think they have); it's now a game to keep things going.
_'CT Bonfire of the Vanities' in other words. Nailed it.