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Author Topic: Oswald: No power lunch  (Read 59275 times)

Offline John Mytton

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #288 on: September 11, 2021, 04:36:01 AM »
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Very interesting, Avery Davis looked out the window on the 4th floor and could see straight down to the sidewalk and naturally she says she couldn't see a particular persons face of someone she didn't know but Oswald seeing two black men that he knew and saw during the Morning and knew what they were wearing and their comparative sizes, hairstyles and etc, etc, and ,well, it's another slam dunk !  Thumb1:


https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth190266/m1/1/

And the following graphic which is grounded on scientific principles compares Oswald's line of sight as compared to Avery Davis and she was two floors below, the graphic isn't her window but the same formula and same angle is mathematically repeated across the entire floor. Thumb1: Thumb1:





JohnM
« Last Edit: September 11, 2021, 11:18:18 AM by John Mytton »

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #288 on: September 11, 2021, 04:36:01 AM »


Offline John Mytton

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #289 on: September 11, 2021, 12:34:40 PM »
Avery Davis has established beyond all doubt that Oswald could have easily seen Jarman and Norman on the sidewalk below but that's not the only evidence that Oswald would have known the two men were hanging out together because Jarman and Norman were moving through the building together and arrived at the windows directly below and since Norman could hear shells striking the floor, it follows that Oswald heard the men opening windows and assuming they weren't as quiet as church mice, Oswald would have heard them talking.

Jarman was in the 4th window and the following GIF shows Norman in the end window and Williams who arrived a bit later was in the window next to Norman.



Depending on the exact timing, Brennan describes Oswald pausing as though to assure himself that he hit his mark and as Brennan said in his first day affidavit that "He(Oswald) did not seem to be in any hurry" and under those parameters and considering that Jarman ran over to tell the others that "someone was shooting the President" is an example where Oswald could have heard the two men. And of course Williams arriving and no doubt greeting his fellow workmates would have created more opportunities for Oswald to hear what was being said below and by whom.

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his mark, and then he disappeared.

Mr. JARMAN - Well, after the third shot was fired, I think I got up and I run over to Harold Norman and Bonnie Ray Williams, and told them, I said, I told them that it wasn't a backfire or anything, that somebody was shooting at the President.

Mr. NORMAN. I believe it was his right arm, and I can't remember what the exact time was but I know I heard a shot, and then after I heard the shot, well, it seems as though the President, you know, slumped or something, and then another shot and I believe Jarman or someone told me, he said, "I believe someone is shooting at the President," and I think I made a statement "It is someone shooting at the President, and I believe it came from up above us."
Well, I couldn't see at all during the time but I know I heard a third shot fired, and I could also hear something sounded like the shell hulls hitting the floor and the ejecting of the rifle, it sounded as though it was to me.


JohnM
« Last Edit: September 11, 2021, 12:39:56 PM by John Mytton »

Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #290 on: September 11, 2021, 01:52:31 PM »
Very interesting, Avery Davis looked out the window on the 4th floor and could see straight down to the sidewalk and naturally she says she couldn't see a particular persons face of someone she didn't know but Oswald seeing two black men that he knew and saw during the Morning and knew what they were wearing and their comparative sizes, hairstyles and etc, etc, and ,well, it's another slam dunk !  Thumb1:


https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth190266/m1/1/

And the following graphic which is grounded on scientific principles compares Oswald's line of sight as compared to Avery Davis and she was two floors below, the graphic isn't her window but the same formula and same angle is mathematically repeated across the entire floor. Thumb1: Thumb1:





JohnM

Where in the document does it say the police men were standing on the sidewalk straight below the 4th floor window?

Let me guess; you just assumed that part, just like you always misrepresent evidence.

You seem to have forgotten (or ignored) that there is also a sidewalk running next to Elm street which - unlike the sidewalk directly next to the TSBD - would be visible for anybody looking "straight down" from the 4th floor.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2021, 03:24:43 PM by Martin Weidmann »

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #290 on: September 11, 2021, 01:52:31 PM »


Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #291 on: September 11, 2021, 02:00:59 PM »
Avery Davis has established beyond all doubt that Oswald could have easily seen Jarman and Norman on the sidewalk below but that's not the only evidence that Oswald would have known the two men were hanging out together because Jarman and Norman were moving through the building together and arrived at the windows directly below and since Norman could hear shells striking the floor, it follows that Oswald heard the men opening windows and assuming they weren't as quiet as church mice, Oswald would have heard them talking.

Jarman was in the 4th window and the following GIF shows Norman in the end window and Williams who arrived a bit later was in the window next to Norman.

[Image deleted]

Depending on the exact timing, Brennan describes Oswald pausing as though to assure himself that he hit his mark and as Brennan said in his first day affidavit that "He(Oswald) did not seem to be in any hurry" and under those parameters and considering that Jarman ran over to tell the others that "someone was shooting the President" is an example where Oswald could have heard the two men. And of course Williams arriving and no doubt greeting his fellow workmates would have created more opportunities for Oswald to hear what was being said below and by whom.

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his mark, and then he disappeared.

Mr. JARMAN - Well, after the third shot was fired, I think I got up and I run over to Harold Norman and Bonnie Ray Williams, and told them, I said, I told them that it wasn't a backfire or anything, that somebody was shooting at the President.

Mr. NORMAN. I believe it was his right arm, and I can't remember what the exact time was but I know I heard a shot, and then after I heard the shot, well, it seems as though the President, you know, slumped or something, and then another shot and I believe Jarman or someone told me, he said, "I believe someone is shooting at the President," and I think I made a statement "It is someone shooting at the President, and I believe it came from up above us."
Well, I couldn't see at all during the time but I know I heard a third shot fired, and I could also hear something sounded like the shell hulls hitting the floor and the ejecting of the rifle, it sounded as though it was to me.


JohnM

Avery Davis has established beyond all doubt that Oswald could have easily seen Jarman and Norman on the sidewalk below

BS. Your assumption, that the police men standing on the sidewalk she saw were standing right below her window, is not evidence.

Classic superficial LN: Make an (false) assumption, build a "theory" on it and reach the desired "conclusion"

Oswald would have known the two men were hanging out together because Jarman and Norman were moving through the building together and arrived at the windows directly below and since Norman could hear shells striking the floor, it follows that Oswald heard the men opening windows and assuming they weren't as quiet as church mice, Oswald would have heard them talking.

More BS. Even if Oswald was on the 6th floor - which seems unlikely - and even if he could have seen Jarman and Norman on the sidewalk - which he couldn't - and even if he heard them later on the 5th floor and recognized them from their voices, it still doesn't explain how he would have known that Jarman and Norman walked around the building and entered in the back.

When you start making up "evidence", please, at least, try to make it somewhat plausible and convincing.

« Last Edit: September 11, 2021, 02:50:00 PM by Martin Weidmann »

Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #292 on: September 11, 2021, 04:22:15 PM »
Avery Davis has established beyond all doubt that Oswald could have easily seen Jarman and Norman on the sidewalk below but that's not the only evidence that Oswald would have known the two men were hanging out together because Jarman and Norman were moving through the building together and arrived at the windows directly below and since Norman could hear shells striking the floor, it follows that Oswald heard the men opening windows and assuming they weren't as quiet as church mice, Oswald would have heard them talking.

Jarman was in the 4th window and the following GIF shows Norman in the end window and Williams who arrived a bit later was in the window next to Norman.



Depending on the exact timing, Brennan describes Oswald pausing as though to assure himself that he hit his mark and as Brennan said in his first day affidavit that "He(Oswald) did not seem to be in any hurry" and under those parameters and considering that Jarman ran over to tell the others that "someone was shooting the President" is an example where Oswald could have heard the two men. And of course Williams arriving and no doubt greeting his fellow workmates would have created more opportunities for Oswald to hear what was being said below and by whom.

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his mark, and then he disappeared.

Mr. JARMAN - Well, after the third shot was fired, I think I got up and I run over to Harold Norman and Bonnie Ray Williams, and told them, I said, I told them that it wasn't a backfire or anything, that somebody was shooting at the President.

Mr. NORMAN. I believe it was his right arm, and I can't remember what the exact time was but I know I heard a shot, and then after I heard the shot, well, it seems as though the President, you know, slumped or something, and then another shot and I believe Jarman or someone told me, he said, "I believe someone is shooting at the President," and I think I made a statement "It is someone shooting at the President, and I believe it came from up above us."
Well, I couldn't see at all during the time but I know I heard a third shot fired, and I could also hear something sounded like the shell hulls hitting the floor and the ejecting of the rifle, it sounded as though it was to me.


JohnM

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his mark, and then he disappeared.

He was STANDING

Johnny it's time to extract your head and LOOK at the photos of the window at the SE corner of the sixth floor.....

A man could NOT stand and perform the act that Brennan described at that location.

We know that there were boxes of books stacked about a foot behind the window. They would have forced any standing shooter to stand against the window.   And the shooter could not have aimed the rifle out of the HALF OPEN window. The horizontal sash at the bottom of the window would have prevented the rifle from being aimed out of the window.   If there had been a man STANDING there with a rifle and he had fired the rifle he would have fired into the cement ledge beneath the window.   

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #292 on: September 11, 2021, 04:22:15 PM »


Online Jon Banks

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #293 on: September 11, 2021, 04:23:19 PM »
Avery Davis has established beyond all doubt that Oswald could have easily seen Jarman and Norman on the sidewalk below

BS. Your assumption, that the police men standing on the sidewalk she saw were standing right below her window, is not evidence.

Classic superficial LN: Make an (false) assumption, build a "theory" on it and reach the desired "conclusion"

Oswald would have known the two men were hanging out together because Jarman and Norman were moving through the building together and arrived at the windows directly below and since Norman could hear shells striking the floor, it follows that Oswald heard the men opening windows and assuming they weren't as quiet as church mice, Oswald would have heard them talking.

More BS. Even if Oswald was on the 6th floor - which seems unlikely - and even if he could have seen Jarman and Norman on the sidewalk - which he couldn't - and even if he heard them later on the 5th floor and recognized them from their voices, it still doesn't explain how he would have known that Jarman and Norman walked around the building and entered in the back.

When you start making up "evidence", please, at least, try to make it somewhat plausible and convincing.

When LN'ers are guilty of doing the same exact things they accuse CT'ers of doing.

Online Jon Banks

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #294 on: September 11, 2021, 04:26:28 PM »
He could have picked just about anyone who worked there and said they passed by.  And they probably did given the time and location and fact that many employees were heading out for the motorcade.  Oswald had also worked there for weeks and observed the patterns of behavior.  He would have know who had lunch where and with whom on a typical day.  It would be no great feat to make something up.  More importantly, though, who saw Oswald there?  Old Ozzie was perhaps the most politically astute person in the entire TSBD workforce but he is not going to even bother to step outside to watch the presidential motorcade.  The same guy who checked JFK's book out of the library to read.  And the fantasy conspirators are going to trust the entire plot to frame Oswald to luck by allowing him to roam about the building during the assassination and not be noticed by anyone who could give him an alibi or even do the most likely thing that day to head out of the building in the company of dozens of coworkers, cameras etc.   It is laughable.

You certainly are consistent with your circular logic.

You're confident that Oswald did it therefore all inconsistencies with the evidence are irrelevant to you.

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #294 on: September 11, 2021, 04:26:28 PM »


Online Jon Banks

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Re: Oswald: No power lunch
« Reply #295 on: September 11, 2021, 04:45:58 PM »
How did they even know Oswald was in the building at the time of the shooting? That he wasn't outside watching the motorcade? Hell, that he was even at work that day?

In order to frame a person they have to be "frameable." That is, they can't have an alibi that can be corroborated by other witnesses. And that the evidence framing them is plausible.

We see all sorts of limits on the ability to frame Oswald. The conspiracy believers don't see such limits. This all powerful "they" and "them" can do anything. Plant evidence, alter films, intimidate and coerce witnesses...there are no limits. It's this conspiracy mindset that we cannot reason with. We see it in all sorts of conspiracy beliefs that always involve these powerful elements that have unlimited power.

They had such unlimited power that the only way they could stop JFK from threatening their power - by ending the Cold War, leaving Vietnam, dismantling the national security state, making nice with Castro, whatever - was to shoot him in broad daylight in the middle of a street with hundreds of people watching, many with cameras. That's simply absurd. And, if you're going to do all of this anyway, you're going to plant witnesses in the crowd to claim they saw Oswald shoot JFK. Among other things.

Attempts were made post-assassination to connect Oswald to Castro.

On November 23, members of the Cuban Student Directorate, a CIA-funded organization based in Miami, published a special edition of their monthly magazine, Trinchera (Trenches), in which they linked the accused assassin Lee Oswald to Cuban president Fidel Castro. This was the first JFK conspiracy scenario to reach public print.
https://jfkfacts.org/nov-23-1963-the-first-jfk-conspiracy-theory-paid-for-by-the-cia/


The conventional wisdom might've been that connecting a "communist" with alleged ties to Cuba to the assassination of President Kennedy would've guaranteed that Johnson go to war against Cuba the same way the CIA assumed that the failed Bay of Pigs invasion was going to force Kennedy to invade Cuba.

President Johnson's decision to stay silent about his own suspicions of a communist plot in order to avoid WWIII wasn't predictable. He defied assumptions and expectations.