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Author Topic: The "Domino Room Alibi"  (Read 8306 times)

Online Thomas Graves

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #220 on: September 20, 2019, 05:22:03 AM »
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Add Carolyn Walter, Ruby Henderson, and Johnny Powell all reporting that they saw two men on the 6th floor or an upper floor.

Gasp ... two men?

Were they within fifty feet of each other?

--  MWT   ;)

PS  Were they speaking Spanish or ... gulp ... Russian?
« Last Edit: September 20, 2019, 07:07:33 AM by Thomas Graves »

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #220 on: September 20, 2019, 05:22:03 AM »

Online John Iacoletti

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #221 on: September 20, 2019, 05:30:33 AM »
Shut up, Graves. Grownups are talking.

Online David Von Pein

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #222 on: September 20, 2019, 06:25:11 AM »
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Waiting for your shot at the sequence.....only listing events up to 12.30pm.

I'll give it a shot....

My best chronology (utilizing the items previously mentioned)....

Shelley sighting of Oswald on the first floor.

Piper sighting on the first floor.

Oswald returning to the 6th floor after noticing Jarman and Norman (the "alibi"). [DVP Interjection -- I don't think the "noticing Jarman and Norman" part happened at all. Hence, I need to place Oswald "returning to the 6th floor" BEFORE the "elevator race". But it is POSSIBLE that Oswald, for some reason, returned to the first floor AFTER the elevator race. And if that was the case, then another "Oswald Returns To The Sixth Floor" entry would be needed below, denoted with ********.]

The "Elevator Race" - Oswald on 5th floor (most likely, possibly 6th).

Givens sighting of Oswald during the cigarette trip.

Williams arriving on the fifth [sic] floor for lunch. [You surely meant to say SIXTH floor here, right? Since Williams didn't eat his lunch on the FIFTH floor that day.]

Jarman and Norman leave front of TSBD to go up.

Jarman and Norman arrive at the 5th floor windows.

Williams departing the 6th floor and joining Norman and Jarman on the 5th floor.

[*******]

Rowland sighting with man holding rifle (12.15pm).

Belknap having seizure. [Not sure what this event has to do with this particular topic, however.] ~shrug~

Ambulance arriving in DP. [Like Belknap, I can't see how this event is very meaningful to this discussion.]

Oswald taking position in the SN prior to shooting. [It's possible Oswald did this twice, though.]

Brennan sighting someone in the SN.

Euins sees someone (with a "pipe") in the 6th-floor SN window.

Oswald leaving the 6th floor.

Oswald entering the lunchroom for his coke.

Dougherty going to the 5th floor. [Dougherty's testimony is a total mess. A timeline of his actions and movements cannot be determined with any degree of accuracy, IMO.]

Dougherty taking the elevator to the first floor after the shots. [See last comment.]
« Last Edit: September 20, 2019, 06:37:30 AM by David Von Pein »

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #222 on: September 20, 2019, 06:25:11 AM »

Online Colin Crow

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #223 on: September 20, 2019, 07:01:06 AM »
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I'll give it a shot....

My best chronology (utilizing the items previously mentioned)....

Shelley sighting of Oswald on the first floor.

Piper sighting on the first floor.

Oswald returning to the 6th floor after noticing Jarman and Norman (the "alibi"). [DVP Interjection -- I don't think the "noticing Jarman and Norman" part happened at all. Hence, I need to place Oswald "returning to the 6th floor" BEFORE the "elevator race". But it is POSSIBLE that Oswald, for some reason, returned to the first floor AFTER the elevator race. And if that was the case, then another "Oswald Returns To The Sixth Floor" entry would be needed below, denoted with ********.]

The "Elevator Race" - Oswald on 5th floor (most likely, possibly 6th).

Givens sighting of Oswald during the cigarette trip.

Williams arriving on the fifth [sic] floor for lunch. [You surely meant to say SIXTH floor here, right? Since Williams didn't eat his lunch on the FIFTH floor that day.]

Jarman and Norman leave front of TSBD to go up.

Jarman and Norman arrive at the 5th floor windows.

Williams departing the 6th floor and joining Norman and Jarman on the 5th floor.

[*******]

Rowland sighting with man holding rifle (12.15pm).

Belknap having seizure. [Not sure what this event has to do with this particular topic, however.] ~shrug~

Ambulance arriving in DP. [Like Belknap, I can't see how this event is very meaningful to this discussion.]

Oswald taking position in the SN prior to shooting. [It's possible Oswald did this twice, though.]

Brennan sighting someone in the SN.

Euins sees someone (with a "pipe") in the 6th-floor SN window.

Oswald leaving the 6th floor.

Oswald entering the lunchroom for his coke.

Dougherty going to the 5th floor. [Dougherty's testimony is a total mess. A timeline of his actions and movements cannot be determined with any degree of accuracy, IMO.]

Dougherty taking the elevator to the first floor after the shots. [See last comment.]

I believe the “elevator race” occurred before noon. The 6th floor guys left after Shelley went downstairs. See the comment I posted earlier in Frazier’s Oral History that the men were allowed to break early for lunch that day. In the scheme of things shows Oswald on 5 or 6 before noon.

Givens’ story is an interesting “development” that has been long debated. Let’s set it aside (for now)

 Jarman and Norman did not arrive on the 5th floor until after 12.20pm. Really happy to debate that one as it shows that BRW was on the 6th floor after Rowland’s observation . Probably the key event in the sequence.

Belknap’s seizure is inserted as we have the timestamp to the ambulance call on police radio. It also fits with Brennan taking position.

Dougherty took the west elevator up after Jarman and Norman, leaving the gates open, so that Truly could not call it down after the shots. He also brought it down after Truly and Baker started up the stairs and before they arrived at the 5th. That is his significance, if you want to add someone else who did that be my guest.

PS the correction about Williams having lunch on 6 rather than 5 is acknowleged. Maybe I was going by the statements by Jarman and Norman prior to their WC hearings  :)
« Last Edit: September 20, 2019, 07:04:06 AM by Colin Crow »

Online Thomas Graves

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #224 on: September 20, 2019, 07:05:27 AM »
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Shut up, Graves. Grownups are talking.

Shut up, Iacoletti.

What you posted sounded very, very sinister!

Two men?

At the same time??

Wowie zowie.

I think you've cracked the case!

--  MWT   ;)

« Last Edit: September 20, 2019, 07:06:20 AM by Thomas Graves »

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #224 on: September 20, 2019, 07:05:27 AM »

Online Thomas Graves

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #225 on: September 20, 2019, 07:13:34 AM »
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I believe the “elevator race” occurred before noon. The 6th floor guys left after Shelley went downstairs. See the comment I posted earlier in Frazier’s Oral History that the men were allowed to break early for lunch that day. In the scheme of things shows Oswald on 5 or 6 before noon.

Givens’ story is an interesting “development” that has been long debated. Let’s set it aside (for now)

 Jarman and Norman did not arrive on the 5th floor until after 12.20pm. Really happy to debate that one as it shows that BRW was on the 6th floor after Rowland’s observation . Probably the key event in the sequence.

Belknap’s seizure is inserted as we have the timestamp to the ambulance call on police radio. It also fits with Brennan taking position.

Dougherty took the west elevator up after Jarman and Norman, leaving the gates open, so that Truly could not call it down after the shots. He also brought it down after Truly and Baker started up the stairs and before they arrived at the 5th. That is his significance, if you want to add someone else who did that be my guest.

PS the correction about Williams having lunch on 6 rather than 5 is acknowleged. Maybe I was going by the statements by Jarman and Norman prior to their WC hearings  :)

Colin,

Do you think Big Jack was "in on the deal," or were those two really, really suspicious "elevator thingies" just coincidences, gosh darn it?

--  MWT   ;)



Online Colin Crow

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #226 on: September 20, 2019, 07:14:59 AM »
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Colin,

Do you think Big Jack was "in on the deal," or were those two really, really suspicious "elevator thingies" just coincidences, gosh darn it?

--  MWT   ;)

No. I don't believe JD was involved.

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #226 on: September 20, 2019, 07:14:59 AM »

Online Colin Crow

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #227 on: September 20, 2019, 07:48:34 AM »
For David re Belknap......another interesting piece of information.....regarding Frazier's arrival at the steps.

Gary: OK. Do you remember a… an ambulance in Dealey Plaza before
the motorcade came by?
Buell: (shaking head) No.
Gary: Have you heard about that since then? That an ambulance came by
to pick up a guy?
Buell: You hear a lot of things, but I haven’t heard anything about that.
Gary: OK. That’s… that’s an event where, if you have been there, if you
had seen it, you probably would have remembered it. The ambulance was gone a good
five minutes before Kennedy came by, so… so that means… that tells me that you
probably didn’t get out on the steps until about 12:25
, and Kennedy came by at 12:30.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2019, 07:50:30 AM by Colin Crow »

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #227 on: September 20, 2019, 07:48:34 AM »

Online Colin Crow

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #228 on: September 20, 2019, 01:38:09 PM »
For David.....

Jarman and Norman departing for the 5th floor.

Mr. BALL - The sidewalk in front of the Texas School Book Depository Building?
Mr. JARMAN - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - How long did you stand there?
Mr. JARMAN - Well, until about 12:20, between 12:20 and 12:25.

BALL. Did you stay there?
Mr. NORMAN. Well, we stayed there I believe until we got the news that the motorcade was coming down, let's see, is that Commerce, no Main, because Commerce- we went back in the building, James Jarman and I.

A timeline of the Presidential Motorcade with taken from Dallas Police Radio suggests Motorcade got to Main about 12.24pm.

What do you base your belief that those two arrived on the 5th floor before 12.15 pm on?

Online Colin Crow

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #229 on: September 20, 2019, 01:39:44 PM »
Jarman and Norman did not eat lunch together that day. I think John alluded to that earlier. They met close to the TSBD entrance and went outside.

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Re: The "Domino Room Alibi"
« Reply #229 on: September 20, 2019, 01:39:44 PM »

 

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