Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?

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Author Topic: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?  (Read 102547 times)

Offline Colin Crow

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Re: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?
« Reply #84 on: September 05, 2018, 11:37:57 PM »
And how do we explain the deception attempted by Williams, Jarman and Norman that continued for some time. The statements that implied Williams ascended to the 5th floor with the others?

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?
« Reply #85 on: September 05, 2018, 11:42:14 PM »
Brennan thought the gunman was "standing" in the same sense as the black men were "standing" on the fifth floor.

Right.  So if the guy Brennan saw had actually stood up after the last shot then Brennan would have known that he wasn't standing prior to that.  But he didn't.

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But Rowland claimed he saw the standing rifleman from the top of his head to "about 6 inches below his waist, below his belt."

Again, that works if the guy is standing far enough behind the window.

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And standing back (as towards the North) even a few feet would mean he was obscured from Rowland's view by the building's brick facade.

I don't agree.  Not at Rowland's angle.  Look at the Hess video again.  Well, I guess it depends on how far back the gunman was.  How about back towards the northwest?
« Last Edit: September 05, 2018, 11:45:36 PM by John Iacoletti »

Online Mitch Todd

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Re: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?
« Reply #86 on: September 06, 2018, 02:00:29 AM »
Because they still wanted to tick off the "saw a guy with a rifle on the 6th floor" box.  They just couldn't have another guy being there at the time.  So they had to also disregard Carolyn Walther, Ruby Henderson, Norman Similas, and Johnny Powell.

Whatever it takes.

Carolyn Walther, she of "She is positive this window was not as high as the sixth floor"?
Ruby Henderson, who's account sounds a lot like her seeing Jarman and Norman?
The Norm Similas whom the RCMP decided was a hoax? The Similas who claimed that a Secret Service agent opened the door of the limo in Dealey Plaza to reveal JFK on the floor?
The Johnny Powell who pops out of the woodwork a decade and a half later?


Offline Nicholas Turner

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Re: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?
« Reply #87 on: September 06, 2018, 07:39:25 AM »
Best to describe it using an image  ;D

The African-American male was seen first, then the white male gunman was seen on the same floor at 12.15 pm. The gunman was only observed once.

The African-American male was no longer seen in the SE corner from ~12.25 pm.



A larger view of the lady in the window



Mr. ROWLAND - From where I was standing I could see from his head to about 6 inches below his waist, below his belt.
Mr. SPECTER - Could you see as far as his knees?
Mr. ROWLAND - No.

Rowland's POV



Thanks. Where does he say he saw the African American person first please? Is it correct he only mentioned on person in his affidavid given on the day?

Offline Nicholas Turner

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Re: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?
« Reply #88 on: September 06, 2018, 08:22:05 AM »
Mr. ROWLAND. At the time I saw the man in the other window, I saw this man hanging out the window first. It was a colored man, I think.
Representative FORD. Is this the same window where you saw the man standing with the rifle?
Mr. ROWLAND. No; this was the one on the east end of the building, the one that they said the shots were fired from.
Representative FORD. I am not clear on this now. The window that you saw the man that you describe was on what end of the building?
Mr. ROWLAND. The west, southwest corner.
Representative FORD. And the man you saw hanging out from the window was at what corner?
Mr. ROWLAND. The east, southeast corner.
Representative FORD. Southeast corner. On the same floor?
Mr. ROWLAND. On the same floor.
Representative FORD. When did you notice him?
Mr. ROWLAND. This was before I noticed the other man with the rifle.
Representative FORD. I see. This was before you saw the man in the window with the rifle?
Mr. ROWLAND. Yes.

Arnold did not mention seeing the African-American male in any statement. He did not know where the shots were fired from until the Saturday. He told the FBI agents about seeing the African-American male but they were only interested in seeing if he could ID the white male gunman.

He DID tell Deputy Sheriff Craig that he saw TWO men on the 6th floor, ten minutes post assassination.

Thanks, find his testimony a little hard to understand. Where is the evidence he told Sheriff Craig please?

Offline Nicholas Turner

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Re: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?
« Reply #89 on: September 06, 2018, 08:41:30 AM »
Am watching Roger Craig's interview where he says this.

Offline Nicholas Turner

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Re: Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?
« Reply #90 on: September 06, 2018, 08:53:49 AM »
Mr. SPECTER. When, if at all, did you first report what you had observed in the Texas School Book Depository Building about the man with the rifle to anyone in an official position?
Mr. ROWLAND. That was approximately 15 minutes after the third report that I went to an officer, he was a plainclothesman who was there combing the area, close to position "C," looking for footprints and such as this, some lady said someone jumped off one of the colonnades and started running, there was an officer looking in this area for footprints and such as this.
Mr. SPECTER. Was that lady ever identified to you?
Mr. ROWLAND. No; I do not remember his name. He introduced himself and showed me his ID.
Mr. SPECTER. I mean the lady you talked about.
Mr. ROWLAND. No; I don't.
Mr. SPECTER. Now as to the officer to whom you made a report, was he a State, City or Federal official, if you know?
Mr. ROWLAND. It was a Dallas detective.

Mr. BELIN. Did anyone say they had seen anything?such as a rifle?
Mr. CRAIG. Yes; later on. A few minutes after that?I had taken this girl to one of our criminal investigators?and was talking to some other people. I talked to a young couple and the boy said he saw two men on the?uh?sixth floor of the Book Depository Building over there; one of them had a rifle with the telescopic sight on it?but he thought they were Secret Service agents on guard and didn't report it. This was about?uh?oh, he said, 15 minutes before the motorcade ever arrived.
Mr. BELIN. Do you remember if that boy's name would have been Arnold Rowland?(spelling) R-o-w-l-a-n-d?
Mr. CRAIG. Yes.
Mr. BELIN. Does that sound like it?
Mr. CRAIG. Yes; it sounds like the name?yes.
Mr. BELIN. His wife might be Barbara Rowland?
Mr. CRAIG. Yes; I believe her name was Barbara.

The "two men on the 6th floor,....one with a rifle" could only have come from Arnold Rowland.

Hence Arnold had corroboration from a law enforcement officer some 10 - 15 minutes post assassination while in Dealey Plaza.

Thanks again.