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Author Topic: Oswald's revolver  (Read 7334 times)

Offline Steve Thomas

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Oswald's revolver
« on: January 11, 2018, 12:21:02 PM »
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Since all the previous posts are gone...

The following seems odd to me.

Oswald has been arrested in the Theater and they get in the car. Carroll, the driver has Oswald's gun in his belt. He hands the gun to Hill who is sitting next to him in the front seat. Hill breaks the gun open to see if there are any live rounds in it. Hill tells the WC:

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/hill_gl.htm
Mr. HILL. Then I broke the gun open to see how many shells it contained and how many live rounds it had in it.
Mr. BELIN. How many did you find?
Mr. HILL. There were six in the chambers of the gun. One of them had an indention in the primer that appeared to be caused by the hammer. There were five others. All of the shells at this time had indentions.
All of the shells appeared to have at one time or another scotch tape on them because in an area that would have been the width of a half inch strip of scotch tape, there was kind of a bit of lint and residue on the jacket of the shell.

Scotch tape?

Wouldn't you just grab a handfull of shells out of the box and stick them in your pocket?
Did the shells the police found in Oswald's pocket about 4 hours after they brought him into the station also have scotch tape residue on them?

Steve Thomas


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Oswald's revolver
« on: January 11, 2018, 12:21:02 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2018, 01:07:24 PM »
Since all the previous posts are gone...

The following seems odd to me.

Oswald has been arrested in the Theater and they get in the car. Carroll, the driver has Oswald's gun in his belt. He hands the gun to Hill who is sitting next to him in the front seat. Hill breaks the gun open to see if there are any live rounds in it. Hill tells the WC:

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/hill_gl.htm
Mr. HILL. Then I broke the gun open to see how many shells it contained and how many live rounds it had in it.
Mr. BELIN. How many did you find?
Mr. HILL. There were six in the chambers of the gun. One of them had an indention in the primer that appeared to be caused by the hammer. There were five others. All of the shells at this time had indentions.
All of the shells appeared to have at one time or another scotch tape on them because in an area that would have been the width of a half inch strip of scotch tape, there was kind of a bit of lint and residue on the jacket of the shell.

Scotch tape?

Wouldn't you just grab a handfull of shells out of the box and stick them in your pocket?
Did the shells the police found in Oswald's pocket about 4 hours after they brought him into the station also have scotch tape residue on them?

Steve Thomas

Mr. HILL. There were six in the chambers of the gun. One of them had an indention in the primer that appeared to be caused by the hammer. There were five others. All of the shells at this time had indentions.
All of the shells appeared to have at one time or another scotch tape on them because in an area that would have been the width of a half inch strip of scotch tape, there was kind of a bit of lint and residue on the jacket of the shell.


There is photo of the cartridges that Hill took from the revolver.....There was no bandoleer belt residue on the bullets  that he removed.....However there IS leather residue on the bullets that were presented to the Warren Commission......  Indicating that the WC cartridges had been stored in a cartridge belt, and they  are NOT the same bullets that Hill removed from the revolver.

Offline Gary Craig

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2018, 01:56:52 PM »
https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/Photos_-_NARA_Evidence_Photos.html




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http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh3/html/WC_Vol3_0242b.htm

Mr. Eisenberg: Now, you said that there were three bullets of Winchester-Western manufacture, those are 602,603, and 605
and one bullet of R.-P. manufacture.
Mr. Cunningham: That is correct.
Mr. Eisenberg: However, as to the cartridge cases, Exhibit 594, you told us there were two R.-P. cartridge cases and two
Winchester-Western cartridge cases.
Mr. Cunningham: That is correct.
Mr. Eisenberg: So that the recovered cartridge cases, there is one more recovered R.-P. cartridge case than there was
recovered bullet?
Mr. Cunningham: Yes
Mr. Eisenberg: And as to the bullets, there is one more recovered Winchester-Western bullet than there is Winchester-Western
cartridges?
Mr. Cunningham: That is correct.
Mr. Eisenberg: How would you account for that?
Mr. Cunningham: The possibility exits that one bullet is missing. Also, they may not have found one of the cartridges.
Representative Boggs: Are you able to match the bullet with the cartridge case?
Mr. Cunningham: It is not possible.
Representative Boggs: So that while you can establish the fact that the cartridge case, the four that we have, were fired
in that gun---
Mr. Cunningham: Yes Sir.
Representative Boggs: You cannot establish the fact that the bullets were fired in that gun?
Mr. Cunningham: That is correct.
Representative Boggs: And you cannot--having the cartridge case and the bullet--you cannot match them up?
Mr. Cunningham: No, you can't.

---------------

Mr. EISENBERG. Now, were you able to determine whether those bullets have been fired in this weapon?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. No; I was not.
Mr. EISENBERG. Can you explain why?
Mr. CUNNINGHAM. Yes, sir.
First of all, Commission Exhibit No. 602 was too mutilated. There were not sufficient microscopic marks remaining on the
surface of this bullet, due to the mutilation, to determine whether or not it had been fired from this weapon.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2018, 02:34:34 PM by Gary Craig »

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2018, 01:56:52 PM »


Offline Steve Thomas

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2018, 03:53:29 PM »

There is photo of the cartridges that Hill took from the revolver.....There was no bandoleer belt residue on the bullets  that he removed.....However there IS leather residue on the bullets that were presented to the Warren Commission......  Indicating that the WC cartridges had been stored in a cartridge belt, and they  are NOT the same bullets that Hill removed from the revolver.

Walt,

Are you thinking of this photo?
http://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2010/12/tippit-murder-why-conspiracy-theorists.html
Scroll about halfway down the page.

Steve Thomas

Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2018, 03:56:41 PM »
Sgt. Hill was caught on police tape stating:

   The shells at the scene indicate that the suspect is armed with an automatic 38, rather than a pistol.

Hill was a notorious liar.

Hill was a notorious liar.

Yes.... and it doesn't require a PSE expert to verify ....However George O'Toole ( author of "The Assassination Tapes"   did analyze many of Hill's statements and concluded that Hill was a damned liar.   

O'Toole says that Hill stated that Fritz would not have ordered the polygraph test to be given to Buell frazier because according to Hill, Captain  Fritz didn't believe in using the polygraph  ( incredible) and wouldn't allow his subordinates to employ the polygraph......   At least a half dozen other police officers refuted Hill's lie.....  among those who refuted Hill's lie was the chief polygraph officer Paul Bentley who told O'Toole that he had performed hundreds of polygraph exams for Captain Fritz ....... 


JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2018, 03:56:41 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2018, 04:06:37 PM »
Walt,

Are you thinking of this photo?
http://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2010/12/tippit-murder-why-conspiracy-theorists.html
Scroll about halfway down the page.

Steve Thomas
Image #10 shows Hill with a revolver in his right hand and six live cartridges in his left hand.....The cartridges are nice and shiny clean......

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2018, 05:44:20 PM »

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2018, 05:44:20 PM »


Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Oswald's revolver
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2018, 05:46:38 PM »
Yes.... and it doesn't require a PSE expert to verify ....However George O'Toole ( author of "The Assassination Tapes"   did analyze many of Hill's statements and concluded that Hill was a damned liar.   

Voice stress analysis is pseudoscience.  Not unlike polygraphs and handwriting analysis.