Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?

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Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?
« Reply #126 on: September 21, 2023, 06:36:05 PM »
Question!

How many seconds after the final shot did this DPD radio dispatch go out?

“Stand by one. All units and officers in vicinity of station report to the railroad track area, just north of Elm. Report to the railroad track area, just north of Elm.”

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?
« Reply #127 on: September 21, 2023, 07:01:35 PM »
I agree with you on the Ms. Calvery & Mr. Lovelady identifications, but not even Mr. Shelley's suit made him look this broad:


The man in Darnell is too large IMO

There's no way to compare the physique of the two men in these pictures. All that can be said is that both are wearing baggy, dark coloured suits.
Lovelady's testimony (I really am not a fan of relying on his or Shelley's words unless I feel they are corroborated) states that Shelley was close by while he was having his interaction with Gloria. Shelley states he returned to the steps after meeting Gloria which I believe is what the Darnell clip shows. It seems fairly well established both men left this area together so we should see them in fairly close proximity during this moment.
I'm not seeing anything conclusive in terms of the comparison above to jettison the identification.

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?
« Reply #128 on: September 21, 2023, 07:11:38 PM »
Separate issue, so treating it separately here.............

Officer Baker is not heading for the steps.

Mr. BAKER - At this point, I looked down here as I was parking my motorcycle and these people on this ground here, on the sidewalk, there were several of them falling, and they were rolling around down there, and all these people were rushing back, a lot of them were grabbing their children, and I noticed one, I didn't know who he was, but there was a man ran out into the crowd and back.
Mr. BELIN - Did you notice anything else?
Mr. BAKER - Except there was a woman standing--well, all these people were running, and there was a woman screaming, "Oh, they have shot that man, they have shot that man."


He's half-telling us an all-important fact here: there was indeed a woman standing, and Darnell shows him running in a straight line not for the entrance steps but for her:




Officer Baker is not heading for the steps.

Not to be pedantic but I actually said that "Baker reaches the area near the bottom of the steps", which is correct. The point I was making was that he was close enough to hear Gloria's "hysterics" and made a comment about it.

Darnell shows him running in a straight line not for the entrance steps but for her

It doesn't show him running "for her", it shows him running in her direction.
There is no credible reason why Baker has pulled up his bike and made a bee-line straight for the woman you are pointing out.
"What are you doing with a homemade paper bag?" 
I'm not convinced.


Offline Michael Welch

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Re: Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?
« Reply #129 on: September 21, 2023, 07:46:07 PM »
Hi Dan and Alan,
According to Shelley,

“Immediately following the shooting, Billy N. Lovelady and I accompanied some uniformed officers to the railroad yards just west of the building and returned through the westside door of the building about ten minutes later. I remained in the building until about 1.30p.m. When I was asked to go to the Dallas Police Dept to furnish an affidavit.”  credit the great Ray Mitcham!  There was no Gloria encounter on the steps! It happened at the corner of the park----the Grassy Knoll by the concrete arcade like Bill and Officer Smith said! Thank you both for everything! Sincerely yours, Michael

Seems Vicki and Sarah must have taken ten minutes to exit the building.

https://catalog.archives.gov/id/7461156    page 20

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?
« Reply #130 on: September 21, 2023, 09:23:41 PM »
There's no way to compare the physique of the two men in these pictures. All that can be said is that both are wearing baggy, dark coloured suits.

I disagree. Look also at the footage of Mr. Shelley being led to the cop car with Messrs. Williams & Arce. He's not a big man. The guy is Darnell is too burly, broad-shouldered IMO

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Lovelady's testimony (I really am not a fan of relying on his or Shelley's words unless I feel they are corroborated) states that Shelley was close by while he was having his interaction with Gloria.

Well, he and Mr. Shelley testify that NEITHER of them leaves the steps until after Ms. Calvery comes running up. Mr. Shelley (and you are under no illusion about this) is lying, and Mr. Lovelady is covering for him.

If what you are saying happened is what actually happened, what reason would Mr. Shelley possibly have for lying about it? He ran out, bumped into Ms. Calvery, then ran back to the steps. No big deal, right?
« Last Edit: September 21, 2023, 09:32:12 PM by Alan Ford »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?
« Reply #131 on: September 21, 2023, 09:28:13 PM »
Darnell shows him running in a straight line not for the entrance steps but for her

It doesn't show him running "for her", it shows him running in her direction.

It does indeed. And what other reason would he have for running in her direction? Letters he urgently needs to post?
 
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There is no credible reason why Baker has pulled up his bike and made a bee-line straight for the woman you are pointing out.
"What are you doing with a homemade paper bag?" 
I'm not convinced.

Strawman.

What do you think she's holding up btw?

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: Where Did Prayer Woman Go After The Shooting?
« Reply #132 on: September 21, 2023, 10:13:17 PM »
It does indeed. And what other reason would he have for running in her direction? Letters he urgently needs to post?

He's heading towards the TSBD building. The place where he thinks the shots are coming from.
What do you think he's doing?

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Strawman.

??
How is it a strawman?

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What do you think she's holding up btw?

Whatever it is it appears to have a sleeve.