Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie

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Author Topic: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie  (Read 5992 times)

Offline Jack Nessan

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #190 on: August 05, 2022, 02:05:17 PM »
This is all you've got, Mr Nessan? Really. Gee, I feel your pain.

You claimed there was no police presence behind the Depository early enough for Ms Adams' timestamp for her exit. I proved you wrong.

You claimed there was no police presence at the front door of the Depository early enough for Ms Adams' account of speaking to an officer there when she wished to return inside the building. I proved you wrong.

After that, it's just been embarrassed histrionics from you

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You did not prove anything at all. That is the point. This is what you call proof?

A Ford:
"in all likelihood Officer Eugene Welcome Barnett"
"it may well have been Officer Barnett"


Why the reluctance to quote Barnett? You are all over the place but stop short of admitting how silly your theory about Barnett is. You can't even admit you are talking about him because it is so ridiculous.

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #190 on: August 05, 2022, 02:05:17 PM »

Offline Jack Nessan

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #191 on: August 05, 2022, 02:11:15 PM »
This post is utterly meaningless, nonsensical and irrelevant.
It is obviously a tactic employed to disguise how out of your depth you are.
But I'll throw you a bone...
Rather than deal with the list I presented in full, just critique one point, any point you want and explain to me, and everyone else what is wrong with it:

Adams herself insists this has been fabricated.
Styles confirms no such encounter took place.
Shelley contradicts this encounter by saying he thought he saw Adams later on and on the fourth floor.
Lovelady has clearly been coached about Vickie Adams.
Lovelady admits he didn't re-enter the TSBD building for 20-25 minutes after the assassination.
Adams states in her WC testimony she left within seconds.
Both Garner and Styles confirm that Adams left immediately.
Garner's interview with Ernest corroborates the Stroud document.

Just a thought, but maybe instead of throwing me a bone, how about grow a pair. No one is asking you to do anything but provide the proof of what you are posting. It is your list feel free to quote these people. Obviously, your other post was pure nonsense, when it was questioned it sure disappeared in a hurry and replaced by whatever goofy nonsense this is.

 There must not be any basis for your statements or there would not seem to be such a problem quoting them. Basically, you are admitting there is no proof of any kind. Just idle BS.


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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #191 on: August 05, 2022, 02:11:15 PM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #192 on: August 05, 2022, 03:38:37 PM »
You did not prove anything at all. That is the point. This is what you call proof?

A Ford:
"in all likelihood Officer Eugene Welcome Barnett"
"it may well have been Officer Barnett"

 :D

Translation 'I can no longer claim that Ms Adams couldn't possibly have encountered a police officer in that area so soon after the shooting, so I'm going to cry myself an angry river'

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #192 on: August 05, 2022, 03:38:37 PM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #193 on: August 05, 2022, 04:30:50 PM »
Just a thought, but maybe instead of throwing me a bone, how about grow a pair. No one is asking you to do anything but provide the proof of what you are posting. It is your list feel free to quote these people. Obviously, your other post was pure nonsense, when it was questioned it sure disappeared in a hurry and replaced by whatever goofy nonsense this is.

 There must not be any basis for your statements or there would not seem to be such a problem quoting them. Basically, you are admitting there is no proof of any kind. Just idle BS.

More cringe stuff from Mr Nessan

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #193 on: August 05, 2022, 04:30:50 PM »

Offline Jack Nessan

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #194 on: August 06, 2022, 05:51:45 PM »
More cringe stuff from Mr Nessan

Many thanks to you and Dan. By making false claims and posting dubious evidence and completely failing to provide a legitimate supported alternative scenario, it only served to prove the official WC conclusions are the correct ones. Too bad Barry Ernest had not taken the time to read the WC Witness testimonies. He could have saved himself the effort of writing the book.

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #194 on: August 06, 2022, 05:51:45 PM »

Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #195 on: August 06, 2022, 06:45:24 PM »
Many thanks to you and Dan. By making false claims and posting dubious evidence and completely failing to provide a legitimate supported alternative scenario, it only served to prove the official WC conclusions are the correct ones. Too bad Barry Ernest had not taken the time to read the WC Witness testimonies. He could have saved himself the effort of writing the book.

Too bad Barry Ernest had not taken the time to read the WC Witness testimonies.

Oh, but he did. He just isn't as gullible as you.


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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #195 on: August 06, 2022, 06:45:24 PM »

Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #196 on: August 06, 2022, 10:31:16 PM »
Nice work Dan, but it has all been viewed before. You don't need to do any research, just read back a few pages in the thread and you will see why this post is completely wrong. The Stroud document is a joke. Styles and Adams did not leave as quickly as they thought they did.

 :D :D :D

You call the Stroud Document a joke. Based on what....your own personal opinion?

And it's only your opinion that "Styles and Adams did not leave as quickly as they thought they did".

No facts presented here.   

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #196 on: August 06, 2022, 10:31:16 PM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #197 on: August 07, 2022, 05:40:31 AM »
Many thanks to you and Dan. By making false claims and posting dubious evidence and completely failing to provide a legitimate supported alternative scenario, it only served to prove the official WC conclusions are the correct ones.

Finish the sentence for us, Mr Nessan:

Officer Barnett could not possibly have been the police officer Ms Adams & Ms Styles encountered behind the Depository because...................................

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #197 on: August 07, 2022, 05:40:31 AM »

Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #198 on: August 07, 2022, 11:05:06 AM »
Friends, let us be clear about what Mr Piper is actually telling us when he uses these words: "he [Mr Truly] ran up on up the steps with this police officer--him and another fellow and I was standing there and the people began swarming out and around--different ones coming in, but it was where nobody could come out"

These words make ZERO sense if applied to the rear area of the first floor.

They make sense ONLY if applied to the front of the first floor.

At the time Mr Piper saw Mr Truly and Officer Baker go up the stairs, he was facing and looking at the front lobby/entrance.

After seeing Mr Truly and Officer Baker run up the stairs, he was still standing there, i.e. in the same place-------a place that offered a clear line of sight to the front lobby/entrance

He saw people already outside who were swarming out and around towards the street

He saw some people (after Truly/officer had left) coming in through the front door

But it was where no one could come out from the inside front of the building to the outside that lay beyond the glass door-------------because Mr Piper would have noticed them.



And we can now make sense of this:

Mr. BALL. Did you ever see Vicki Adams come down the steps?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir; I don't know about that, if she said she did, it was after I got over here and walked over to the back door.
Mr. BALL. Did Vicki Adams come down before Truly and the man went up the steps?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir, no, sir; she didn't do it.


Mr Piper is stating that he never saw Ms Adams come down the front stairway, though he is allowing for the possibility that she may indeed have come down it after he moved away and went to the back of the first floor



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Great point Mr. Ford and one that's rarely brought up.

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #198 on: August 07, 2022, 11:05:06 AM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Messrs Shelley & Lovelady: The Big Lie
« Reply #199 on: August 07, 2022, 02:41:48 PM »
Great point Mr. Ford and one that's rarely brought up.

Thanking you kindly, Mr Plant!  Thumb1:

Mr Piper's claimed vantage point for the P. Parade--------------one of the 'windows' at the front of the first floor--------------would have been credible if the assassination had happened the previous year:



I believe Mr Piper watched the P. Parade from inside the building vestibule.

Here's what he told the Sheriff's Dept.:



Here's what he told the FBI:



Notice the use here of "standing" (not sitting). There was but one set of south-facing windows worthy of the name on the first floor. And to see out of there, especially with a crowd of people on the steps, one had to be standing up.



Mr Piper was, in short, in the perfect place to see Officer Baker and Mr Truly come running in and go up the FRONT stairs. And the perfect place to see Mr Oswald step outside to watch the P. Parade.

His witnessing of these things was disastrous to the official story. Hence his need to pretend to have watched the motorcade from somewhere else. Unfortunately, he chose for that somewhere else----------a blind spot!

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« Last Edit: August 07, 2022, 03:00:58 PM by Alan Ford »

 

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