Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?

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Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #32 on: April 15, 2021, 05:24:34 AM »
Here is an excerpt from the Kennedy Assassination website, with my comments.
Witnesses Make Wild and Wacky Statements
Anybody who reads the unfiltered and unselected witness testimony will quickly find that even honest sober witnesses have wild, wacky, and often downright bizarre elements in their testimony. Consider, for example:
J.C. Price, who thought that Kennedy and Connally were in different cars in the motorcade, and that a final shot was fired at the motorcade as much as five minutes after the first shots.
Sam Holland, who thought that after Kennedy was shot Jackie "jumped up and tried to get over in the back seat to him."

My Comment:  Holland's complete statement is very interesting & i will look into it in more detail later.

Bill Newman, who thought that the President, after the first shot rang out, "jumped up in his seat" and "was standing up."
Austin Miller, who thought the sound of shots during the shooting came from inside the President's limo.

My Comment:  Hickey's auto burst of 4 or 5 or 6 shots from Queen Mary would have sounded as if inside JFK's limo.  Miller was on top of the underpass.

Mrs. Joseph Eddie Dean, who said that after the first shot she saw Kennedy "reach to the back of his neck" before slumping down.
My Comment:  JFK did reach to the back of his neck, but we know that that was at Zapruder Z113 when he was hit by shrapnel from Oswald's shot-1 which ricocheted off the signal arm guy rod.  Dean was standing on the steps of the TSBD, ie level with the signals.  Her words confirm that Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.   Towner's footage does indeed show JFK raising his right hand to his neck, which i have pointed out in my other thread.

Jack Franzen, who said he saw Secret Service agents in the car behind the presidential limousine"unloading from the car, some with firearms in their hands . . . ."
My Comment:  Three agents got off Queen Mary Ė Hill, who climbed onto JFK's limo Ė Landis & Ready, who then got back onto the running board (we know that both got off the running board because we can see their feet touching the tarmac under Queen Mary in Nix footage)(everyone knows that Ready jumped off & on, but i alone have pointed out before that Landis also jumped off & on).

Marvin Faye Chism, who said:
The President's wife immediately stood over him, and she pulled him up, and lay him down in the seat, and she stood up over him in the car. The President was standing and waving and smiling at the people when the shot happened. . . . The two men in the front of the car stood up, and then when the second shot was fired, they all fell down and the car took off just like that. (Decker Exhibit 5323, 19H472)

My Comment:  We know that at Z313 Hickey in Queen Mary stood fully up & then fell, which is why he accidentally fired his auto burst with his AR15.  Later, in the JFK limo, Jackie got up a little, but she didnít fall, but anyhow she aint a man.  Just before Hickey fell Hill jumped down to chase the JFK limo, & later Hill tried say three times to get up on the back step, &  fell off say twice.  And Landis & Ready jumped off the running board of Queen Mary, but then got back on, but that was well before Hickey stood up & fell.  I think Chism is referring to Hickey & Hill.

A. J. Millican, who testified that:
Just after the President's car passed, I heard three shots come from up toward Houston and Elm right by the Book Depository Building, and then immediately I heard two more shots come from the Arcade between the Book Store and the Underpass, and then three more shots came from the same direction only sounded further back. (Decker Exhibit 5323, 19H486)

My Comment:  So Millican heard 8 shots.  I reckon that Oswald fired 2 shots & Hickey fired 4 or 5 or 6, ie perhaps 8 shots in all.  Millican probly heard 3 shots plus echoes.  Hickey's auto burst at 400 rps would have sounded like a single shot unless u were very close by.

Millican also testified that: "A man standing on the South side of Elm Street, was either hit in the foot, or the ankle and fell down." (ibid.)
Sometimes, it's easy to see how the witness might have been wrong. Jack Franzen, for example, probably saw reporters and photographers leaving the various press cars (several cars behind the Presidential limo), and perhaps also got a glance of Agent Hickey in the follow-up car brandishing an AR-15. Millican may well have seen someone like Malcolm Summers hit the ground and assumed he had been shot.
But in other cases, heaven knows where the witness got that piece of testimony.

« Last Edit: April 16, 2021, 03:24:50 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #32 on: April 15, 2021, 05:24:34 AM »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #33 on: April 29, 2021, 12:07:08 AM »
Hickey was indeed a tall dude.
Yes, when he was fully standing in the back of Queen Mary the AR15 didnít have to be at his shoulder for an accidental slug to clear the Queen Mary windshield.
See my Reply#5 on page 1 of this thread, this shows the famous drawing of the needed elevation of the AR15, with my new overlay.
This pix is the only decent pix i could find of Hickey. 
He was one of the first Agents to react, swinging around to look for a sniper, then quickly picking up his AR15.
But an acceleration or a braking of Queen Mary caused him to accidentally squeeze the trigger, triggering an auto-burst.
Either that or the AR15 01 suffered a slamfire where it auto-fired without anyone touching the trigger.
The slamfire problem was fixed in the 02 model by taking 2 gm off the wt of the firing pin.
It was rotten luck, he was only doing his job.
Notice that there is no crack in the glass left of the mirror. 
Notice there is no dent in the chrome trim above & right of the mirror.
The vertical angle of the slug that (at Z314) made the dent happens to be exactly the same angle as the vertical angle from the camera lens to the chrome trim that we see in this pix. The slug cleared the top of the rollbar by say 1/8".
Notice that there is no hole in the carpet tween the jump seats. But there will be a hole in the floor of the limo after shot-1 ricochets off the signal arm.

« Last Edit: May 09, 2021, 02:37:45 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #34 on: April 29, 2021, 02:32:43 AM »
Hickey's Colt Armalite AR15 01 we now know didnít have a BURST mode, it had an AUTO mode. 
And we can be fairly certain that Hickey accidentally fired an auto burst of at least 4 shots, probably 5, possibly 6.
Here is my latest effort re a possible arc for a 6-shot burst.
The first shot is the JFK headshot.  The remnant slug exits & cracks the windshield where shown just left of the mirror.
Shot-2 puts a dent in the chrome trim above & right of the mirror. Fragments dent the back of the mirror.
Shot-3 hits the tarmac of Elm St.
Shot-4 hits the concrete curb.
Shot-5 hits grass.
Shot-6 hits the tarmac of Main St & ricochets onto the curb 23'4" from the pier, near Tague.
Tague's left cheek is stung & bloodied by a fragment of lead from Shot-3 or 4 or 6.
The 52 grain deformed remnant of the 55 grain slug from shot-6 or 4 or 3 is found buried on top of the triple underpass by Lester using a detector in 1974.
This freeze frame from Dale Myers' cartoon footage does not show accurately Hickey's view from Queen Mary (i should say the AR15's view), but it will have to do.
[edit][as explained in my thread Bronson Saw Hickey Shoot JFK the Bronson film frame B09 is at Zapruder Z319 & B09 shows Hickey sitting high up in his seat holding the AR15 up at 50 deg, & we know that the JFK headshot was at Z313, hence if Hickey had a 6 shot burst then shot-6 had to be the headshot & shot-5 had to dent the chrome trim etc & shot-1 or one of the other shots wounded Tague, hence the above shot numbers have to be reversed.]
« Last Edit: May 12, 2021, 02:06:49 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #34 on: April 29, 2021, 02:32:43 AM »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #35 on: April 29, 2021, 06:38:36 AM »
Why did Colin McLaren in THE SMOKING GUN overlook that Hickey fired a plurality of shots. 
Today i had a re-read & i found why.  In Chapter 10 THE SECRET SERVICE SECRET Colin uses the word AR15 or gun or rifle countless times.
He writes AR-15 assault weapon 10 times.
AR-15 rifle 4 times.
Automatic weapon 3 times.
Automatic rifle 2 times.
Machine gun 2 times.
Submachine gun 1 time.
In addition Colin writes the words "rapidly fired", & "more than one person shooting", & "flurry of shots", & "had almost a double sound".
But then he called it a Colt AR-15 semi-automatic assault weapon 1 time. 

The SEMI automatic version is the modern civilian version in which AUTO mode is illegal.
Hickey's Colt AR15 01 had three modes, SAFE, SEMI, AUTO.  It was an automatic.  It keeps firing until the trigger is released (if on AUTO).
Nowadays automatics are only allowed in the Defense Forces etc. Actually to save ammo they usually replace the AUTO with BURST  koz BURST fires only 3 or 4 auto shots per squeeze.

In addition the AR15 01 had a slamfire problem. 
And, i suspect that a slamfire could result in an auto-burst even in a modern civilian semi automatic.
And, i suspect that a slamfire auto-burst could continue until the ammo ran out even if a semi automatic.

So, Colin erred for 2 reasons.
Error-1.  He thort it was a semi automatic, which fired 1 shot per squeeze (ie per accidental squeeze here).
No. It was an automatic, & an accidental squeeze would fire until the trigger was released (if on AUTO).
Error-2. He overlooked that even if it were a semi auto, a slamfire might fire until out of ammo (ie per zero squeeze).  And he overlooked that that 01 model did indeed have a slamfire problem. 

What size magazine did the AR15 have? I think it was a 20 or a 25.
Hence if the accidental homicide were a slamfire incident then the whole 20 or 25 would almost certainly
have been discharged, unless there were only 6 bullets in the magazine.
And for sure it didnt have a 6-shot magazine or a 6-shot clip.
No, i dont think it was a slamfire.

Where was Colin misled?
I think the mistake started with Donahue & Menninger in MORTAL ERROR.
I will get the book tomorrow & have a look. [edit][got the book & am reading it].
Ok i read Mortal Error & there is no instance of the AR15 being called a semi-automatic. It is called an automatic at least 7 times.
However Donahue says "the Colt AR-15 is the civilian version of the M16, the automatic rifle that was used as the primary American infantry weapon in Vietnam".
In fact the AR15 preceded the M16.  And 8500 AR15's were purchased by the USAF, hence it wasnt simply the civilian version. McLaren i think said that Hickey's AR15 was probly one of the USAF AR15's.  But Donahue on page 219 says that Mullen told him that MacDonald had sold the Secret Service on the AR-15 the prototype of the gun, & Donahue says that it was one of these newly issued rifles that was used in Dallas.  Which suggests that the Secret Service got their own batch.  In any case i think that the civilian version of the AR15 was for many years a fully automatic. I dont know how McLaren convinced himself that Hickey's AR15 was a semi-automatic.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 04:30:22 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #36 on: May 01, 2021, 02:22:05 AM »
Years ago it was said that Hickey's AR15 could not have been high enough for the slug to clear the windshield of Queen Mary.
They drew the necessary slug trajectory based on the impact point on JFK's head being 10" below the top of the windshield of the JFK limo.
Here on Moorman's polaroid taken at about Z313 i have drawn a red line from the rollbar passing 10" over my estimated impact point.
The rollbar is at the same height as the top of the windshield, or it might be say 1" higher, when on level ground.
The Queen Mary windshield is 60" above the road, the JFK limo windshield is 59" above the road. 
Do u reckon that the red line passes throo the top of the Queen Mary windshield?  I reckon not. 

I have drawn 4 black lines that are likely candidates for a proper windshield to windshield line.
The bottom line looks much too low.  The top line looks to be angled too high.
The middle 2 lines look the most realistic.
Anyhow, the vertical clearances tween lines & impact point are 3" 4" 5" & 6".  I am happy to go with 4" or 5".  Not 10". 
So, later today i will do a proper drawing of the necessary traject.
They in their stupid drawing draw the impact point 49" above the road, my drawing will adopt 54" or even 55".

The 4 white lines are my estimates of the necessary slug trajects for the 4 black lines, each of the 4 trajects clearing each of the 4 needed pseudo Queen Mary windshields by 1/8".

I scaled my distances based on JFK's head being 10" long, ie the size of that yellow rectangle.
Whenever i mention heights & levels i am assuming that Elm St is horizontal, ie level, ie zero slope. Much simpler than juggling the 3.1 deg grade.

Notice that the picket fence is a sniper-free zone.
Notice that the grassy knoll is an Arnold-free zone.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2021, 09:13:20 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #37 on: May 01, 2021, 08:40:12 AM »
Here is the silly drawing silly them used years ago to debunk the Hickey accidental homicide scenario.
The broken line shows their silly estimate of the traject for the slug. It is based on the impact point on JFK's head being a silly 49" above the road.
And they i think try to show that Hickey would have  to be standing on the seat, in which case the AR15 could not have shot JFK.
The red line is their 59" to 60" windshield to windshield line if that line passes 10" above the headshot level, as shown this requires the Queen Mary windshield to be at 76" not 60".

Actually the drawing was done by Donahue (see page 206 Mortal Error), he used it to show that the traject accorded with the angle of the headwound, & to help prove that the traject could clear the windshield, which he thort needed to have Hickey standing on the seat, koz Donahue accepted the WCR that Hess & Eisenhardt's 52.78" estimate for the height of the top of JFK's head was accurate, which it aint.

I have drawn a more realistic version of the needed trajectory showing that the AR15 didnít have to be very high.
I have scaled the drawing so that 2 mm equals 1" vertically, & 10 mm equals 1' horizontally, when i magnify the drawing 200% (on my screen).
The critical thing is that the Queen Mary windshield is 60" high, & the JFK limo windshield is 59" high (unloaded).
And i estimated 54" for the impact height (not their silly 49")(i could have used 55").
I drew Hickey 74" high, standing on the floor 10" above the road (i wouldnt be surprised if Hickey was even taller than that).
Hickey's head & JFK's head are the 2 ovals (heads are usually say 9.5")(JFK's is drawn close to 11", my bad).
I drew the rollbar level with the windshield, but in photos it looks to be say 1" higher than the windshield.
As shown the AR15 had to be 3" or more above the Queen Mary windshield.   
The orange extension of the traject shows the remnant slug continuing on the original angle/line, which hits the windshield at about the crack.

However the remnant slug had to veer inside JFK's head about 5.1 deg in the horizontal. Shot-2 made a dent say 2" right of center, shot-1 made a crack 7" left of center, & JFK's head is 7.5' from the crack, hence the difference in angle tween shot-1 & shot-2 is 9" in 90", ie 10%, ie 5.1 deg. This is based on the burst being vertical, ie based on the AR15 swinging naturally upwards due to recoil.  If there was any horizontal component of the burst then that would add to or diminish that there 5.1 deg.  Hickey might have been swinging to his right during the burst, we dont know.  But tests have shown that a hollow point bullet can veer about 6 deg in a short length of ballistic gel if it firstly goes throo an angled solid, & JFK's skull was indeed an angled solid. 

Shot-2 dented the chrome trim, & the blue traject shows that that slug could have passed under the rollbar.
I prefer that the AR15 was actually say 10" above the windshield which puts it at about the level of the drawn AR15, in which case shot-2 passed over the rollbar.
And as can be seen if my Hickey held the AR15 at chest height it would be that there 10" above the windshield.
If he lifted the AR15 up to his chin (to aim/fire) then the AR15 would be many inches higher.

If i went to more trouble i could draw a more accurate drawing allowing for the cars sitting lower when loaded. Queen Mary probly sank about 2" with the wt of the 9 big guys. Plus during the burst it was braking which would have lowered the front an inch & raised the back an inch. It was this braking that made Hickey stumble forward over the jump-seat, & shoot, & then quickly fall back onto his seat.  We know that he immediately fell back onto his seat koz we can see him half sitting half standing (his usual pozzy) in his seat in a 2019 Bronson frame a fraction of a second after Z313.  Plus this same frame shows a very blurred AR15 swinging very quickly up at about 45 deg.  The inferior 2017 Bronson frame in Robin Unger's gallery merely shows a blotchy AR15 standing at 45 deg, it doesnt show the rapid movement.  Anyhow, where were we, the JFK limo sank a bit less than Queen Mary koz it had only 4 guys & 2 gals.  Agent Hill was on the tarmac during Z313.

« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 03:19:51 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #37 on: May 01, 2021, 08:40:12 AM »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #38 on: May 02, 2021, 02:41:38 AM »
How did Hess & Eisenhardt come up with their silly 52.78" to the top of the seated JFK head?
I guess that the silly 49" height of the impact is based on that silly 52.78".  In Reply#8 & in other threads i show photos of the motorcade that show that earlier in the day JFK's head was 2" lower than the 59" to 60" windshield to windshield line for the JFK limo & Queen Mary, ie it was at 57".  And i used 54" for my impact height, based on the loss of 3" made up of 2" due to JFK leaning & then 1" below the top of head for the impact.   57" is 4.22" higher than the H&E 52.78".  52.78" to 49" is a loss of 3.78", compared to my estimated loss of 3".
And the Secret Service measured a head height of 62" in the back of Queen Mary, thatís 2" higher than the Queen Mary windshield.
This suggests that the floor height in Queen Mary was much higher than in the JFK limo (i adopted 10" in Queen Mary).
Anyhow i donít know how H&E could have come up with 52.78".  It was only a theoretical estimate, koz the JFK limo had been altered earlier in 1964.  And it was based on JFK's bum sinking into the seat a bit.  And that there 49" should have been at least 4" higher, ie 53", & as i said me myself i adopted 54".

« Last Edit: May 03, 2021, 12:58:25 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #39 on: May 02, 2021, 03:31:09 AM »
The arc traced out by the say 6-shot burst might have been as shown. 
What is fairly certain is that Hickey shot-1 hit JFK's head (but we can never rule out that the head-shot was last). 
The remaining 5 shots angled higher due to the recoil.  Hickey did not have a firm grip, the burst was an accident & not expected.
Strangely the vertical angles of shot-1 to shot-2 to shot-3 to shot-4 to shot-5 to shot-6 get closer together.
This tells me that Hickey was falling forward during the burst, had he been falling backwards his fall would have added to the natural risings.
But the drawn angles etc shown cant be trusted, koz that there pix doesnt show the proper perspective.
In addition, we dont know exactly how far right of center JFK's head was. 
We dont know whether Queen Mary was exactly behind the JFK limo.
We dont know how far left of center the AR15 was.
But for sure the angles of the vertical risings get smaller.
It would have taken 0.7 sec for the burst, if the AR15 fired at 400 rpm, ie 6.7 rps.
During that time Hickey would have had time to react & firm his grip. 
But i think that the closing of the angles was due mainly to falling forward.
Colin McLaren in THE SMOKING GUN mentions a witness who said that Hickey fired whilst falling forward.
Hickey stumbled forward onto Donnelly sitting in the jump-seat who blocks his fall, we know that he blocks his fall koz one of the Bronson frames shows Hickey a fraction of a second later has fallen backwards to his usual half sitting half standing pozzy in his seat.
If Zapruder's film runs at 18.3 fps & if the AR15 fires at 6.7 rps then Hickey shot-1 was at Z313, shot-2 was at Z316, shot-3 at Z319, shot-4 at Z321, shot-5 at Z324, shot-6 at Z327.
And at 11.1 mph the limo would have traveled 13 ft.
To ears close by the burst would sound like a flurry of shots, to ears at a distance it would sound like 1 strange shot mixed with its own echoes.
Agent Hill on the phone to Bobby Kennedy ----- THERE HAS BEEN AN ACCIDENT.

This perspective from Dale Myers' cartoon footage nearly shows Hickey's view from Queen Mary, i would rather that it showed the AR15's view.
A perspective from the AR15's view would show the star for shot-1 at the same height as the star for the crack next to the mirror if that perspective etc was based on my estimated traject in the drawn side-view in my previous Reply#37.
But i drew that estimated traject to show that the AR15 didnt have to be held very high to achieve a headshot, & i reckon that the actual level of the AR15 was much higher, but not as high as the viewpoint shown in this here pix, this viewpoint is high up at about Hickey's eye-level, actual (the AR15) was at chest level.
Why did Myers draw the limo partly into the left lane? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
« Last Edit: May 06, 2021, 11:24:35 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #39 on: May 02, 2021, 03:31:09 AM »


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