The Dale Myers Blog

[Jerry Freeman]

Mr. Tonkowhich I don’t know if anyone else was in the shoe store. Mr. Freeman brought up the question but did not provide any answer. Go ask him.

The answer was provided in reply # 9. I suppose links that are provided are just glanced at [if that much] Stop deliberately mis-spelling names.

[Joe Elliott]

What other people? Do we have any record of other people in the store at that time, besides Mr. Brewer and Oswald?

I assume Mr. Brewer probably took a few seconds to lock up his shop before following Oswald into the theater. Did he lock up some other people in his shop over the next few minutes while he did this?

The answer was provided in reply # 9. I suppose links that are provided are just glanced at [if that much]

Mr. Elliott:
Mr Brewer mentioned that there other people in the store. IBM employees.
"We were listening to the transistor radio...".

Mr Brewer mentioned that there other people in the store? IBM employees. Ah. Mr. Brewer mentioned that there were other people in the store, who were IBM employees. Now I understand.

I’m not interested in 30-year-old memories. CTers are so desperate to discredit Mr. Brewer that they don’t stick to the most reliable (but not infallible) memories of 3 months after the event, but go to statements made 30 years after the event. I wish CTers would be more honest, and state up front, that they are commenting on statements made 30 years after the event and not sticking to the earliest testimony, which is available. If Mr. Brewer goes to a nursing home, I suspect they will try to get more statements from him and bring them up on this forum.

But, ok, let’s look at the 30-year-old memories. He recalls two friends from IBM visiting the store. The president had just been assassinated, but they decided not to watch events on TV but decided to listen on the radio down at the shoe shop with their friend. This sounds unlikely. So, I suspect it is a false memory. He didn’t recall them being there in 1964 but in 1994 he does. It sounds like a false memory. The kind honest (and dishonest) people generate all the time over the years.

And again, the question you always keep avoiding. Both Mr. Freeman and Mr. Tonkovich.

Question 1:

What is Mr. Brewer’s motive for lying?

Does it make him sound more heroic that he was chatting with two friends from IBM during the hour he helped track down Oswald? More heroic that it was the announcement of a shooting of a police officer and not that of the President that made him more alert and caused him to focus on Oswald? I don’t see how.

Who were the other  people in the show store?
The FBI made no effort to identify them?

I have to agree with you on this point. The failure of the FBI to even try to identify these witnesses is inexcusable. Any competent investigating body would have hired a psychic who would have informed them that thirty years later, the Mr. Brewer would remember a couple of other witnesses who were with him. And this would have allowed them to check Mr. Brewer’s story. And if they re-interview the witnesses 30 years later, they may have discovered that the three of them were listening to John Denver singing “Country Roads” over the radio when Oswald ducked into the store.

Stop deliberately mis-spelling names.

Mr. Tonkovich misspelled my name. Its ok for CTers to misspell LNers names but not vice versa.

[Joe Elliott]

'He saw Oswald duck into his store and then duck into a theater'

A kind of 'duckduckgo'
(Techies will get it)

And I've asked people before to tell us what they would do if they were in Brewer's shoes.

 

I don’t know what other people do when they suddenly find themselves in someone else’s shoes but I find it best to change shoes immediately, because they are either too tight or too loose. Plus, there is an old Twilight Zone program called “Dead Man’s Shoes” which shows what can happen if you don’t follow this advice.

Its obvious what Mr. Brewer should have done. Write down, as soon as possible, with all the details, everything that happened from the time he first saw Oswald to the time Oswald was taken out of his sight in the theater. That way, he could avoid (maybe) being called a liar down through the years. You’re are taking a chance if you don’t do this and just rely on memory.

And most importantly of all, take the time to pick out for himself some steel toed boots before leaving the shop so he can really kick Oswald in the butt when he finds him. Now that would have been heroic.

[John Tonkovich]

Mr. Elliott:
Brewer's WC testimony mentions " we were listening to the transistor...".
Who is we?
His testimony: February 1964.

[John Iacoletti]

He could give Statement 1:

I heard that the President was shot. This made me extra alert. So, when I saw a man act suspiciously and sneak first into my shoe store, as police cars with sirens approached, and then a couple of minutes later sneak into a theater, again, as police cars with sirens approached, I decided to check this out.

Or he could give Statement 2:

I heard that a police officer was shot. This made me extra alert. So, when I saw a man act suspiciously and sneak first into my shoe store, as police cars with sirens approached, and then a couple of minutes later sneak into a theater, again, as police cars with sirens approached, I decided to check this out.

I think it makes a great deal of difference. Seeing a guy who “looks funny” when you’ve heard that a policeman was just shot in Oak Cliff, is very different from seeing a guy “look funny” an hour after (and miles away from where) the president was shot.

But I agree with your overall point. Just because somebody says something that isn’t true, that doesn’t mean he is lying. I’ve been trying to get Mr. O’meara to understand that distinction.

[Joe Elliott]

Mr. Elliott:
Brewer's WC testimony mentions " we were listening to the transistor...".
Who is we?
His testimony: February 1964.

Yes. But let’s look at his statements made in chronological order. The earliest statements have to be considered the most reliable, although false memories can crop up very quickly.

Two weeks later:
December 6, 1963 Affidavit:

https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth339626/m1/1/

No mention of “we” hearing the radio. Only “I”. Does say he heard the President had been shot. Also says he heard a police officer had been shot. This cannot be, but false memories can certainly develop in 2 weeks. Said he followed Oswald a bit out on the street. And Saw him duck into the theater.

Only problem: Remembering hearing the radio report of an officer being shot.



Four months later:
April 2, 1964 Warren Commission testimony.

https://www.jdtippit.com/brewer_nov.htm

Now, as is typical with memories, problems start to crop up:

He now refers to “we”, not “I”, heard on the radio, the news about the President and the police officer. Even so, he doesn’t say that “we” were there the whole time. “We” heard the reports.

“We listened to all the events”. What does that mean? All the events up to 1:10? All the events up to the time Oswald entered the store? All the events up to the time Oswald was arrested? All the events up to the time Ruby shot Oswald two days later? We can’t tell. It could be that if others where there, they soon left to hunt up a TV set while Mr. Brewer had to stay in the shop. There is no discussion about Mr. Brewer interacting with the “others”, asking what they thought of that strange man, asking them to come with him to the theater to check the exits. Asking them to step out of the store while he temporally locked up. So, I suspect if there were others there, they had left by the time Oswald showed up. It doesn’t make sense that Mr. Brewer would forget all about them and not interact with them in some way if they were still there.



33 years later:
November 25, 1996 interview.
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=16235&search=two_men+from+IBM+JCB#relPageId=8&tab=page

Now all sorts of problems occur with his story.

33 years later he remembers not only listening to the radio by the station, KLIF. Happens to be the same station Julie Postal said she was listening to in her 1964 testimony.

And now, not only are there others, but there were two other men in the shop when Oswald showed up. They were friends who worked for IBM. They were in there to just in there just to kill time and lounge around. The President had just been shot, but instead of hunting up a TV set, which they could do but Mr. Brewer could not, they decided instead to lounge around and kill time. And again, he does not bring up any interaction with them except when prompted by the interviewer, he responds with “Oh yes, I think I said something. “Said something”. Not asking them to come with him to the theater to watch exits. Not asking them to step out of the store while he locked up. Just said “something” and didn’t interact with them again.

He walked up to the theater booth and said ‘Julie, did you sell a ticket?’. Julie. Julie worked a block away. But he knew her before November 22, 1963? I don’t think he mentioned that in any of his earlier statements. Now Mr. Brewer was 22 years old. I don’t see Julie Postal’s age, but in her Warren Commission testimony she said she graduated from high school in California and returned to Texas, and had been working at the Texas Theater for 11, 14 or 15 years. I don’t think it’s likely that Mr. Brewer was on a first name basis with Julie before November 22, 1963.

In addition, he remembered telling Butch Burroughs “Butch, come on with me’. Butch. I think it was even less likely that Mr. Brewer was on a first name basis with Butch Burroughs.

And not only did Mr. Brewer know “Julie” and “Butch” by there first names, he also knew Oswald. Oswald bought a two-eyelet, crepe-soled shoe, model 8110, size eight and a half, sometime before the assassination. Even thirty years later Mr. Brewer has an amazing memory for all his customers and their shoes. Oswald was very fastidious and meticulous. None of this was mentioned in 1963 or 1964 but by 1996 Mr. Brewer remembered a lot about this customer he met once and sold a pair of shoes to.



All this looks like a classic case of “False Memories”. The witness starts to incorporate information he learned later into his memory. He knows “Julie”. He knows “Butch”. He knows Oswald. Hell, he may remember selling shoes to Jack Ruby by now.

There is no reason for him to make up these lies. To say he was on a first name basis with “Julie”, with “Butch”. To say he sold a pair of shoes to Oswald.

A minor problem two weeks later. More problems four months later. A host of problems 33 years later. Classic signs of false memories cropping up over time.

[Joe Elliott]

I think it makes a great deal of difference. Seeing a guy who “looks funny” when you’ve heard that a policeman was just shot in Oak Cliff, is very different from seeing a guy “look funny” an hour after (and miles away from where) the president was shot.

But I agree with your overall point. Just because somebody says something that isn’t true, that doesn’t mean he is lying. I’ve been trying to get Mr. O’meara to understand that distinction.

I think hearing:

          The President had been shot, 66 minutes earlier, 3 miles away.

Might carry as much weight, or even more weight, then hearing:

          A police officer had been shot 21 minutes earlier, half a mile away.

But it is, of course, a matter of opinion.