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Author Topic: Is This Our Man?  (Read 4309 times)

Offline Alan Ford

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Is This Our Man?
« on: November 11, 2019, 03:06:34 PM »
Friends, Officer Marrion Baker in his affidavit of 11/22/63 described the man he encountered "walking away from the stairway" on the "third or fourth floor" as follows:

"a white man approximately 30 years old, 5' 9", 165 pounds, dark hair and wearing a light brown jacket".


In his WC testimony, he let out another detaiL

"and maybe some kind of white-looking shirt".

Young Mr Amos Euins recalled that the man he had seen at the SN window had a white or bald spot. From his WC testimony:

Mr. SPECTER. How far back did the bald spot on his head go?
Mr. EUINS. I would say about right along in here.
Mr. SPECTER. Indicating about 2 1/2 inches above where you hairline is. Is that about what you are saying?
Mr. EUINS. Yes, sir; right along in here.


Deputy Roger Craig recalled seeing a man--------whom he later identified as Mr Oswald----------running down the lawn and getting into a Rambler several minutes after the assassination. Here's how he described him (FBI report 11/25/63):

"White male, height 5'9", weight 140 pounds, build slender, hair sandy, dress - brown shirt, blue trousers."

Doesn't this man caught on film by Mr Hughes in the railroad yards shortly after the assassination tick a remarkable number of boxes?



Now! It has been claimed that he was caught on film by Mr Bronson standing on the sidewalk on Houston St for the P. parade:



But! This is a false identification:





On an old thread on the Education Forum, there is also talk of some Bell frames showing a man some identified with Our Man In Hughes. Unfortunately the jpg links are dead!  :'(

Can anyone here point us to the Bell frames in question so we can take a good look?

 Thumb1:

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Is This Our Man?
« on: November 11, 2019, 03:06:34 PM »

Offline Brian Doyle

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Is This Our Man?
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2019, 03:12:18 PM »

I think Craig's first descriptions were of a White T-shirt...

That brown shirt version was probably forced by DPD in order to match the Oswald they arrested...

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2019, 03:17:44 PM »
Now! While we await those Bell frames...

It seems this issue was quite a hot topic back in the day, but was killed dead by the apparent identification of 'Tan Jacket Man' in the Bronson film. However, now that we know that identification was in fact a bad misidentification, we are free to resurrect some of the striking observations made back then about this man.

Not least!

The frequency with which the Tippit murder witnesses described 'Oswald' as wearing a tan jacket.

Also!

This from Mr Domingo Benavides:

Mr. BENAVIDES - I remember the back of his head seemed like his hairline was sort of--looked like his hairline sort of went square instead of tapered off. and he looked like he needed a haircut for about 2 weeks, but his hair didn't taper off, it kind of went down and squared off and made his head look fiat in back.

Cf---------------



= another major box ticked.

Could this man be both the man at the SN window and the Tippit killer?

We await those Bell frames with great interest!  Thumb1:
« Last Edit: November 11, 2019, 03:18:35 PM by Alan Ford »

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2019, 03:17:44 PM »

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2019, 03:52:40 PM »
Friends, Officer Marrion Baker in his affidavit of 11/22/63 described the man he encountered "walking away from the stairway" on the "third or fourth floor" as follows:

"a white man approximately 30 years old, 5' 9", 165 pounds, dark hair and wearing a light brown jacket".


In his WC testimony, he let out another detaiL

"and maybe some kind of white-looking shirt".

Young Mr Amos Euins recalled that the man he had seen at the SN window had a white or bald spot. From his WC testimony:

Mr. SPECTER. How far back did the bald spot on his head go?
Mr. EUINS. I would say about right along in here.
Mr. SPECTER. Indicating about 2 1/2 inches above where you hairline is. Is that about what you are saying?
Mr. EUINS. Yes, sir; right along in here.




Are you claiming Euins' "bald spot" is centered on the top-front of the parking-lot man's head?

    "Mr. BENAVIDES - I remember the back of his head seemed like his hairline was sort of--
     looked like his hairline sort of went square instead of tapered off. and he looked like
     he needed a haircut for about 2 weeks, but his hair didn't taper off, it kind of went down
     and squared off and made his head look fiat in back"

The fellow in the parking lot doesn't look like he needs a haircut. But this guy ...


Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2019, 04:04:52 PM »


Are you claiming Euins' "bald spot" is centered on the top-front of the parking-lot man's head?

Mr Euins didn't have a bald spot, but what we see in these Hughes frames matches Mr Euins' description very nicely, thank you very much!  Thumb1:

Mr. SPECTER. How far back did the bald spot on his head go?
Mr. EUINS. I would say about right along in here.
Mr. SPECTER. Indicating about 2 1/2 inches above where you hairline is. Is that about what you are saying?
Mr. EUINS. Yes, sir; right along in here.


Quote

    "Mr. BENAVIDES - I remember the back of his head seemed like his hairline was sort of--
     looked like his hairline sort of went square instead of tapered off. and he looked like
     he needed a haircut for about 2 weeks, but his hair didn't taper off, it kind of went down
     and squared off and made his head look fiat in back"

The fellow in the parking lot doesn't look like he needs a haircut. But this guy ...



Gosh, Mr Organ, you're right. He looked like a hippie that day!



 :D

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2019, 04:04:52 PM »

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2019, 05:24:48 PM »
Mr Euins didn't have a bald spot, but what we see in these Hughes frames matches Mr Euins' description very nicely, thank you very much!  Thumb1:

Mr. SPECTER. How far back did the bald spot on his head go?
Mr. EUINS. I would say about right along in here.
Mr. SPECTER. Indicating about 2 1/2 inches above where you hairline is. Is that about what you are saying?
Mr. EUINS. Yes, sir; right along in here.


So, Euins' "bald spot" could be referring to a receding hairline. I'll go along with that.

   

Quote
Gosh, Mr Organ, you're right. He looked like a hippie that day!



 

Benavides was referring to a hippie's long hair to the shoulders? Or a Beatles cut? Well, those things were just coming in by late-1963.

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2019, 05:28:08 PM »
Now! While we await those Bell frames...

It seems this issue was quite a hot topic back in the day, but was killed dead by the apparent identification of 'Tan Jacket Man' in the Bronson film. However, now that we know that identification was in fact a bad misidentification, we are free to resurrect some of the striking observations made back then about this man.

Not least!

The frequency with which the Tippit murder witnesses described 'Oswald' as wearing a tan jacket.

Also!

This from Mr Domingo Benavides:

Mr. BENAVIDES - I remember the back of his head seemed like his hairline was sort of--looked like his hairline sort of went square instead of tapered off. and he looked like he needed a haircut for about 2 weeks, but his hair didn't taper off, it kind of went down and squared off and made his head look fiat in back.

Cf---------------



= another major box ticked.

Could this man be both the man at the SN window and the Tippit killer?

We await those Bell frames with great interest!  Thumb1:

I'm no photo analyst but ....   Can you explain how the man with his back to the camera shortens his neck from a long slender "pencil neck" to a short neck as he turns around toward the camera?   

I have long thought that "pencil neck" was /is Lee Oswald  who said that he stood and watched the activity in the railroad yard for a while before deciding to go to the movies....

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2019, 05:28:08 PM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2019, 06:52:41 PM »
So, Euins' "bald spot" could be referring to a receding hairline. I'll go along with that.

 :D

"Mr. EUINS. I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out the window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot."

The three things to be noted here, Mr Organ, are
a) the meaning of the word spot
b) the meaning of the word on
c) the fact that Mr Euins found the white spot on the man's head such a memorable feature of the man's head.

What positively leaps out at the eye from the top of this man's head is the white spot which is on it:

 

 Thumb1:

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2019, 06:52:41 PM »

Offline Larry Trotter

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2019, 07:04:13 PM »
I think Craig's first descriptions were of a White T-shirt...

That brown shirt version was probably forced by DPD in order to match the Oswald they arrested...

I recall the statement by the late DCS DeputyRogerCraig about a person he identified as LeeHarveyOswald coming down the knoll area and getting into an automobile, at about 12:45pm CST, but I don't recall specifics about clothing. But, regarding clothing worn by LHO on 11/22/'63, didn't he change clothes at his room on N Beckley, after leaving the TSBD Bldg and before going to the TexasTheater?

I continue to believe that it was LeeHarveyOswald (1939-1963) who was encountered at the second floor lunchroom, by DPD OfficerMarrionBaker and TSBD Bldg SuperintendentRoyTruly, about 75-90 seconds after the fatal wounding of PresidentJohnKennedySr, and critical wounding of GovernorJohnConnallyJr.

The HughesFilm's TanJacketMan/Image has not been identified to my knowledge, but does not appear to be LHO. But, in the film clip, said Person/Image appears to be standing next to the late RobertFoster/Image, to TJM's left before turning around. And, when not cropped, RF/I appears on film to be turned to his left, and facing his then wife, Toni/Image. However, I see nothing that indicates any connection between TJM and T&RF.

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2019, 02:15:14 AM »
:D

"Mr. EUINS. I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out the window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot."

The three things to be noted here, Mr Organ, are
a) the meaning of the word spot
b) the meaning of the word on
c) the fact that Mr Euins found the white spot on the man's head such a memorable feature of the man's head.

What positively leaps out at the eye from the top of this man's head is the white spot which is on it:

 

 Thumb1:

So Euins saw the man leaning out the window something like this ...


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Re: Is This Our Man?
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2019, 02:15:14 AM »

 

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