Why didn't the Conspirators plant Eyewitnesses in Dealey Plaza?

[Nicholas Turner]

Good point. RFK chose secrecy over finding the truth about his Brother?s murder.

One of the reasons I?m not sure if Robert would?ve reopened the JFK investigation if he had won the election. However, according to close friends and family, he did suspect that Oswald didn?t act alone.

Yes, I think lots of people, including RFK, had reasons not to want any further investigations. There were things they didn't want exposed, such as the attempts to assassinate Castro, and mistakes which had been made, such as opportunities to identify Oswald as a threat to JFK. I am not convinced there was any conspiracy to assassinate JFK but things were covered up after the event in my view.

[Mark Carter]

The key to understanding the JFK assassination comes from "reading" the witness testimony given to the Warren Commission by people that were there that day. For instance.
 About 15 minutes before the Presidential motorcade came by the was a man named Arnold Rowland who saw a man in a white low cut t shirt holding a rifle with a scope on it standing in the sixth floor window among the stacked up boxes. He was wearing blue pants. The day Oswald was arrested he had a white low cut t shirt and blue pants.
Right before the motorcade came by two women Carol Walters and miss Walton testified that they saw a man in a white low cut t shirt on the third floor holding a rifle with no scope on it.
So if you 'add' these three testimonies together It shows that Oswald planted the M Carcano on the sixth floor and came down to the third floor and shot JFK with a different rifle.

[Nicholas Turner]

The key to understanding the JFK assassination comes from "reading" the witness testimony given to the Warren Commission by people that were there that day. For instance.
 About 15 minutes before the Presidential motorcade came by the was a man named Arnold Rowland who saw a man in a white low cut t shirt holding a rifle with a scope on it standing in the sixth floor window among the stacked up boxes. He was wearing blue pants. The day Oswald was arrested he had a white low cut t shirt and blue pants.
Right before the motorcade came by two women Carol Walters and miss Walton testified that they saw a man in a white low cut t shirt on the third floor holding a rifle with no scope on it.
So if you 'add' these three testimonies together It shows that Oswald planted the M Carcano on the sixth floor and came down to the third floor and shot JFK with a different rifle.

I think the key is understanding that human eyewitness testimony is unreliable and needs to be treated as such. Rowlands story changed several times, he included details in his testimony which were false, his wife who was with him didn't back up his account and when she was asked about if  she could rely on everything her husband said she replied that he was prone to exaggerate..

Carolyn Walther was stood with a friend when she says she saw the person on the lower floor. She didn't mention it to her friend, nor to anyone on her return to work.

The human brain is not an accurate recorder and we can imagine we see all sorts of things and can 'remember' things which never happened.

[Rob Caprio]

Nobody thinks that putting his ring in the cup is 100% evidence of killing somebody.

The point made is simply that it?s adnormal behaviour for somebody who?s just going to work and has no history of having done so previously. It?s all about context. It wouldn?t stand up in a courtroom, but the courtroom rarely stands up to reality.

The WC itself claimed that LHO had never gone to the Paine residence on a Thursday night, therefore, there is no way to disprove the notion that he routinely didn't wear his ring to work. He may have been afraid that it would be damaged.

You have no way of knowing that he never left his ring at one of his rooming houses so it is indicative of nothing. Furthermore, there is no mention of any wedding ring on any DPD inventory log.

[Nicholas Turner]

Do you trust Howard Brennan's testimony? What about Helen Markham?

I don't 'trust' any individual, uncorroborated eye witness account to be totally accurate. The account given by Brennan of a gunman on ye sixth floor was one of a number of such accounts where the main details agreed. The same in the case of Markham.

Arnold Rowland spoke with Officer Craig ~10 minutes post assassination and mentioned that he saw TWO people on the 6th floor. Did Arnold fabricate that statement months before he appeared in front of the WC?

He didn't say that in the sworn affidavit written on the 22nd. Fabricated implies intent and I didn't suggest that.

"He interviewed other witnesses, including a young man who said he had seen two men on the 6th floor of the TSBD and one of them had a rifle. Belin suggests this witness may have been Arnold Rowland. (WCHE, v. 6, p. 263)"

Sure, but the comments about the reliability of his account from my earlier post still apply

[Nicholas Turner]

Do you know how the WC could have easily verified if Rowland was telling the truth on seeing a tall, thin African-American male in the SE corner at 12.15 pm?

Go for it.

[Steve Taylor]

You took LSD by choice, you weren't subjected to "experimentation" designed to take over your freewill.

What the CIA did was no different to the inhumane experiments done by the Nazis.

Dulles had a long association with them during WWII.

"Later, when Allen Dulles served as the United States? top spy in continental Europe during World War II, he blatantly ignored Roosevelt?s policy of unconditional surrender and pursued his own strategy of secret negotiations with Nazi leaders."

"At Camp King, CIA scientists and their German colleagues subjected victims to dangerous combinations of drugs?including Benzedrine, Pentothal-Natrium, LSD, and mescaline?under a research protocol that stipulated, ?Disposal of the body is not a problem.? More than sixteen hundred of the Nazi scientists recruited for U.S. research projects like this would be comfortably resettled with their families in America under a CIA program known as Operation Paperclip."

Do you really think Dulles really "retired" when he resigned?

I agree with everything you said Tony.  MK stood for mind control, but instead of labelling it MC, they used the German words for it which I have forgotten.  The reason I used the example of Washington was that I felt there was a more intense effort here than in other locations.  If LSD is used in the correct way, it is fantastic.  But if used in the wrong way, it can be very harmful.  We all had to learn by trial and error back then.  Dulles was fired, because JFK recognized, like you and I, the monster and traitor he was.

[Nicholas Turner]

Why don't you have a go Nicholas?

Why don't you just say what you meant? I'd rather not play games.