JFK Assassination Forum
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion & Debate => JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate => Topic started by: Benjamin Cole on June 17, 2026, 04:10:04 PM
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Recently there was discussion in this forum regarding the shape of the wound in Gov. JBC's back.
Here is a drawing of the wound, by JBC's surgeon, Dr. Robert Shaw.
(https://i.postimg.cc/rpFNWnyY/Screen-Shot-2569-06-17-at-21-59-57.png)
Shaw thought it most likely that JBC was shot from above and behind, by a slug unimpeded by any obstructions. No tumbling. So you had an elliptical or ovoid wound, north-south on JBC's body.
Shaw debrided the wound, thus enlarging the final resulting scar.
In addition, there is a small round hole in the rear of JBC's assassination-day shirt.
(https://i.postimg.cc/9Qzf7y5F/Screen-Shot-2569-06-16-at-07-45-56.png)
I doubt the bullet that struck JBC was tumbling.
The evidence, as seen in JBC's shirt and the doctors sketch, points away from a tumbling bullet.
Caveat emptor, and draw your own conclusions.
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If JBC was turned as he was hit, it would lead to a non-circular entry wound, depending upon where the shot originated, would it not?
If he turned in reaction to hearing the first shot, it implies he was hit by a second bullet and probably too soon after hearing the shot to have been fired from the same bolt action rifle.
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If JBC was turned as he was hit, it would lead to a non-circular entry wound, depending upon where the shot originated, would it not?
If he turned in reaction to hearing the first shot, it implies he was hit by a second bullet and probably too soon after hearing the shot to have been fired from the same bolt action rifle.
"probably too soon"???
Just how did you figure that one out.
JBC is seen starting his turn in reaction to the first shot at Z164. The second shot was fired at about Z219-220. That's 3 seconds after JBC reacted and the reaction was not immediate. If Zapruder's camera jiggle at Z155 was in reaction to the shot, it was fired in the Z147-148 time frame. That is based on the lag time of 7-8 frames between when the head shot was fired and Zapruder's reaction at Z318. That's about 4 seconds between the first and second shot. More than enough time to fire an aimed shot.
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"probably too soon"???
Just how did you figure that one out.
JBC is seen starting his turn in reaction to the first shot at Z164. The second shot was fired at about Z219-220. That's 3 seconds after JBC reacted and the reaction was not immediate. If Zapruder's camera jiggle at Z155 was in reaction to the shot, it was fired in the Z147-148 time frame. That is based on the lag time of 7-8 frames between when the head shot was fired and Zapruder's reaction at Z318. That's about 4 seconds between the first and second shot. More than enough time to fire an aimed shot.
I’ll believe JBC’s interpretation of the Z film of being hit at 234 over yours. But thanks for sharing your opinion.
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KB--
IMHO, you are correct, that JBC's wound-shape and the small round bullet-hole in his shirt suggest he was largely facing forward when shot by a non-tumbling bullet from behind. That is what the evidence shows. That is what Dr. Robert Shaw, his surgeon, thought most likely.
We know what the Connallys testified to, and Nellie had a ringside seat, and was uninjured, and was remarkably cool in a same-day press conference.
So, if the Connallys are correct, when was JBC struck?
My best guess is sometime after Z-295, but before Z-313.
Of course, many, many witnesses described the "bang....bang-bang" cadence of shots.
That cadence lines up with JFK hit ~Z-221, JBC at ~Z-295+ and JFK at Z-313.
Caveat emptor, and draw your own conclusions.
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I’ll believe JBC’s interpretation of the Z film of being hit at 234 over yours. But thanks for sharing your opinion.
So you think JBC could sync up what he felt with what he saw in the Z-film. He did come close. He was less than a second off. JBC remembered his cognitive reaction to being shot. He doubled over and twisted to his right and he saw he did that after Z234. What JBC didn't remember was his involuntary, reflexive response of flipping his right are up and back down. He never looked for the response he didn't remember making. That arm flip came less than a half a second before his cognitive reaction.
I've never heard any CT even attempt to explain JBC's arm flip or why it happened at precisely that same frame that JFK's raised his arms. Since they have no explanation for why JBC would suddenly flip his right arm up and down so they just choose to ignore it. I'm betting you will do the same.
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KB--
IMHO, you are correct, that JBC's wound-shape and the small round bullet-hole in his shirt suggest he was largely facing forward when shot by a non-tumbling bullet from behind. That is what the evidence shows. That is what Dr. Robert Shaw, his surgeon, thought most likely.
We know what the Connallys testified to, and Nellie had a ringside seat, and was uninjured, and was remarkably cool in a same-day press conference.
So, if the Connallys are correct, when was JBC struck?
My best guess is sometime after Z-295, but before Z-313.
Of course, many, many witnesses described the "bang....bang-bang" cadence of shots.
That cadence lines up with JFK hit ~Z-221, JBC at ~Z-295+ and JFK at Z-313.
Caveat emptor, and draw your own conclusions.
There are also some who believe that it was the first two shots that were closer together, though not as many who recall it being the last two that were bunched together.
At Saturday night NPIC briefing board preparation, Dino Brugioni said the secret service was particularly interested in the frames near when JFK disappeared and reappeared from behind the sign. No, the film was not altered and I don’t believe NPIC had the original film which was still in Chicago and probably damaged by that time.
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There are also some who believe that it was the first two shots that were closer together, though not as many who recall it being the last two that were bunched together.
At Saturday night NPIC briefing board preparation, Dino Brugioni said the secret service was particularly interested in the frames near when JFK disappeared and reappeared from behind the sign. No, the film was not altered and I don’t believe NPIC had the original film which was still in Chicago and probably damaged by that time.
The truth is not subject to majority rule. Although there is no definitive proof of when the first shot was taken, I firmly believe the preponderance of evidence is that it was fired in the Z147-148 window which would mean there were about 4 seconds between the first and second shots and about 5 seconds between the second and third shots. What muddies the water is that a single shot can produce multiple sounds and those sounds for the third shot would seem to be right on top of each other. Because the bullet traveled at roughly twice the speed of sound, witnesses near the limo would hear those other sounds before they heard the muzzle blast from the sniper's nest. The impact on JFK's skull, the mini-sonic boom of a bullet passing over their heads, the impact on the windshield frame would all produce sounds that would reach the ears of the nearby witnesses before the muzzle blast.
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The truth is not subject to majority rule. Although there is no definitive proof of when the first shot was taken, I firmly believe the preponderance of evidence is that it was fired in the Z147-148 window which would mean there were about 4 seconds between the first and second shots and about 5 seconds between the second and third shots. What muddies the water is that a single shot can produce multiple sounds and those sounds for the third shot would seem to be right on top of each other. Because the bullet traveled at roughly twice the speed of sound, witnesses near the limo would hear those other sounds before they heard the muzzle blast from the sniper's nest. The impact on JFK's skull, the mini-sonic boom of a bullet passing over their heads, the impact on the windshield frame would all produce sounds that would reach the ears of the nearby witnesses before the muzzle blast.
While the truth is not subject to majority rule, the fact that one LN zealot "firmly believes" the "preponderance of evidence" shows something is not exactly dispositive either.