Lee Oswald The Cop Killer

[Dan O'meara]

You have just lost all credibility.

 

[Martin Weidmann]

That Oswald didn't do it.

Keep on assuming....

IMO it's far more likely that Oswald did kill Tippit than it is that he killed Kennedy.

But your assumption exposes you agenda. Very telling indeed   

[Dan O'meara]

A closer analysis of Frazier's testimony regarding what Oswald was wearing that morning.

Frazier is shown the dark blue jacket (CE 163) that was found in the TSBD and is asked if he recognises it. For some reason Ball describes it as a "gray blue" jacket.



Mr. BALL - I have here Commission's 163, a gray blue jacket. Do you recognize this jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I don't.
Mr. BALL - Did you ever see Lee Oswald wear this jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I don't believe I have.

It doesn't get much more straight-forward than that. Not only isn't it the jacket Oswald wore to work that morning, it's a jacket Frazier is completely unfamiliar with. It must be remembered, Frazier is in the company of Oswald quite a number of times taking him to and from Irving. He is sat right next to him at a time Oswald would most likely be wearing his jacket - before and after work.
Frazier has never seen the jacket before (to the best of his knowledge)

So what was Oswald wearing to work that day?

Mr. BALL - On that day you did notice one article of clothing, that is, he had a jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - What color was the jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - It was a gray, more or less flannel, wool-looking type of jacket that I had seen him wear and that is the type of jacket he had on that morning.
Mr. BALL - Did it have a zipper on it?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; it was one of the zipper types.

The one item of clothing Frazier specifically remembers is Oswald's gray jacket. A zipper jacket. In this part of his testimony we see the first of three times Frazier makes the point he had seen Oswald wearing this jacket before. He is unequivocal that this was the jacket Oswald had on that morning - "and that is the type of jacket he had on that morning."

A curious thing happens at this point in the questioning. Ball asks - "It isn't one of these two zipper jackets we have shown?" - to which Frazier replies - "No, sir"
There are two jackets in evidence that are thought to be Oswald's - the dark blue one (CE 163) and a light grey one (CE 162)
As we have seen, CE 163 was introduced into the hearing and given to Frazier to look at. However, at no point in proceedings is CE 162 introduced. It is never mentioned and Frazier is never asked to give an opinion about it so I find Ball's mention of two zipper jackets quite baffling.
Frazier is then asked about Oswald's pants but he makes the point he can't really remember what else he had on:

Mr. BALL - You are not able to tell us then anything or are you able to tell us, describe any of the clothing he had on that day, except this gray jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - That is the only thing you can remember?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.

Frazier reiterates that he is only sure about the gray jacket. The testimony is about to move on to the bag Oswald was carrying that day but Ball wants more details about the gray jacket:

Mr. BALL - I have here a paper sack which is Commission's Exhibit 364. That gray jacket you mentioned, did it have any design in it?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir.
Mr. BALL - Was it light or dark gray?
Mr. FRAZIER - It was light gray.
Mr. BALL - You mentioned it was woolen.
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Long sleeves?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Here we find out it was a long-sleeved, light gray jacket. It is a zippered, long-sleeved, light gray jacket that Oswald was wearing to work that morning. Ball wants even more detail but Frazier isn't sure:

Mr. BALL - Buttoned sleeves at the wrist, or do you remember?
Mr. FRAZIER - To be frank with you, I didn't notice that much about the jacket, but I had seen him wear that gray woolen jacket before.
Mr. BALL - You say it had a zipper on it?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Although Frazier can't confirm whether or not there were buttons on the wrist he states for the second time that he had seen Oswald wearing the jacket before.  There can be little doubt what jacket Oswald wore to work that morning and it most certainly was not the dark blue jacket subsequently found at the TSBD.

Towards the end of his questioning Frazier is asked about the Thursday he dropped Oswald off:

Mr. BALL - On Thursday afternoon when you went home, drove on home, did he carry any package with him?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he didn't
Mr. BALL - Did he have a jacket or coat on him?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - What kind of a jacket or coat did he have?
Mr. FRAZIER - That, you know, like I say gray jacket.
Mr. BALL - That same gray jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir. Now, I can be frank with you, I had seen him wear that jacket several times, because it is cool type like when you keep a jacket on all day, if you are working on outside or something like that, you wouldn't go outside with just a plain shirt on.

For the third time Frazier states he had seen Oswald wearing this jacket before and that he was wearing it when he dropped him off on Thursday. The same jacket he was wearing Friday morning which is why an extensive search of the Paine house never turned up this light gray, long-sleeved, zippered jacket.
It should also be remembered that nobody saw Oswald leave the TSBD.
Nobody saw what he was wearing.
And this jacket was never found in the TSBD so it is safe to assume that when Oswald left the TSBD that day he was wearing his light gray jacket.

[Martin Weidmann]

A closer analysis of Frazier's testimony regarding what Oswald was wearing that morning.

Frazier is shown the dark blue jacket (CE 163) that was found in the TSBD and is asked if he recognises it. For some reason Ball describes it as a "gray blue" jacket.



Mr. BALL - I have here Commission's 163, a gray blue jacket. Do you recognize this jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I don't.
Mr. BALL - Did you ever see Lee Oswald wear this jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I don't believe I have.

It doesn't get much more straight-forward than that. Not only isn't it the jacket Oswald wore to work that morning, it's a jacket Frazier is completely unfamiliar with. It must be remembered, Frazier is in the company of Oswald quite a number of times taking him to and from Irving. He is sat right next to him at a time Oswald would most likely be wearing his jacket - before and after work.
Frazier has never seen the jacket before (to the best of his knowledge)

So what was Oswald wearing to work that day?

None of this explains the fact that CE 163 was the jacket found in the Domino room at the TSBD, after Kennedy was killed.
Oswald never returned to the TSBD, so how did that jacket get there?

Mr. BALL - On that day you did notice one article of clothing, that is, he had a jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - What color was the jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - It was a gray, more or less flannel, wool-looking type of jacket that I had seen him wear and that is the type of jacket he had on that morning.
Mr. BALL - Did it have a zipper on it?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; it was one of the zipper types.

The one item of clothing Frazier specifically remembers is Oswald's gray jacket. A zipper jacket. In this part of his testimony we see the first of three times Frazier makes the point he had seen Oswald wearing this jacket before. He is unequivocal that this was the jacket Oswald had on that morning - "and that is the type of jacket he had on that morning."

A curious thing happens at this point in the questioning. Ball asks - "It isn't one of these two zipper jackets we have shown?" - to which Frazier replies - "No, sir"

And that's the conudrum. According to Marina, Oswald had only two jackets, yet Frazier dismisses both CE 162 and CE 163 as the jacket he saw Oswald wear that Friday morning. It most certainly doesn't justify the conclusion that Oswald was wearing CE 162 that morning. In fact, with CE 163 being found at the TSBD the most likely jacket, despite Frazier's failure to identify it, is in fact CE 163

There are two jackets in evidence that are thought to be Oswald's - the dark blue one (CE 163) and a light grey one (CE 162)
As we have seen, CE 163 was introduced into the hearing given to Frazier to look at. However, at no point in proceedings is CE 162 introduced. It is never mentioned and Frazier is never asked to give an opinion about it so I find Ball's mention of two zipper jackets quite baffling.

And yet they must both have been in the room, because how else could Frazier dismiss them both as the jacket he had seen?

Frazier is then asked about Oswald's pants but he makes the point he can't really remember what else he had on:

Mr. BALL - You are not able to tell us then anything or are you able to tell us, describe any of the clothing he had on that day, except this gray jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - That is the only thing you can remember?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.

Frazier reiterates that he is only sure about the gray jacket. The testimony is about to move on to the bag Oswald was carrying that day but Ball wants more details about the gray jacket:

Mr. BALL - I have here a paper sack which is Commission's Exhibit 364. That gray jacket you mentioned, did it have any design in it?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir.
Mr. BALL - Was it light or dark gray?
Mr. FRAZIER - It was light gray.
Mr. BALL - You mentioned it was woolen.
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Long sleeves?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Here we find out it was a long-sleeved, light gray jacket. It is a zippered, long-sleeved, light gray jacket that Oswald was wearing to work that morning. Ball wants even more detail but Frazier isn't sure:

Mr. BALL - Buttoned sleeves at the wrist, or do you remember?
Mr. FRAZIER - To be frank with you, I didn't notice that much about the jacket, but I had seen him wear that gray woolen jacket before.
Mr. BALL - You say it had a zipper on it?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Although Frazier can't confirm whether or not there were buttons on the wrist he states for the second time that he had seen Oswald wearing the jacket before.  There can be little doubt what jacket Oswald wore to work that morning and it most certainly was not the dark blue jacket subsequently found at the TSBD.

There can be little doubt what jacket Oswald wore to work that morning and it most certainly was not the dark blue jacket subsequently found at the TSBD.

And this is where fact becomes opinion and speculation.

Towards the end of his questioning Frazier is asked about the Thursday he dropped Oswald off:

Mr. BALL - On Thursday afternoon when you went home, drove on home, did he carry any package with him?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he didn't
Mr. BALL - Did he have a jacket or coat on him?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - What kind of a jacket or coat did he have?
Mr. FRAZIER - That, you know, like I say gray jacket.
Mr. BALL - That same gray jacket?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir. Now, I can be frank with you, I had seen him wear that jacket several times, because it is cool type like when you keep a jacket on all day, if you are working on outside or something like that, you wouldn't go outside with just a plain shirt on.

For the third time Frazier states he had seen Oswald wearing this jacket before and that he was wearing it when he dropped him off on Thursday. The same jacket he was wearing Friday morning which is why an extensive search of the Paine house never turned up this light gray, long-sleeved, zippered jacket.

That's one hell of an assumption. How do you know that the grey jacket wasn't found during the first search of the Paine house?
The answer is that you only assume it. The backyard photos were officially not found until the second search of the Paine house, the one with the warrant, yet on Friday evening Michael Paine was shown a BT photo by an FBI agent and Fritz confronted Oswald with a photo on Saturday morning, hours before the photos were allegedly found.

I find it somewhat remarkable that the white jacket that was found at the parking lot, somehow became a grey jacket with initials on it from officers who were not in the chain of custody (and no initials of the unidentified officers that were) would end up only being submitted to the Identification Bureau after the officers had returned of their first search of the Paine house.

It should also be remembered that nobody saw Oswald leave the TSBD.
Nobody saw what he was wearing.
And this jacket was never found in the TSBD so it is safe to assume that when Oswald left the TSBD that day he was wearing his light gray jacket.

What are you rambling on about? His jacket was in fact found at the TSBD. It just wasn't CE 162.

This is where your concocted story goes off the rails. You have Oswald going to the TSBD on Friday morning wearing a grey jacket (CE 162), you then have him leaving the TSBD wearing the same jacket, despite witness testimony that he wasn't wearing a jacket, yet at the TSBD another jacket (CE 163) is later found. Does this make sense to you?

[Dan O'meara]

None of this explains the fact that CE 163 was the jacket found in the Domino room at the TSBD, after Kennedy was killed.
Oswald never returned to the TSBD, so how did that jacket get there?

At no point have I put this analysis forward as an explanation of why CE 163 was found in the TSBD.
The only way it relates to that aspect of the case is that Frazier is unequivocal that CE 163 is not the jacket Oswald was wearing that morning. He couldn't be any clearer. Frazier is completely unfamiliar with this jacket, as far as he is concerned he's never even seen Oswald wearing it before, let alone on the morning of the assassination.
To dismiss Frazier's testimony on this point just because it doesn't agree with your explanation of how CE 163 ended up in the TSBD is unwarranted.
If Frazier's testimony regarding CE 163 means anything, it means there has to be another explanation as to how CE 163 ended up there. No other reasonable conclusion can be drawn if Frazier's testimony is accepted.

And that's the conudrum. According to Marina, Oswald had only two jackets, yet Frazier dismisses both CE 162 and CE 163 as the jacket he saw Oswald wear that Friday morning. It most certainly doesn't justify the conclusion that Oswald was wearing CE 162 that morning. In fact, with CE 163 being found at the TSBD the most likely jacket, despite Frazier's failure to identify it, is in fact CE 163

And yet they must both have been in the room, because how else could Frazier dismiss them both as the jacket he had seen?

The conundrum is that CE 162 is never introduced into the hearing. It is never mentioned. Frazier is never asked to look at it so he never gets a chance to dismiss it. CE 163 is introduced, this is in the transcript of the hearing, and Frazier dismisses it out of hand as the jacket wore that morning.
We can assume and speculate all we want - maybe Ball misspoke - but the fact remains, at no point is CE 162 mentioned during Frazier's questioning. That is a fact.

There can be little doubt what jacket Oswald wore to work that morning and it most certainly was not the dark blue jacket subsequently found at the TSBD.

And this is where fact becomes opinion and speculation.

You've taken this out of context.
It is clearly referring to Frazier's testimony, which is unequivocal - Oswald wore a light gray, long-sleeved zipper jacket to work that morning. This cannot be denied. Frazier's testimony is emphatic on this point. To sweep away all of his testimony, his multiple references to knowing this jacket, is tantamount to saying he is perjuring himself. He could not be any clearer. There is no ambiguity, no ambivalence, no doubt. His testimony is clear.

That's one hell of an assumption. How do you know that the grey jacket wasn't found during the first search of the Paine house?
The answer is that you only assume it. The backyard photos were officially not found until the second search of the Paine house, the one with the warrant, yet on Friday evening Michael Paine was shown a BT photo by an FBI agent and Fritz confronted Oswald with a photo on Saturday morning, hours before the photos were allegedly found.

Is that the sound of metallic headgear being donned I hear.
What are you saying? You have some kind of proof the jacket was found at the Paine house? Oh, you don't? You're suggesting the evidence was (drum roll) planted?
Here's why it's not an assumption - Frazier testifies that Oswald was wearing the same jacket on Friday morning that he was wearing on Thursday when he dropped him off. He is certain of it. He qualifies it by saying, for the third time, how familiar he is with the jacket.
Unless Frazier was part of the (drum roll) conspiracy to frame Oswald's jacket 

Your inability to accept straight-forward testimony in favour of Tinfoil  speaks volumes.

I find it somewhat remarkable that the white jacket that was found at the parking lot, somehow became a grey jacket with initials on it from officers who were not in the chain of custody (and no initials of the unidentified officers that were) would end up only being submitted to the Identification Bureau after the officers had returned of their first search of the Paine house.

I've heard you say this before. What is it about the initials you find so objective?
It is something I'm genuinely interested in.

What are you rambling on about? His jacket was in fact found at the TSBD. It just wasn't CE 162.

Again, you're taking things out of context.
When I say "this jacket" I am clearly referring to the light gray, long-sleeved, zippered jacket Frazier identified, this was never found in the TSBD.
It's a really desperate move on your behalf.

This is where your concocted story goes off the rails. You have Oswald going to the TSBD on Friday morning wearing a grey jacket (CE 162), you then have him leaving the TSBD wearing the same jacket, despite witness testimony that he wasn't wearing a jacket, yet at the TSBD another jacket (CE 163) is later found. Does this make sense to you?

"You have Oswald going to the TSBD on Friday morning wearing a grey jacket..."

Frazier has Oswald going into work wearing a light grey jacket. He is emphatic about it. There can be no doubt about it.

"...you then have him leaving the TSBD wearing the same jacket, despite witness testimony that he wasn't wearing a jacket..."

Please cite the witness who saw Oswald leaving the TSBD without a jacket.

Does it make sense to you that Frazier emphatically denies Oswald was wearing CE 163 that morning, that he emphatically identifies a light grey, long-sleeved, zippered jacket, that he identifies this same  light grey, long-sleeved, zippered jacket as the one Oswald was wearing on Thursday night and that this is the jacket found in the TSBD??

Does Frazier lying about it make sense? That the authorities discovered it at the Paine's then planted it, does that make sense?

[Bill Chapman]

Both Linnie & Buell said the jacket had wide sleeves
Linnie said the jacket was closer to the blue gray one (163)

Mr. BALL. Well, this one is gray but of these two the jacket I last showed you is Commission Exhibit No. 162, and this blue gray is 163, now if you had to choose between these two?
Mrs. RANDLE. I would choose the dark one.
Mr. BALL. You would choose the dark one?
Mrs. RANDLE. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. Which is 163, as being more similar to the jacket he had?
Mrs. RANDLE. Yes, sir; that I remember. But I, you know, didn't pay an awful lot of attention to his jacket. I remember his T-shirt and the shirt more so than I do the jacket.
Mr. BALL. The witness just stated that 163 which is the gray-blue is similar to the jacket he had on. 162, the light gray jacket was not.
Mrs. RANDLE. Yes.

[Dan O'meara]

Both Linnie & Buell said the jacket had wide sleeves
Linnie said the jacket was closer to the blue gray one (163)

Mr. BALL. Well, this one is gray but of these two the jacket I last showed you is Commission Exhibit No. 162, and this blue gray is 163, now if you had to choose between these two?
Mrs. RANDLE. I would choose the dark one.
Mr. BALL. You would choose the dark one?
Mrs. RANDLE. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. Which is 163, as being more similar to the jacket he had?
Mrs. RANDLE. Yes, sir; that I remember. But I, you know, didn't pay an awful lot of attention to his jacket. I remember his T-shirt and the shirt more so than I do the jacket.
Mr. BALL. The witness just stated that 163 which is the gray-blue is similar to the jacket he had on. 162, the light gray jacket was not.
Mrs. RANDLE. Yes.

What do you think about my analysis of Frazier's testimony?

[Dan O'meara]

When Ball talked to Helen Markham he actually showed her the 162 jacket:

Mr. BALL. I have here an exhibit, Commission Exhibit 162, a jacket. Did you ever see this before?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No; I did not.
Mr. BALL. Does it look like, anything like, the jacket the man had on?
Mrs. MARKHAM. It is short, open down the front. But that jacket it is a darker jacket than that, I know it was.
Mr. BALL. You don't think it was as light a jacket as that?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, it was darker than that, I know it was. At that moment I was so excited--

That sucked big time!

I wonder what happened to the jacket she saw Oswald wearing when he shot Tippit.
Because she identified Oswald as the shooter:

Mr. BALL. When you identified Oswald--it was the number 2 man--were you told the number 2 man whom you identified in the lineup?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, I was not.
Mr. BALL. Were you ever told his name?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No.
Mr. BALL. Ever told his name later?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Nobody, nobody told me nothing.
Mr. BALL. Well, the man that you identified as the number 2 man in the lineup in the police station, you identified him as the man you had seen shoot Officer Tippit?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Yes, I did.
Mr. BALL. Did you identify him because of his clothing that he had on at that time in the lineup.
Mrs. MARKHAM. Just like I told you. I mostly looked at his face, his eyes, and his clothing, too.

And she is definite he had a light, short jacket on:

Mrs. MARKHAM. He had on a light short jacket, dark trousers. I looked at his clothing, but I looked at his face, too.
Mr. BALL. Did he have the same clothing on that the man had that you saw shoot the officer?
Mrs. MARKHAM. He had, these dark trousers on.
Mr. BALL. Did he have a jacket or a shirt? The man that you saw shoot Officer Tippit and run away, did you notice if he had a jacket on?
Mrs. MARKHAM. He had a jacket on when he done it.
Mr. BALL. What kind of a jacket, what general color of jacket?
Mrs. MARKHAM. It was a short jacket open in the front, kind of a grayish tan.

I wonder what happened to that jacket?
Because Oswald wasn't wearing it in the Texas Theater..
I wonder where it went.
Just like I wonder where the jacket went that Earlene Roberts is absolutely certain Oswald was wearing when he left the rooming house.
Where do you think that jacket went Otto?
Because Oswald didn't have it with him in the Theater.

Or did he?