Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
Joe Simmons

Author Topic: Things I don't care about  (Read 782 times)

Online Tom Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3955
Re: Things I don't care about
« Reply #21 on: July 18, 2026, 03:09:35 AM »
After Baldwin got hired as AMA "PR Flack" in 1955, Shaw hired Jesse Core, Baldwin's sidekick in Calcuitta, to take Baldwin's place.
Edwin Walker's Turtle Creek landlord hosted Core and William Ruffle's daughter's engagement party in the same house Oswald allegedly
later broke an exterior window pain, of.  William Ruffle was a Dallas newspaper opinion editor who is credited with coining the oppressive phrase, "Right to Work"!

Do you think Clay Shaw was a "highly paid contract source" who was helping the CIA bring fascism back to Italy?
« Last Edit: July 18, 2026, 03:34:36 AM by Tom Graves »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Things I don't care about
« Reply #21 on: July 18, 2026, 03:09:35 AM »


Online Benjamin Cole

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 892
Re: Things I don't care about
« Reply #22 on: July 18, 2026, 03:27:14 AM »
The CIA historian published a CIA-vetted report, on CIA letterhead, that Clay Shaw was a "highly paid contract source" for the CIA in the 1950s.

You say Shaw was only a volunteer. 


Online Tom Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3955
Re: Things I don't care about
« Reply #23 on: July 18, 2026, 03:32:42 AM »
The CIA historian published a CIA-vetted report, on CIA letterhead, that Clay Shaw was a "highly paid contract source" for the CIA in the 1950s.

IIRC, that wasn't the only mistake your boy, J. Kenneth McDonnald, made in that rushed-and-cobbled-together report.

Fred Litwin has written:

As for the document's reliability, researcher Paul Hoch has found another example of where it was wrong. It refers to "records relating to Gilberto Alvarado, who maintained that he witnessed Cubans passing Oswald cash at a party on the night before the assassination." In fact, this description is obviously a confused mashup of two allegations that were separately made: one by Gilberto Alvarado in 1963 (which he ultimately retracted), and another, made later, by Elena Garro de Paz. A different page in the 1992 document correctly describes Alvarado as "the Nicaraguan who claimed he saw Lee Harvey Oswald receive cash in meetings inside Mexico City Cuban embassy." Elena Garro de Paz claimed to have seen Oswald and two companions at a "twist party" in Mexico City. The date given for this twist party (November 21) matches neither allegation and is obviously an error, thus suggesting that the 1992 document is not a completely reliable accounting of what is in the CIA's own archive. On the night before the assassination, Oswald was in Dallas with Marina at Ruth Paine's house (thus he could not have received cash in Alvarado's presence or have been at a party in Mexico City). Oswald was only in Mexico City from September 26 to October 3. If he attended a party - which is a big if - it could only have happened during this time period.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2026, 04:33:58 AM by Tom Graves »

Online Brian Doyle

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 89
Things I don't care about
« Reply #24 on: July 19, 2026, 02:12:02 PM »


Shaw was the only OSS agent allowed to work with British intelligence in Italy in WWII...As in the Kennedy conspiracy and Permindex, this showed special deep Intel status...British Intelligence and Permindex shared a hot Cold War front in that area of the world at the time...The same area that Jimi Hendrix manager and MI-6 member Michael Jeffery worked in during his national service in the 1950's...

Online Steve M. Galbraith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1944
Re: Things I don't care about
« Reply #25 on: July 19, 2026, 04:36:31 PM »
From what I've read (the Carpenter and Litwin books, primary sources, et cetera), Shaw was assigned to the SOS in the war not the OSS. The SOS was Services of Supply. He was a supply officer who, among other duties, was assigned to help stockpile supplies for the Normandy Invasion; he was not an intelligence officer. According to his military records he was stationed in England, France and Belgium during the war. He was never in Italy.

Roughly ~24,000 people worked for the OSS during the war. Including the famous chef Julia Child (her maiden name was McWilliams). I added her name just to point out that simply working for the OSS or the CIA doesn't mean you're an agent or involved in espionage.

Here is a list of those people: https://www.archives.gov/files/iwg/declassified-records/rg-226-oss/personnel-database.pdf

Shaw is not on the list.

And, for kicks, here is Julia Child's file. She was a typist and research/administrative assistant during her service and was paid $2980 each year (she was not a "spy"): https://catalog.archives.gov/medialive/61/1806/2180661/content/arcmedia/oss/McWilliams_Child_Julia.pdf
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 04:26:53 PM by Steve M. Galbraith »

Online Brian Doyle

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 89
Things I don't care about
« Reply #26 on: July 19, 2026, 04:46:33 PM »


No...Sure...

Permindex, the Kennedy conspiracy, and Richard Helms being caught committing perjury over Shaw all point towards what you wrote...

Online Tom Scully

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1294
Re: Things I don't care about
« Reply #27 on: July 19, 2026, 06:40:37 PM »
From what I've read (the Carpenter and Litwin books et cetera), Shaw was assigned to the SOS in the war not the OSS. The SOS was Service of Supply. He was a supply officer who, among other duties, was assigned to help stockpile supplies for the Normandy Invasion; he was not an intelligence officer. According to his military records he was stationed in England, France and Belgium during the war. He was never in Italy.

Roughly ~24,000 people worked for the OSS during the war. Including the famous chef Julia Child (her maiden name was McWilliams).

Here is a list of those people: https://www.archives.gov/files/iwg/declassified-records/rg-226-oss/personnel-database.pdf

Shaw is not on the list.

And, for kicks, here is Julia Child's file. She was a typist and administrative assistant during her service and was paid $2980 each year (she was not a "spy"): https://catalog.archives.go v/medialive/61/1806/2180661/content/arcmedia/oss/McWilliams_Child_Julia.pdf

Carpenter's research discredits Litwin, so what you took away from reading Carpenter's book were only the points that confirmed your bias.
Seeking to confirm my independent research results in early 2016,

April 12, 2016 (Archived, it takes a minute to load in your browser)

https://web.archive.org/web/20161229152232/https://jfkfacts.org/provocative-prolific-joan-mellen/#comment-869223#comment-869223

....that the publicly presented, "divide" between Garrison and Shaw could have been
settled  at a Sunday dinner table gathering of Garrison and his wife's first cousin David Baldwin, and his Lemann in-laws
,  The only source I found
that confirmed my research was in Carpenter's book.


Fred, by including images of Nicholas Lemann's GQ article, https://www.onthetrailofdelusion.com/post/gq-magazine-the-case-against-jim-garrison
exactly timed by GQ editors, and Lemann, to arrive on news stands coinciding with the release of Oliver Stone's film, in Fred's presentation
without disclosing that Nicholas Lemann's step-grandmother was the mother-in-law of David Baldwin,  who had informed Shaw that he, David was the godfather and first
cousin of Garrison's wife, Leah, indicates Fred buys into the entire charade, and that you do, too. It is obvious Nicholas and Garrison were misleading both Joan Mellen
and the editor of Garrison's "On the Trail...." Zachary Sklar
, who was also Oliver Stone's co-screen play writer of JFK, the movie.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,5112.msg182698.html#msg182698

Quote
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1435.msg46831.html#msg46831
.....

Tom S. June 6, 2016 at 11:37 pm
Part II of II

Oliver Stone protested :.....
......
Here is the link to Nicholas Lemann and Zachary Sklar trading letters in GQ, after the Lemann?s Jan., 1992 article was published?..

Lemann responds on pg. 2, to Sklar?s letter which begins on pg 1.:

http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/S%20Disk/Stone%20Oliver%20JFK%20Movie/Gentleman's%20Quarterly/Item%2002.pdf
...
No disclosure in Nicholas?s rebuttal to Zachary Sklar, or from Sklar about Lemann?s conflicts/background:.
......
« Last Edit: July 19, 2026, 08:20:05 PM by Tom Scully »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Things I don't care about
« Reply #27 on: July 19, 2026, 06:40:37 PM »