Larry Hancock's JFKA Blog

[John Mytton]

I have one question for everyone who is fretting about whether LHO was acting on behalf of the Cubans, Soviets, CIA, Mafia, etc. How did any of these entities know in advance that Oswald would end up working in a building overlooking a motorcade route that had not even been planned when he was hired. If you can't answer that simple question, I have no idea why any of you would want to go down any of those rabbit holes.

Before applying for the TSBD job, Oswald applied and was rejected for several jobs which were nowhere near the motorcade. In fact the only reason Oswald ended up applying for the TSBD job was because Buell Wesley Frazier worked there and during a meeting of local ladies including Linnie Mae, Frazier's sister, the topic of Oswald's unemployment was mentioned so Ruth Paine rang the TSBD to see if Oswald could get a job. Ruth Paine is often accused by the clueless CT community of being part of the conspiracy but as just seen, the amount of random events that needed to coincide ensures that Ruth was just being helpful.



JohnM

[Tom Graves]

Before applying for the TSBD job, Oswald applied and was rejected for several jobs which were nowhere near the motorcade. In fact the only reason Oswald ended up applying for the TSBD job was because Buell Wesley Frazier worked there and during a meeting of local ladies including Linnie Mae, Frazier's sister, the topic of Oswald's unemployment was mentioned so Ruth Paine rang the TSBD to see if Oswald could get a job. Ruth Paine is often accused by the clueless CT community of being part of the conspiracy but as just seen, the amount of random events that needed to coincide ensures that Ruth was just being helpful.



JohnM

Dear M-H M,

You should have written ". . . Russophile Ruth Paine rang the TSBD . . .", and you might have included the fact that in the early 1970s, CIA Counterintelligence analyst Clare Edward Petty determined by reading some WW II Venona decrypts that Oswald's Dallas mentor, George DeMohrenchildt, was very probably a long-term KGB "illegal."

-- Tom

[Benjamin Cole]

LP--

You make good points.

OTOH, the Kennedy trip to Dallas was known by the public two months in advance. The actual route was published locally on Nov. 19.

How much planning does it take to say, "We will hole up in the TSBD6 and fire on JFK after he passes. The diversion will fire from the GK area about the same time."

Remember, LHO had military background, got through Marine boot camp. This is pretty basic stuff. If G2'ers were his confederates, they likely had military backgrounds too.

It was circumstance, or (foul) luck, that LHO worked in the TSBD. Likely, LHO carried his rifle in on 11.22. The other rifle maybe was carried in the same day, or the night before. Security was lax at the TSBD.

The JFKA was not a sophisticated operation. It largely involved a huge stroke of luck (LHO in the TSBD), and then pointing guns and shooting.

BTW, there is the "Sawyer memo": DPD Inspector Sawyer reported one witness told him that he (the witness) saw a man running from the TSBD carrying a Winchester, in the immediate aftermath of the JFKA.

Gus Russo reported LHO was friendly with G2. There's your connection. LHO was seen by some in G2 company in MC and NO.

Caveat emptor, and draw your own conclusions.

[John Corbett]

Before applying for the TSBD job, Oswald applied and was rejected for several jobs which were nowhere near the motorcade. In fact the only reason Oswald ended up applying for the TSBD job was because Buell Wesley Frazier worked there and during a meeting of local ladies including Linnie Mae, Frazier's sister, the topic of Oswald's unemployment was mentioned so Ruth Paine rang the TSBD to see if Oswald could get a job. Ruth Paine is often accused by the clueless CT community of being part of the conspiracy but as just seen, the amount of random events that needed to coincide ensures that Ruth was just being helpful.



JohnM

Those who think Ruth Paine was complicit by getting LHO hired at the TSBD need to explain how she knew a motorcade that hadn't even been planned much less made public was going to be routed right past the TSBD.

[John Corbett]

LP--

You make good points.

OTOH, the Kennedy trip to Dallas was known by the public two months in advance. The actual route was published locally on Nov. 19.

Almost 6 weeks after LHO was hired by the TSBD.

How much planning does it take to say, "We will hole up in the TSBD6 and fire on JFK after he passes. The diversion will fire from the GK area about the same time."

How much planning does it take to say, "I'll have Frazier take me to Ruth Paine's house on Thursday evening and I'll get my rifle and hide it in a bag I'm going to make. Then I'll bring it to work the next morning and after everybody breaks for lunch I'll find a secluded spot and when JFK comes by, I'll stick my rifle out the window and blow his brains out."

Remember, LHO had military background, got through Marine boot camp. This is pretty basic stuff. If G2'ers were his confederates, they likely had military backgrounds too.

Why did LHO need confederates?

It was circumstance, or (foul) luck, that LHO worked in the TSBD. Likely, LHO carried his rifle in on 11.22. The other rifle maybe was carried in the same day, or the night before. Security was lax at the TSBD.

Why was another rifle needed?

The JFKA was not a sophisticated operation.

That's true. One guy was able to do it all by himself with a cheap war surplus  rifle.

It largely involved a huge stroke of luck (LHO in the TSBD), and then pointing guns and shooting.

Oswald only had one gun. That's all he needed.

BTW, there is the "Sawyer memo": DPD Inspector Sawyer reported one witness told him that he (the witness) saw a man running from the TSBD carrying a Winchester, in the immediate aftermath of the JFKA.

One nameless witness. That's really compelling. If your imaginary second gunman was on the GK, why was he running from the TSBD?

Gus Russo reported LHO was friendly with G2. There's your connection. LHO was seen by some in G2 company in MC and NO.

There's some hard evidence of a conspiracy. <chuckle>

Caveat emptor, and draw your own conclusions.

My conclusion is you need a reality check.

[Lance Payette]

LP--

You make good points.

OTOH, the Kennedy trip to Dallas was known by the public two months in advance. The actual route was published locally on Nov. 19.

How much planning does it take to say, "We will hole up in the TSBD6 and fire on JFK after he passes. The diversion will fire from the GK area about the same time."

Why would we hole up in the TSBD6? That is a fantastically risky location from every angle, before and after the actual shooting. Even if Oswald was one of our gunman, why was he not on the roof of the Dal-Tex or County Records building? It was the lunch hour - he could have gone anywhere. A high-caliber rifle not traceable to him could have been waiting. As is so often the case, this seems to me like ad hoc reasoning because we are stuck with the inconvenient fact that Oswald did his shooting from TSBD6.

If I can see the screaming flaws in this scenario, how is it possible the KGB and/or G2 couldn't see them?

I haven't followed the "diversion" argument, but what does that add? With or without a diversion, it was a certainty lots of people were going to realize the shots had come from TSBD6 and, moreover, Oswald chances of simply walking out of the building had to be miniscule at best.

It largely involved a huge stroke of luck (LHO in the TSBD), and then pointing guns and shooting.

Even in the LN scenario, I think it involved FANTASTIC strokes of luck, from Oswald managing to get the rifle out of the Paine garage and into the TSDB ... to finding himself alone on the sixth floor ... to actually accomplishing his objective ... to walking out of the building. Without the Tippit encounter, he might still be living in Havana (or maybe Boise) today. This to me cuts against a conspiracy - why would the KGB or G2 trust to all these fantastic strokes of luck, especially with an erratic character like Oswald, when the objective could have been achieved much more easily and cleanly without Oswald at all?

BTW, there is the "Sawyer memo": DPD Inspector Sawyer reported one witness told him that he (the witness) saw a man running from the TSBD carrying a Winchester, in the immediate aftermath of the JFKA.

That was Chuck Connors, who was coincidentally filming an episode of "Rifleman."  Take it from me, a lever-action 30-30 Winchester is not an assassination weapon. I think I described my experience of stupidly sitting on my front porch on my father-in-law's ranch and firing both a 30-06 and a 30-30 Winchester at an old truck frame perhaps 20 yards away. The 30-06 pierced the frame and left a hole as neat as a drill. The 30-30 ricocheted off and thudded against the side of the house about 5 feet to the right of my silly head.

Gus Russo reported LHO was friendly with G2. There's your connection. LHO was seen by some in G2 company in MC and NO.

Much as I'm intrigued by Russo's work, he needs to provide something a lot more evidential than "Take it from me." He seems to have pretty much disappeared from the scene, and I could find no contact information. As stated above, I'm troubled by the fact that G2 would be using someone like Oswald whose background and highly public sympathies would point directly to Castro. Logically, wouldn't they use a gunman who would point away from them if caught, and wouldn't they take a lot more precautions than turning him loose in TSBD6 and leaving him to fend for himself?

I'm really beginning to think I need to come out of retirement and get into planning political assassinations. I seem to be way better at it than all the hypothesized conspirators in the JFKA!

[Benjamin Cole]

Not sure I follow your reasoning on several points.

The TSBD was a perfect location, right by the hairpin turn onto Elm.

TSBD6 was not a floor with offices, but only boxes of books. Nobody went there except to place or retrieve books. By luck, the JFK motorcade passed the TSBD during the lunch hour. Again, that was luck, but made for an excellent sniper's secluded nest. The TSBD6 was deserted. Perhaps, if someone had been there, LHO would have gone up to TSBD7.

I don't know every building in Dallas, but the TSBD was about good as one could hope. 

LHO was able to secret a rifle into the TSBD without notice. That alone made the TSBD a good choice. LHO, a lithe 24, and who had mustered through Marine boot camp, knew of the back stairs out of the TSBD, that would provide a quick exit. He proved the worth of that exit route.

My suspected second gunsel indeed may have fired from another location behind the limo, such as Dal-Tex building. I don't know.

Of course, the JFKA was risky operation. The use of a diversion on the GK likely increased odds of escape.

Still, again, you are assuming the perps think as you do.

For example, the perps of the 1954 Capitol shooting cared more about the act, than escaping.

The shooting of the U.S. Capitol occurred on March 1, 1954, when four Puerto Rican nationalists—Lolita Lebrón, Rafael Cancel Miranda, Andres Figueroa Cordero, and Irvin Flores Rodríguez—fired approximately 30 shots from the House visitors' gallery to protest U.S. rule, wounding five congressmen. All assailants were captured, convicted, and imprisoned, later having their sentences commuted by President Jimmy Carter in 1978 and 1979.

In 1950, two Puerto Rican nationalists, Oscar Collazo and Griselio Torresola, attempted to force their way into the Blair House in Washington, D.C., where Truman was staying during renovations of the White House.

In both above cases, there was a conspiracy of assassins, who wanted to perp the act more than they wanted to escape. There was Latin American leftist politics being played out. There were zealots and extremists all over Cuba and Latin America during the 1950s-60s. Assassinations were common.

(AI: Political assassinations in Latin America during the 1950s and 1960s were frequent, reflecting intense Cold War tensions, the prevalence of military dictatorships, and rising revolutionary movements. These killings often aimed to eliminate political opposition, silence critics of entrenched regimes, or, in the case of CIA-backed initiatives, prevent the spread of communism.)

A couple hot-head G2'ers, seeking revenge for JFK's many assassination attempts on Castro, may have also wanted to perp the act more than they wanted to escape.

The G2'ers may have been surprised they were able to simply drive away from Dallas, and then to read in the papers that LHO was a LN.

You say there were flaws in the JFKA CT. Of course, there were---it was a simple, low-level op. But it worked, so it wasn't that flawed.

---30---

I have not done much plinking, and that long ago. I did fire a 30.06 and I saw why everyone seemed to like them. I don't know why you are so down on Winchesters. Maybe you had a lesser sample.

AI: Model 70 (Bolt-Action): Often called "The Rifleman's Rifle," the Model 70 is praised for its accuracy, classic Mauser-style controlled-feed action, and three-position safety. It is considered a top-tier hunting rifle.Model 94 (Lever-Action): Iconic for deer hunting, the Model 94 is known for being lightweight, compact, and reliable in rugged conditions.
The Winchester is also highly regarded.