Tippit Shooting 1:15-1:16

[Lance Payette]

...not what Guinyard claimed to see.

In reviewing the "split case" issue on several gun forums, it does appear that splitting occurs when the chamber is too large for the shell, as was apparently the situation with Oswald's revolver. One guy specifically mentioned an inability to eject the shells. However, he indicated a single split case prevented the ejector rod from working at all. So, we would have to picture Oswald, on the run, opening the cylinder, attempting to use the ejector rod, realizing it didn't work, and shaking the shells into his hand or prying them out with his fingers. All of which sounds a bit unlikely on the run, seconds after the murder. Unless the gun wasn't fully loaded when he shot Tippit, he would still have had two live rounds and it's difficult to picture why he would have been desperate to fiddle with the gun.

Trying to picture what Oswald actually did, and why, is one of my favorite sleep-inducing exercises. Sort of like counting sheep.

[Michael Capasse]

In reviewing the "split case" issue on several gun forums, it does appear that splitting occurs when the chamber is too large for the shell, as was apparently the situation with Oswald's revolver. One guy specifically mentioned an inability to eject the shells. However, he indicated a single split case prevented the ejector rod from working at all. So, we would have to picture Oswald, on the run, opening the cylinder, attempting to use the ejector rod, realizing it didn't work, and shaking the shells into his hand or prying them out with his fingers. All of which sounds a bit unlikely on the run, seconds after the murder. Unless the gun wasn't fully loaded when he shot Tippit, he would still have had two live rounds and it's difficult to picture why he would have been desperate to fiddle with the gun.

Trying to picture what Oswald actually did, and why, is one of my favorite sleep-inducing exercises. Sort of like counting sheep.

except no one else saw that and the killer was already on Patton

[Lance Payette]

Hmmmm ... The exhaustive report of the HSCA Firearms Panel, https://www.jfk-assassination.net/russ/jfkinfo/hscv7g.htm#tippit, discusses all cartridge issues. The panel carefully noted that one of the cartridges test-fired by the FBI split, as did one of those test-fired by the panel. See the discussion at paragraph 197 of the report. The reasons given are consistent with what has been stated above. HOWEVER, in its discussion of the four shells found at the Tippit scene, NO splitting is noted - as would surely have been the case if splitting had occurred. The gun was fully loaded when Oswald was arrested, so there wasn't a split casing from the Tippit murder still stuck in the cylinder. Make of this what you will, but it seems a bit of a conundrum.

[Charles Collins]

In reviewing the "split case" issue on several gun forums, it does appear that splitting occurs when the chamber is too large for the shell, as was apparently the situation with Oswald's revolver. One guy specifically mentioned an inability to eject the shells. However, he indicated a single split case prevented the ejector rod from working at all. So, we would have to picture Oswald, on the run, opening the cylinder, attempting to use the ejector rod, realizing it didn't work, and shaking the shells into his hand or prying them out with his fingers. All of which sounds a bit unlikely on the run, seconds after the murder. Unless the gun wasn't fully loaded when he shot Tippit, he would still have had two live rounds and it's difficult to picture why he would have been desperate to fiddle with the gun.

Trying to picture what Oswald actually did, and why, is one of my favorite sleep-inducing exercises. Sort of like counting sheep.

Unless the gun wasn't fully loaded when he shot Tippit, he would still have had two live rounds and it's difficult to picture why he would have been desperate to fiddle with the gun.


While you might consider two rounds as adequate for the situation, LHO (due to his military training) most likely did not. I think he would have wanted a fully loaded revolver in this situation. His military training could have also been a factor in this.

I will never forget the time some idiot crashed the gates at Lackland AFB. He and his passengers were promptly treated to a Bonnie & Clyde style shooting. They cornered them in our squadron area. (Shoot first and ask questions later in that situation.) Military are trained to be ready. Having a fully loaded weapon in LHO’s situation would have been pretty much an automatic, second nature type of thing in my opinion.

[Charles Collins]

Hmmmm ... The exhaustive report of the HSCA Firearms Panel, https://www.jfk-assassination.net/russ/jfkinfo/hscv7g.htm#tippit, discusses all cartridge issues. The panel carefully noted that one of the cartridges test-fired by the FBI split, as did one of those test-fired by the panel. See the discussion at paragraph 197 of the report. The reasons given are consistent with what has been stated above. HOWEVER, in its discussion of the four shells found at the Tippit scene, NO splitting is noted - as would surely have been the case if splitting had occurred. The gun was fully loaded when Oswald was arrested, so there wasn't a split casing from the Tippit murder still stuck in the cylinder. Make of this what you will, but it seems a bit of a conundrum.

At least one witness said he heard five shots, Callaway if I remember correctly. I think that LHO must have eventually managed to pry the split case out and replaced it. This might have happened anytime and anywhere between the Tippit shooting and his arrest. Just because the split case wasn’t found and recovered doesn’t necessarily mean it didn’t happen.

[Tim Nickerson]

Hmmmm ... The exhaustive report of the HSCA Firearms Panel, https://www.jfk-assassination.net/russ/jfkinfo/hscv7g.htm#tippit, discusses all cartridge issues. The panel carefully noted that one of the cartridges test-fired by the FBI split, as did one of those test-fired by the panel. See the discussion at paragraph 197 of the report. The reasons given are consistent with what has been stated above. HOWEVER, in its discussion of the four shells found at the Tippit scene, NO splitting is noted - as would surely have been the case if splitting had occurred. The gun was fully loaded when Oswald was arrested, so there wasn't a split casing from the Tippit murder still stuck in the cylinder. Make of this what you will, but it seems a bit of a conundrum.

In the 5 shots/1 miss scenario, Oswald was unable to remove the split shell at the scene and carried it away, removing it after it had cooled down.

[Tim Nickerson]

At least one witness said he heard five shots, Callaway if I remember correctly. I think that LHO must have eventually managed to pry the split case out and replaced it. This might have happened anytime and anywhere between the Tippit shooting and his arrest. Just because the split case wasn’t found and recovered doesn’t necessarily mean it didn’t happen.

 

[Lance Payette]

At least one witness said he heard five shots, Callaway if I remember correctly. I think that LHO must have eventually managed to pry the split case out and replaced it. This might have happened anytime and anywhere between the Tippit shooting and his arrest. Just because the split case wasn’t found and recovered doesn’t necessarily mean it didn’t happen.

Yes, the five-shot thing had occurred to me as well. I'm not arguing in favor of the CT position by any means, but the entire scenario does have a certain implausibility, with Oswald fumbling to reload his gun as he runs away as though he were prepared to shoot anyone who got in his way, brave used car salesman Callaway confronting him with "What the hell is going on?", Oswald shrugging like a hapless goof instead of pointing the gun at Callaway, and Guinyard noticing an amazing level of detail when one might have expected a lowly lot porter to dive under the nearest $500 Chevy. It may be what occurred, but it does seem somewhat implausible. The "one witness who heard five shots was correct" and "the fifth shot was the split casing that was never found" does sound a bit like the sort of convenient ad hoc speculation in which CTers specialize.