JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion & Debate > JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate
The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
Dan O'meara:
--- Quote from: Royell Storing on June 27, 2025, 01:00:07 AM --- Well, let's see. I have Proven that those 2 Huge Gates were "Wide Open" per Officer Luke Mooney's WC Testimony, the Towner Film, and the Couch Film (reverse negative). Those Huge Gates were "Wide Open" before, during, and after the Kill Shot. This clearly proves MORE than 1 person was involved in the JFK Assassination. Somebody, (Oswald) had to open those gates, and then someone had to monitor the gates so they were Not closed before being used to exit the TSBD. Those wide open huge gates prove a Conspiracy all by themselves.
--- End quote ---
Hate to burst your bubble, Royell, but I dealt with the "Huge Gates" years ago and in much more detail than you have.
It's in this thread - https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,3078.msg119172.html#msg119172
It starts at Reply#559, read on from there.
All it proves is that the building was not locked down properly. That's all.
It does NOT prove that more than one person was involved in the assassination.
These gates were not closed for at least ten minutes. More importantly, the door to the west of the TSBD building wasn't secured at any point during the day. People could come and go as they pleased through this entrance.
Dan O'meara:
--- Quote from: Jarrett Smith on June 27, 2025, 06:18:46 AM ---Maybe not professional, but they got the job done with four shots, and yes luck was on their side.
--- End quote ---
So, you agree the assassination was not professional. That's the point I was making.
It was not carried out by someone hired/contracted for their specific skill as a marksman.
It would appear to be carried out by someone familiar with rifles but not particularly skilled.
Dan O'meara:
--- Quote from: Richard Smith on June 27, 2025, 01:58:21 PM ---One interesting thing about the Grassy Knoll is that it is usually depicted from the Elm St. perspective where it appears to offer a secluded shooting location. In fact, on the backside of the fence/treeline it is wide open to half of Dallas. It is the very last place that anyone would put themselves with a rifle.
--- End quote ---
Agreed.
Because there was hardly anyone in this area during the actual shooting a lot of 'researchers' fail to grasp that no-one knew prior to the shooting that this would be the case.
They never consider the actual planning stage of their pet theory.
The area around the GK could have been swarming with hundreds of people. The car park was completely wide open, as we can see below.
Nobody, in their right mind, would plan to take a shot from behind the picket fence as they would have absolutely no idea as to how many people would be in this area on the day. It's a ludicrous notion.
Dan O'meara:
--- Quote from: Charles Collins on June 27, 2025, 03:40:29 PM ---While I tend to agree with the main point of the first post, I think that often times we can create conditions where “luck” becomes more likely to happen. The limited time that the assassin apparently had to plan his ambush made things more difficult. Especially for him to “cover his tracks.” However, consider the items he managed to get accomplished in order to be able to get three shots off before anyone could stop him.
1. He managed to retrieve the rifle and sneak it into the TSBD without any apparent suspicions being voiced before the assassination. This is even though he didn’t drive and had to hitch a ride from BWF.
2. He planned his ambush to be from behind and above the target. This gave him not only the element of surprise, but also maximized the time he would have to fire multiple shots.
3. He managed to find and select a position that was visually well shielded from both outside and inside the TSBD. While sitting on the box seat, he was also able to stay out of sight of the SS agents as they approached the TSBD on Houston Street by simply sitting up straight. The boxes in the window would have made it more difficult for any of the SS agents to see him even if they had looked back at that window during the shooting. And keeping his position essentially initially undetected by LEOs he was able to then have a reasonable chance to escape after the assassination.
4. This position was also well selected for having a “kill zone” where the target was moving almost directly away from him. This substantially increased his chances of hitting the target.
5. His ability to act calm and blend in with other people after the assassination helped his escape efforts (for a while). This was lost after the Tippit murder and all the frantic police activity in the area and subsequently led to his capture.
--- End quote ---
I think you're missing the point I was making about the very large element of luck involved in the actual shooting.
In a professional hit, luck is not a factor.
The head shot is an easy shot for a professional. The distances involved are small and there is only minimal lateral movement of the target. To miss the limo completely is not an option for a professional. Even the shot that passes through JFK's throat is a 'miss' as the target is the head.
There is then, at the very minimum, a period of 5 seconds between the non-fatal throat shot and the fatal head shot. This is where the large slice of luck comes in because anything could've happened in this interval that could have rendered the head shot impossible to take.
Luckily, for the shooter, JFK stayed upright and no-one came to his assistance.
I'm surprised that the sloppy and amateurish nature of the assassination isn't used more often by those who believe Oswald was the shooter.
Royell Storing:
--- Quote from: Dan O'meara on June 28, 2025, 10:36:26 AM ---Hate to burst your bubble, Royell, but I dealt with the "Huge Gates" years ago and in much more detail than you have.
It's in this thread - https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,3078.msg119172.html#msg119172
It starts at Reply#559, read on from there.
All it proves is that the building was not locked down properly. That's all.
It does NOT prove that more than one person was involved in the assassination.
These gates were not closed for at least ten minutes. More importantly, the door to the west of the TSBD building wasn't secured at any point during the day. People could come and go as they pleased through this entrance.
--- End quote ---
The link provided above jumps into the middle of the story of the Huge Gates. On top of that, those images show The Gates to be only "ajar". They are not "Wide Open". This is what happens when you jump into the middle of a mystery. You routinely still have a mystery on your hands. The images above were captured After the Kill Shot. What do we know about the status of The Gates before the Kill Shot was fired? Look at the Towner Film as the JFK Limo is turning from Houston St onto Elm St. Where The Gates are supposed to be, we see nothing but a Square Black Hole. Why is that? It is because The Gates and the bright placards on them are Not There. The 2 Huge Gates are "Wide Open" at this point in time prior to the Kill Shot. And for the record, both Gates open INWARD. If you look at a reverse negative of the Couch Film, those Huge Gates are still "Wide Open" (inward), about 30 seconds after the Kill Shot. We see on the Martin Film showing Euins on the back of Officer Harkness 3 wheel motorcycle, that The Gates are only "ajar" at this point in time. The 2 gates then are roughly 2 feet apart from each other. This would be at about 6 or 7 minutes after the Kill Shot. Officer Harkness gave WC Testimony verifying his making a 12:36 police radio transmission regarding his having a witness, (Euins), with respect to seeing shot(s) fired from the TSBD. (Mandatory to read/know sworn testimony if you seriously want to solve this case). So, how did the Huge Gates go from being "Wide Open" on the Towner Film to simply being "ajar" on the Martin Film at 12:36-12:37? Officer Luke Mooney gave WC Testimony that he and 2 other officers found those Huge Gates were "Wide Open" as they walked down the Elm St Extension. The 3 officers were inside the train yard when they received orders to secure the TSBD, and they headed down the Elm Ext to do such when they found The Gates "Wide Open". They walked through The Gates and then the 3 of them "Closed" the gates, but they did Not lock them shut. This then puts the Gates in their "ajar" status. (Martin Film). Mooney and the 2 officers then entered the TSBD from the other side of these Huge Gates. Their entry into the TSBD 1st floor found them extremely close to the Stairwell and the Freight Elevators. The 2 officers went up the stairwell while Mooney used the freight elevator. This was the shooter(s) avenue of escape from the TSBD. Straight down the stairwell and then just feet away from walking through the "Wide Open" Huge Gates and mingling into the shocked crowd on the Elm Ext and around the TSBD.
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