Vicki Adams: The Lost Interview

[John Mytton]

Still desperately looking for a way to discredit the witnesses you don't like, I see... Even calling them "suspicious".... You wouldn't be implying there was a conspiracy between Adams and Garner, would you now? 

OK, I'll play your little game.

1. Here's the Newman's being photographed on the ground and no body is on the grassy Knoll.

2. Nobody was converging in any area for a while after the assassination, the Newman's were photographed lying down and protecting their child and after the area was safe, they stood up and can be seen standing in this photo, also at this point of time, nobody was converging on the "picket fence", in fact the first crowd were running past this area. The grassy Knoll convergence happened way later, time wise about the same time Lovelady and Shelley re-entered the building.

I'm not sure what your point is supposed to be. It has nothing to do with what Garner said. Nobody mentioned the grassy knoll. Adams said in her testimony that she ran towards the railroad tracks, meaning to the area west of the building. Styles told the FBI that she and Adams went in the direction of the railroad where they had observed other people running. Aside from the fact that witnesses do not always get all their facts straight during an interview and that their words might be misinterpreted when somebody else (like an FBI) writes a summary in his report, it really doesn't matter where and when Styles saw people running in a particular direction.

Charles Collins tried to use the argument of the women seeing people lying down and running towards the west of the building as somehow "evidence" that they did not leave the 4th floor window immediately. He estimated that they must have stayed there some 75 seconds. This, however, was easily debunked by the simple fact that if they had stayed 75 seconds at the window before going down the stairs they would have bumped into Truly and Baker coming up after their encounter with Oswald on the 4th floor.

3. If Adams and Styles left immediately then how did Adams see Lovelady and Shelley?

Already explained in one of my earlier posts. Is this confirmation that you simply do not read the posts of people that reply to your posts?

But, here is my reply to Charles Collins again;

Are you now going to pretend that you don't have the intelligence to understand the logic of what I have written?

4. How would Garner know that Adams and Styles footsteps were specifically theirs? E.S.P?

Silly question. Garner immediately went to the storage area after Adams and Styles had left the office. There was only one door to the storage area at the back of the office space. The women were already gone and the only way they could have gone is down the stairs. Garner then heard footsteps on the stairs. Just how many other women do you think went down the stairs from the 4th floor at that particular moment in time?

5. The sounds from the stairwell could have Oswald's because we know Oswald only a couple of floors up left the Sniper's Nest within seconds and if Adam's testimony is to be believed, she says she left anywhere up to THIRTY seconds later, which apparently in her vocabulary means "immediately! LOL!

No. First of all we don't know that Oswald left the sniper's nest within seconds. Your favorite witness, Howard Brennan, actually testified (I'm paraphrasing) that the shooter pulled the rifle in slowly and was in no great rush to leave. Secondly, the shooter had to walk a longer distance than Adams and Styles. The women left through a backdoor of the office and ran in a straight line to the stairs. The shooter had to run nearly the entire east side of the building and than cut across to the stairs at the west side of the building, where he then had to hide the rifle. That alone took him according to the time trials (IIRC) some 30 seconds and he then had to come down two flights of stairs. In other words, if Oswald (or anybody else) had come down the stairs in the manner you suggest he most likely had run into Adams and Styles or be right behind them. Adams testified that she saw nobody and heard nobody else on the stairs.

And btw Adams never stated that "immediately" means 30 seconds. That was made up by some fool who decided to use a dictionary to look up the word, because he clearly did not (want to) understand what normal people mean when they use the word "immediately" in a conversation.

6. Garner says that Adams and Styles left almost right away, yet Adam's says in her testimony she left the window, anywhere up to 30 seconds later?

Where in her testimony did Adams say she left the window "up to 30 seconds later"?

Here's an interesting part of Adams' testimony in which Belin used the word "immediately" twice.

Mr. BELIN - Then you immediately went to the stairs going down from the third to the second?
Miss ADAMS - That's correct.
Mr. BELIN - As you ran down the stairs, did you see anyone on the stairs?
Miss ADAMS - No, sir.
Mr. BELIN - All right. You got down to the second floor. Did you see anyone by the second floor?
Miss ADAMS - No, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Did you immediately turn and run and keep on running down the stairs towards the first floor?
Miss ADAMS - Yes.

Now, according to the dictionary freak, this would mean that Adams waited up to 30 seconds to go down from the 3rd to the 2nd floor and again before going down from the 2nd to the 1st floor. Does it seem even remotely likely to you that Belin had a waiting time of up to 30 seconds in mind when he used the word "immediately"?

To normal people, which means not those who are desperately looking for a silly way to discredit a witness with idiotic made up stuff, the word "immediately" means "instantly" or "straight away". If you disagree, please let me know! 

7. Adams said the shots sounded like they came from right below her but still from her building, yet all these ladies, 1 of which was confirmed to have 3 inch heels, seem to immediately move to a dangerous place where any potential assassin could possibly be?

What's your point? Why did all those people run on the grassy knoll, where the shots possibly came from? Adams and Styles ran to the stairs at the back of the building and then towards the railway yard. They did not run to Elm street or anywhere near the parking lot behind the picket fence? Is this really the best you've got?

8. Why would Garner move "immediately" to the same stair area and stand "alone" in a potentially dangerous building?

9. Why would Garner without knowing where Adams and Styles went, "immediately" even go to the stairwell?

10. Why would Garner go straight to the stairwell and not go any further but stay and wait for some reason, for people to start gathing at the Grassy Knoll and railroad?

11. Garner was obviously focused on staring out the window because she didn't know Adam's and Style's had left, so why on Earth would she leave her perfect vantage point "immediately" and aimlessly end up conveniently at the stairs?

What's with the silly questions? Garner told Barry Ernest exactly what she did and the Stroud letter confirms the most important part of it. If you want to find out why Garner did what she did, hold a seance and ask her!

Nothing what Garner did or did not do has any bearing on the time line of Adams and Styles. This is just you trying yet again to find some way to discredit Garner as a witness. It's pretty pathetic!

Now, are you going to show us the evidence for your claim that Oswald was in fact on the stairs, coming down from the 6th floor to the 2nd or not?

Sorry Martin, instead of speculation, I'll use the evidence. And I don't consider this a "game", to even to suggest that this is a "game" is extremely distasteful!

1) Brennan testified that Lee Harvey Oswald disappeared within a few seconds.

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his mark, and then he disappeared.

2) The fourth floor had TWO elevators and Garner had no idea of where Adams and Styles went, they even could have gone and hid and Garner would never know, but you like to assume that Garner could read minds? Or more likely the girls discussed this event at a later stage but unfortunately for Garner's credibility, she mixed up specific timing details.



3) When looking at a map of Dealey Plaza, Garner had the best view from where she was and considering she had no idea of where Adams and Styles went, her so far elusive reason for going to the back of the building to just stand around makes zero sense.



4) But if indeed Garner went to the stairs immediately after she noticed Adam's and Styles disappearance, a precise timeframe we will never know (for what reason she decided to immediately move at that exact point in time we also will never know) she could have easily heard Oswald.

5) Also Adams said she was three windows across and we know where Oswald's window was, therefore the distance to the stairs from their relative positions only had a difference of two sets of windows and you seem to know the inner layout of furniture and the warehouse and storage area of the 4th floor, please give a more thorough description?

6) The 6th floor boxes at the time were being moved around and we can't possibly know the exact path Oswald took, the SS recreation which looked to be in slow motion played it safe and took the longest journey and even then it wasn't that long and Oswald wasn't hampered by 3 inch heels!



7) And let's not forget that after the assassination and all the screaming, shouting and sirens, Oswald decided to get a coke? And Oswald was seen by Baker in the vestibule hurrying away from the corner with the stairs.

Mr. DULLES - Could you tell us anything more about his appearance, what he was doing, get an impression of the man at all? Did he seem to be hurrying, anything of that kind?
Mr. BAKER - Evidently he was hurrying because at this point here, I was running, and I ran on over here to this door.



  Mr. BELIN - How long do you think it was between the time the shots were fired and the time you left the window to start toward the stairway?
Miss ADAMS - Between 15 and 30 seconds, estimated, approximately.

9) Adam's says she left up to 30 seconds later whereas the obviously not clued in Garner says only moments. Clearly consistency isn't the girls forte.

So in conclusion, the times are all over the place, Adams says she saw Lovelady and Shelley on the first floor and why Garner would immediately go to the rear stairwell and just stand around is highly unlikely. And most importantly her story to Ernst was not under oath and what we have is hearsay. Therefore Oswald could have easily gone down the stairs.

 

JohnM

[Martin Weidmann]

Sorry Martin, instead of speculation, I'll use the evidence.

1)Brennan testified that the assassin disappeared within a few seconds.

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his mark, and then he disappeared.

2) The fourth floor had TWO elevators and Garner had no idea of where Adams and Styles went, they even could have gone and hid and Garner would never know, but you like to assume that Garner could read minds? Or more likely the girls discussed this event at a later stage.

3) But if indeed Garner went to the stairs immediately after she noticed Adam's and Styles disappearance, a precise timeframe we will never know (for what reason she decided to immediately move at that exact point in time we also will never know) she could have easily heard Oswald. Also Adams said she was three windows across and we know where Oswald's window was, therefore the distance to the stairs from their relative positions only had a difference of about ten yards and you seem to know the inner layout of furniture and the warehouse and storage area of the 4th floor, please give a more thorough description?



4) Mr. BELIN - How long do you think it was between the time the shots were fired and the time you left the window to start toward the stairway?
Miss ADAMS - Between 15 and 30 seconds, estimated, approximately.

5) Adam's says she left up to 30 seconds later whereas the obviously not clued in Garner says only moments. Clearly consistency isn't the girls forte.

So in conclusion, the times are all over the place and why Garner would immediately go to the rear stairwell and just stand around is highly unlikely. Therefore Oswald could have easily go down the stairs.

JohnM

Just as I thought. More BS from the king of the stuff...

Sorry Martin, instead of speculation, I'll use the evidence.

Don't make me laugh.

1)Brennan testified that the assassin disappeared within a few seconds.

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was standing up and resting against the left window sill, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot. As I calculate a couple of seconds. He drew the gun back from the window as though he was drawing it back to his side and maybe paused for another second as though to assure hisself that he hit his mark, and then he disappeared.

I paraphrased when I talked about Brennan. But this is what he said in his 11/22/63 affidavit;

I was looking at the man in this windows at the time of the last explosion. Then this man let the gun down to his side and stepped down out of sight. He did not seem to be in any hurry.

2) The fourth floor had TWO elevators and Garner had no idea of where Adams and Styles went, they even could have gone and hid and Garner would never know, but you like to assume that Garner could read minds? Or more likely the girls discussed this event at a later stage.

Didn't you just say you did not use speculation? What do you call this then?

3) But if indeed Garner went to the stairs immediately after she noticed Adam's and Styles disappearance, a precise timeframe we will never know (for what reason she decided to immediately move at that exact point in time we also will never know) she could have easily heard Oswald.

"she could have easily heard Oswald" = SPECULATION.... Besides, so far you haven't offered a shred of evidence that Oswald was even on the stairs!

Also Adams said she was three windows across and we know where Oswald's window was, therefore the distance to the stairs from their relative positions only had a difference of about ten yards and you seem to know the inner layout of furniture and the warehouse and storage area of the 4th floor, please give a more thorough description?

Once again you are talking BS and are misrepresenting the evidence. The door at the back of the 4th floor office was directly opposite the elevators in the back. The sniper's nest was at the corner of the building and the entire 6th floor was full of books. Even the FBI time trail was conducted with their man walking the entire east side of the building and then cutting across to the west side where the stairs were. You must be really desperate by now if you are trying to suggest that the killer did not have a longer way to go than Adams and Styles to get to the stairs.

4) Mr. BELIN - How long do you think it was between the time the shots were fired and the time you left the window to start toward the stairway?
Miss ADAMS - Between 15 and 30 seconds, estimated, approximately.

Why did you decide to go with "up to 30 seconds"? Adams gave an estimation which could easily have been 15 seconds as well, but you've left that out. Why?

5) Adam's says she left up to 30 seconds later whereas the obviously not clued in Garner says only moments. Clearly consistency isn't the girls forte.

So in conclusion, the times are all over the place and why Garner would immediately go to the rear stairwell and just stand around is highly unlikely. Therefore Oswald could have easily go down the stairs.

So, now an estimate of 15 to 30 seconds, from a person who did not use a stopwatch at the time it happened, and a comment of "only moments" is a problem?

There is no problem at all, except the one you are desperately trying to create.

and why Garner would immediately go to the rear stairwell and just stand around is highly unlikely.

Your biased opinion isn't worth much. I'll go with what Garner actually said. You should try it. It's called following the evidence.

Therefore Oswald could have easily go down the stairs.

And the guy who claims to use the evidence still hasn't presented a shred of evidence that Oswald was even on the stairs and thus ends his post with nothing but utter speculation.

Next time try to do better, John.... This is too easy....

[John Mytton]

Next time try to do better, John.... This is too easy....

When you confront the evidence then you may have an opinion but until then, all you have is times that don't add up, but thanks for your participation.

Adams repeatedly said she saw Lovelady on the 1st floor but unfortunately for Adams, Lovelady and Shelley couldn't possibly be there at the allotted time! And that is the where the Adams story sinks and even your weak attempts to throw her a lifeline have failed dismally! Therefore it can only follow that Garner's recollection of "within a matter of moments" is a provable lie. Case Closed! Hahahaha!

Btw, so now it becomes very clear why the WC ignored Adams and her request for a timed recreation because it would only further prove that Adams was a L-I-A-R and a waste of time!

JohnM

[John Mytton]

4) Mr. BELIN - How long do you think it was between the time the shots were fired and the time you left the window to start toward the stairway?
Miss ADAMS - Between 15 and 30 seconds, estimated, approximately.

Why did you decide to go with "up to 30 seconds"? Adams gave an estimation which could easily have been 15 seconds as well, but you've left that out. Why?

You're not very good at this are you!

My statement of "up to 30 seconds" automatically encapsulates 15 seconds. Duh!

JohnM

[John Mytton]

and why Garner would immediately go to the rear stairwell and just stand around is highly unlikely.

Your biased opinion isn't worth much. I'll go with what Garner actually said. You should try it. It's called following the evidence.

This get's curiouser and curiouser, here's an excerpt from Ernest's book of what Garner apparently actually said!

Mrs. Garner said she immediately went to this area, following
"shortly after…right behind" Miss Adams and Miss Styles.   She
couldn't remember exactly why she went out there, other than to say,
"probably to get something."

So Garner decides at the exact time that she realized that Adams and Styles were gone, to leave her prime spot and get this, she couldn't remember why she suddenly had to leave at that precise time, but she guesses she probably went to get "something" and thereafter didn't go back to the front windows but instead just stood alone at the back of the building??

And let's put this in perspective, she knew that some dramatic event perhaps involving the President just happened right before her very eyes, and instead of spending a little time trying to work out what happened, she leaves within moments for some reason and goes to get some unspecified "something"? Far out Brussel Spout, what a load of rubbish!

Btw, the above quote came from the next paragraph after your previous quote from Ernest's book so you must have known what Garner said about why she followed Adams and Styles, and I perfectly understand why you tried to keep her crazy excuse a complete secret. Oops!

JohnM

[Martin Weidmann]

When you confront the evidence then you may have an opinion but until then, all you have is times that don't add up, but thanks for your participation.

Adams repeatedly said she saw Lovelady on the 1st floor but unfortunately for Adams, Lovelady and Shelley couldn't possibly be there at the allotted time! And that is the where the Adams story sinks and even your weak attempts to throw her a lifeline have failed dismally! Therefore it can only follow that Garner's recollection of "within a matter of moments" is a provable lie. Case Closed! Hahahaha!

Btw, so now it becomes very clear why the WC ignored Adams and her request for a timed recreation because it would only further prove that Adams was a L-I-A-R and a waste of time!

JohnM

When you confront the evidence then you may have an opinion but until then, all you have is times that don't add up, but thanks for your participation.

LOL. Thank you for demostrating once again that you are completely clueless about what evidence actually is. 

Adams repeatedly said she saw Lovelady on the 1st floor but unfortunately for Adams, Lovelady and Shelley couldn't possibly be there at the allotted time!

Which means that Adams was clearly mistaken about where she saw the two men. Let's not forget that the entire Lovelady/Shelley thing didn't come up until Jim Leavelle showed up at Adams' door in mid february 1964 with the pathetic and untrue claim that her previous statements somehow had been lost.

And that is the where the Adams story sinks and even your weak attempts to throw her a lifeline have failed dismally!

Bla bla bla... than explain for once in detail how the story sinks. Come on, then.... have at it!

Therefore it can only follow that Garner's recollection of "within a matter of moments" is a provable lie.

So, now Garner is a liar?

Is this really what your case has been reduced to? A vain attempt to muddy the water with some BS over 15 or 30 seconds and calling a supporting witness a liar? How typical LN.

Btw, so now it becomes very clear why the WC ignored Adams and her request for a timed recreation because it would only further prove that Adams was a L-I-A-R and a waste of time!

The women aren't liars, you are with your pathetic claim that Oswald was on the stairs at all when you can't produce a shred of evidence for it.

[John Mytton]

When you confront the evidence then you may have an opinion but until then, all you have is times that don't add up, but thanks for your participation.

LOL. Thank you for demostrating once again that you are completely clueless about what evidence actually is. 

Adams repeatedly said she saw Lovelady on the 1st floor but unfortunately for Adams, Lovelady and Shelley couldn't possibly be there at the allotted time!

Which means that Adams was clearly mistaken about where she saw the two men. Let's not forget that the entire Lovelady/Shelley thing didn't come up until Jim Leavelle showed up at Adams' door in mid february 1964 with the pathetic and untrue claim that her previous statements somehow had been lost.

And that is the where the Adams story sinks and even your weak attempts to throw her a lifeline have failed dismally!

Bla bla bla... than explain for once in detail how the story sinks. Come on, then.... have at it!

Therefore it can only follow that Garner's recollection of "within a matter of moments" is a provable lie.

So, now Garner is a liar?

Is this really what your case has been reduced to? A vain attempt to muddy the water with some BS over 15 or 30 seconds and calling a supporting witness a liar? How typical LN.

Btw, so now it becomes very clear why the WC ignored Adams and her request for a timed recreation because it would only further prove that Adams was a L-I-A-R and a waste of time!

The women aren't liars, you are with your pathetic claim that Oswald was on the stairs at all when you can't produce a shred of evidence for it.

It's too late Martin, Adams story as in the WC and confirmed in the OP video, is provably wrong!
You lose!

JohnM