When Was JBC Hit?

[Andrew Mason]

At circa z142-z143, Rosemary Willis appears to possibly turn her head sharply to her right in the general direction of The Texas School Book Depository and the Presidential Limousine. If this is a rapid head turn in reaction to the first shot, it may give credence to Max Holland's theory of an early shot miss.

She is running to keep abreast of the President's car.  Her shoulders are square to the direction she is running so she has to turn her head to see the car.  And because she has a hood over her head and because the head is connected to the body part which is facing forward, she can turn her head farther around than the hood.  So what you see as she is running is consistent with Rosemary looking at the motorcade out of a partially turned hood. 

By z204, the car is well ahead of her.  At z204 she turns her head sharply right, back toward the TSBD.  We cannot read too much into any specific turn because there can be other reasons for turning one's head.  I simply observe that the sharp right turn toward the TSBD direction at z204 is within a few frames of the time her father and sister place the first shot.

Rosemary Willis 1979 interview with David Lui:

See: https://archive.org/details/RosemaryWillisArticle/mode/2up

DAVID LUI: Why did you stop running?


Rosemary Willis 1979 interview with Marcia Smith-Durk:

She stops running when she plants her right foot at z198-199.  That fits a first shot just before z202 as her father testified and when JFK was between Linda Willis and the Stemmons sign, as Linda Willis testified.

[Andrew Mason]

When did you start feeling pain?


I felt it the instant it hit me. It was a .177 caliber, 5.2 grain BB, at approximately 300 to 350 feet per second, which penetrated the skin of the palm of my hand but didn’t go much further. I was maybe 10 to 12 years old and should have known better than to let that happen.

I invite you to experiment for yourself. Use a piece of Kevlar or something to prevent penetration. Shoot yourself in the thigh with a .22 caliber pellet at the appropriate velocity. Multi-pump air guns make this feasible. Record your experiment on video. Then show us how you “didn’t feel” it.

The injury you describe is not at all similar to a bullet penetrating and destroying tissue, such as JBC’s thigh wound.The reason bullets are often not felt is because they destroy the nerve endings as they plow through the tissue. What you are describing is not that kind of injury as there was no damage except to the skin. Nerves would doing their job!

In any event it is a well documented fact - view the YouTube clip I posted - that people can be shot, particularly in an extremity or part of the body that does not immediately interfere with function, and not feel it and are not immediately aware they are shot.

[Charles Collins]

The injury you describe is not at all similar to a bullet penetrating and destroying tissue, such as JBC’s thigh wound.The reason bullets are often not felt is because they destroy the nerve endings as they plow through the tissue. What you are describing is not that kind of injury as there was no damage except to the skin. Nerves would doing their job!

In any event it is a well documented fact - view the YouTube clip I posted - that people can be shot, particularly in an extremity or part of the body that does not immediately interfere with function, and not feel it and are not immediately aware they are shot.

I consider the wound I suffered to be more than skin-deep. In fact the projectile was removed by a doctor. He said that usually they would just leave the projectile in there for fear of doing more damage to the tissue during removal. But in this case he could see the BB and felt that it could be removed with minimal collateral damage. I still have a scar, and from time to time that hand gets painful. I cannot help but believe that the pain stems from that injury. JBC’s wound was described by the doctors as shallow also. So I think the two wounds are somewhat similar despite what you say. I am not arguing that it is impossible to get shot and not immediately feel it. There are many variables involved. However, I cannot believe that your idea that JBC was shot in the thigh first and didn’t feel it has any validity whatsoever.

[Andrew Mason]

I consider the wound I suffered to be more than skin-deep. In fact the projectile was removed by a doctor. He said that usually they would just leave the projectile in there for fear of doing more damage to 3the tissue during removal. But in this case he could see the BB and felt that it could be removed with minimal collateral damage. I still have a scar, and from time to time that hand gets painful. I cannot help but believe that the pain stems from that injury. JBC’s wound was described by the doctors as shallow also. So I think the two wounds are somewhat similar despite what you say. I am not arguing that it is impossible to get shot and not immediately feel it. There are many variables involved. However, I cannot believe that your idea that JBC was shot in the thigh first and didn’t feel it has any validity whatsoever.

Well, we have evidence from JBC himself that he didn't feel it.

 There is really no evidence really that it occurred from the same bullet that passed through his wrist and reason to believe that it wasn't.  The wound characteristics of the wrist and thigh are quite different. The thigh wound looked like it was struck by the butt end of an intact missile.  The wrist and cuff appeared to have been struck by an irregular shaped missile. The path from wrist to thigh is not obvious and assumes a significant change in direction of a 10 gram bullet moving at several hundred feet per second.  The trajectory from JFK to the left thigh does not require any change in direction after passing through JFK.

[Charles Collins]

Well, we have evidence from JBC himself that he didn't feel it.

 There is really no evidence really that it occurred from the same bullet that passed through his wrist and reason to believe that it wasn't.  The wound characteristics of the wrist and thigh are quite different. The thigh wound looked like it was struck by the butt end of an intact missile.  The wrist and cuff appeared to have been struck by an irregular shaped missile. The path from wrist to thigh is not obvious and assumes a significant change in direction of a 10 gram bullet moving at several hundred feet per second.  The trajectory from JFK to the left thigh does not require any change in direction after passing through JFK.

Well, we have evidence from JBC himself that he didn't feel it.

Of course he didn’t feel it. Because it happened concurrently with the back/chest and wrist wounds. You have absolutely no evidence that the thigh wound happened well before that. Only your own ideas.


The thigh wound looked like it was struck by the butt end of an intact missile.

CE 399 is intact except for a few small flakes of the lead compound missing from the butt end and a flattening deformation on one side.


The path from wrist to thigh is not obvious and assumes a significant change in direction of a 10 gram bullet moving at several hundred feet per second.

Place JBC’s legs with the knees to his right (as they most likely were) and all of your objections disappear.

[Steve M. Galbraith]

Well, we have evidence from JBC himself that he didn't feel it.

 There is really no evidence really that it occurred from the same bullet that passed through his wrist and reason to believe that it wasn't.  The wound characteristics of the wrist and thigh are quite different. The thigh wound looked like it was struck by the butt end of an intact missile.  The wrist and cuff appeared to have been struck by an irregular shaped missile. The path from wrist to thigh is not obvious and assumes a significant change in direction of a 10 gram bullet moving at several hundred feet per second.  The trajectory from JFK to the left thigh does not require any change in direction after passing through JFK.

Yes, but again he said he felt the bullet hit him like a "doubled up fist" punching him in his back. That's not a pain reaction/feeling but it is a physical reaction that must have been immediate? I can't see how such a reaction could have been delayed? So, a delayed pain reaction is not only possible but based on his account what happened; but the physical reaction to the bullet was not delayed.

And don't we see that punching at circa 223? Shoulder going forward, jacket bulging. Does your scenario have him hit 2-3 seconds earlier and this shoulder reaction at circa 223?
JBC from WC testimony:

Senator COOPER. Would you describe again the nature of the shock that you had when you felt that you had been hit by a bullet?
Governor CONNALLY. Senator, the best way I can describe it is to say that I would say it is as if someone doubled his fist and came up behind you and just with about a 12-inch blow hit you right in the back right below the shoulder blade.
Senator COOPER. That is when you heard the first rifleshot?
Governor CONNALLY. This was after I heard the first rifleshot. There was no pain connected with it. There was no particular burning sensation. There was nothing more than that. I think you would feel almost the identical sensation I felt if someone came up behind you and just, with a short jab, hit you with a doubled-up fist just below the shoulder blade.

[Jerry Organ]

Well, we have evidence from JBC himself that he didn't feel it.

 There is really no evidence really that it occurred from the same bullet that passed through his wrist and reason to believe that it wasn't.  The wound characteristics of the wrist and thigh are quite different. The thigh wound looked like it was struck by the butt end of an intact missile.  The wrist and cuff appeared to have been struck by an irregular shaped missile. The path from wrist to thigh is not obvious and assumes a significant change in direction of a 10 gram bullet moving at several hundred feet per second.  The trajectory from JFK to the left thigh does not require any change in direction after passing through JFK.

"The trajectory from JFK to the left thigh does not require any change in direction after passing through JFK."



Apparently, in Mason's world, Connally's spine wouldn't defect the bullet on its way to the thigh.

The scenario shown here tried to incorporate everything Mason's Theory demanded, and to see what worked and what didn't. I even spread apart Connally's knees because Mason said Connally's nuts needed the space. Now one can move the left thigh over to be in line with the trajectory, but there remains the problem of getting the bullet pass Connally's torso.

[Andrew Mason]

"The trajectory from JFK to the left thigh does not require any change in direction after passing through JFK."



Apparently, in Mason's world, Connally's spine wouldn't defect the bullet on its way to the thigh.

I said the trajectory would not require a change in direction.  Whether there is a clear path from JFK's neck to thigh depends more on where it passed JBC's back as he is turned to the right, the correct downward angle and the height of the thigh.  If the shot occurred with JBC turned to the right as he was before disappearing behind the Stemmons sign and if his knees were up, as they had to be:


With his legs not together and his left leg out to the left a bit, there could have been a clear path to the thigh.  It is certainly within a range of possibilities and actually fits the model done by the Knott Laboratory.

The scenario shown here tried to incorporate everything Mason's Theory demanded, and to see what worked and what didn't. I even spread apart Connally's knees because Mason said Connally's nuts needed the space. Now one can move the left thigh over to be in line with the trajectory, but there remains the problem of getting the bullet pass Connally's torso.

You just need to raise the thigh.  With that you can see that it is pretty close even with your placement of JBC and trajectory.  It grazes the left side of his back.  But you are assuming some things about JBC's back and the path that are not quite correct.  The path relative to the car is close to 21 degrees down at z193 (24.03 degrees down relative to the horizontal at z186 by the survey at CE884) even assuming that the downward slope of Elm is the full 3 degrees at that point. The straight line trajectory just clears the jump seat back and passes to the level of JBC's lower back.  Also, because he has to move a bit forward of the seatback to turn like he is at z190-200, the path would pass his back farther forward, so at an even lower level.  I admit that it would be close but the trajectory path can work without striking JBC's back.  The wound in the thigh is perfectly consistent with an tumbling undamaged CE399 striking JBC in the left thigh down to the femur, leaving a small bit of lead in the femur and denting just the base as it hits the bone.  Because it was tumbling, and because the wound on the thigh was very oblique, its rotational motion may have continued and caused it to continue forward and up toward the surface of the skin or, perhaps, completely out, which could explain why it did not remain in the thigh.