Is the amount of effort to link Oswald to Hidell believable?

[Martin Weidmann]

Stop with the bullying!

You edited my post when you replied to me, here's my answer in full

A stack of that evidence occurred way back in March, it's highly unlikely Oswald was being set up for the Kennedy assassination so far in advance, isn't it far more likely it was simply Oswald himself? Because without a shred of evidence to the contrary there's no reason to consider a fantasy scenario? Facts convince Juries and me and presumably you!

JohnM

Stop with the bullying!

Asking you a question, you don't seem to like, is now bullying? Really? Touchy, touchy.....

You edited my post when you replied to me

I did not edit your post. I merely highlighted in bold the two parts of your reply I was responding to.

The fact remains that when you argue that it's highly unlikely that Oswald was set up for the Kennedy murder so far in advance, you also have to say that it's also unlikely that Oswald (or anybody else) created the Hidell alias so far in advance for the Kennedy murder, eight months later. Ergo, you can not use the Hidell alias as evidence for Oswald's guilt in the Kennedy assassination, when in fact it may not have had anything to do with that. Or is that too logical for you?

[Michael Walton]

Researcher Greg Parker has an interesting theory and that is that Oswald had no knowledge of the upcoming murder. In other words he was completely innocent and the reason why he was murdered was not to shut him up about what he knew about the plot, but just to shut him up. I've thought about this and I agree with this now.

I also believe he WAS being manipulated but unknowingly about the murder itself. I believe he was a [very] low-level agent doing "intelligence" about Communists. Thus, the handing out of the leaflets in NO, getting on TV later about it and looking proudly as he explains who he is, and so on. Doing this allowed him to be photographed where his head could later be put onto the BYP. His alias was also a ruse. Doing this showed him to be a rabid Marxist and so on.

This all started, too, the moment he did the fake defection, then returned. There are others out there who we've never heard from again who also did this kind of thing. Robert Webster was another of them.

He asks a co-worker what the commotion was. When he was told the President is coming, he says "oh." He later says in front of TV cameras that the only reason why he was arrested was because he lived in Russia, then went on to say he was a patsy.

He stated the BYP were fake, with his head pasted. He said he'd be able to show how that could be done [because after all, he worked at a photo place].

He supposedly kills the president but has no grand getaway plan. He supposedly sticks around the building, is dismissed from work, walks over to catch a cab home, gives it up for a lady, takes the bus home, changes his clothes, then takes this long roundabout walk where he supposedly is confronted by Tippit, where he guns him down. Then he goes to the theater. The "6 foot 160 lb" description goes out within 15 minutes of the murder. How do they know this so soon? And it's not even accurate, far from it.

[Martin Weidmann]

Researcher Greg Parker has an interesting theory and that is that Oswald had no knowledge of the upcoming murder. In other words he was completely innocent and the reason why he was murdered was not to shut him up about what he knew about the plot, but just to shut him up. I've thought about this and I agree with this now.

I also believe he WAS being manipulated but unknowingly about the murder itself. I believe he was a [very] low-level agent doing "intelligence" about Communists. Thus, the handing out of the leaflets in NO, getting on TV later about it and looking proudly as he explains who he is, and so on. Doing this allowed him to be photographed where his head could later be put onto the BYP. His alias was also a ruse. Doing this showed him to be a rabid Marxist and so on.

This all started, too, the moment he did the fake defection, then returned. There are others out there who we've never heard from again who also did this kind of thing. Robert Webster was another of them.

He asks a co-worker what the commotion was. When he was told the President is coming, he says "oh." He later says in front of TV cameras that the only reason why he was arrested was because he lived in Russia, then went on to say he was a patsy.

He stated the BYP were fake, with his head pasted. He said he'd be able to show how that could be done [because after all, he worked at a photo place].

He supposedly kills the president but has no grand getaway plan. He supposedly sticks around the building, is dismissed from work, walks over to catch a cab home, gives it up for a lady, takes the bus home, changes his clothes, then takes this long roundabout walk where he supposedly is confronted by Tippit, where he guns him down. Then he goes to the theater. The "6 foot 160 lb" description goes out within 15 minutes of the murder. How do they know this so soon? And it's not even accurate, far from it.

I can't agree with everything you've said, simply because of a lack of knowledge or evidence, but I most certainly agree there something just not right about the official narrative's version of what happened between Kennedy being shot and Tippit being murdered.

Oswald seems to have done everything he could possibly do to draw maximum attention to himself, if the official narrative is to be believed. Leaving behind a rifle, with allegedly his prints on it (although the FBI couldn't find them), leaving the building without asking permission or notifying anybody. Hopping on a bus that would bring him straight back to the crime scene and then ask for a transfer. Getting in a taxi only to offer it to a woman who asked for one. Instead of trying to get out of town as quickly as possible (what you would expect an assassin to do), he then takes a walk to a residential area (where he can hardly get there in time, if at all) and for no obvious reason shoots a police man, who stopped him ... for what exactly? He then makes sure that he is noticed by a shoe salesman and again draws attention to himself by entering the Texas Theater without buying a ticket..... None of that adds up or makes any sense.

And then there is the strange story of Oswald, having just spend an entire morning in a dusty warehouse, going back to his roominghouse where he changes his clothes (he told his interrogators he changed them all) but somehow not his shirt and low and behold Bledsoe "recognizes" that shirt because it has a hole it one of the arms and fibers allegedly similar to those of that shirt are found on the rifle found at the TSBD. And as if that isn't enough, he's is also allegedly carrying a fake Hidell ID in his wallet that provides a connecting to the ordering of the rifle, 8 months earlier.

I wonder what more could Oswald possibly have done to draw attention to himself and provide law enforcement officers with the evidence they needed? Put up a billboard sign, perhaps?

[John Iacoletti]

Didn't you already post this rot in a different thread?

Anyway, the point of this thread is to show you dear reader that the amount of effort and planning to link the alias Hidell with the person Oswald was an effort of enormous magnitude and required forgery, planting evidence in obscure places and a stack of lies. This sequence of inconceivable events I doubt would even be contemplated by a fiction author like Ian Fleming or Robert Ludlum, because of the absurd unbelievability, yet almost 60 years later the mind of an ever increasingly desperate conspiracy theorist who believes anything and I mean anything is possible, just take it all in their stride. -sigh-

This is the usual fallacious “my unsubstantiated claims about the evidence are true or else you must prove that a giant conspiracy faked and planted everything” argument.

Nope. Strawman and false dichotomy.
 

It was either Oswald or;

The Hidell ID was manufactured by conspirators
The Hidell ID was planted by the Police
The Hidell ID negatives were manufactured by conspirators
The Hidell ID negatives were planted by conspirators in the Paine residence
The Hidell name was inserted by conspirators into the New Orleans post box application records.
The Hidell name was connected To Oswald's New Orleans Chapter of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee by conspirators.
The Hidell name was used as The "Chapter President" of Oswald's made up Cuba Committee by conspirators.
The Hidell name was forged by conspirators onto Oswald's "Fair Play for Cuba" leaflets
The Hidell name was written on membership cards by conspirators other than Marina, who must have lied.
The Hidell name was a play on "Fidel" according to Marina who must have lied
The Hidell name was forged onto the Kliens coupon
The Hidell Kleins coupon addressed to Oswald was forged onto the Kliens microfilm
The Hidell name was forged onto the Kleins envelope
The Hidell Kleins Envelope addressed to Oswald was forged onto the Kleins microfilm
The Hidell name on on the Kleins Coupon found by Waldman on the night following the assassination was forgotten?
The Hidell rifle was never sent to Oswald's PO box
The Hidell newly manufactured microfilm was substituted at some point with Kleins business records microfilm.
The Hidell ID was admitted by Oswald or Police lied
The Hidell ID was admitted by Oswald or a Postal official lied
The Hidell ID was asked of Oswald or an FBI agent lied
The Hidell name was forged onto Oswald Job applications as a reference
The Hidell rifle was photographed with Oswald by either forgery or trickery
The Hidell rifle was planted on the 6th floor of Oswald's work by conspirators
The Hidell revolver coupon was forged by conspirators
The Hidell name was forged onto the Seaport-Traders paperwork
The Hidell revolver was lied about by the Police
The Hidell revolver was substituted by Police
And on and on it goes!

Nope, sorry. Regardless of any outcome of any of these ridiculous rhetorical false dichotomies, you still cannot demonstrate that Oswald ever used Hidell as an alias for himself. And even if you could, it still would tell you nothing about who killed Kennedy or Tippit.

[John Iacoletti]

The rifle that killed the President, that Oswald purchased, was photographed with and the same rifle Oswald bought was found on the 6th floor of Oswald's workplace was discovered with his fingerprints and matching shirt fibers is the most important evidence in this case.

Claims about the evidence are not evidence.

[John Iacoletti]

I know you're passionate but why do you misrepresent what I say? Read my reply on this subject to Iacoletti, where I present an expert who found not 1 but three different matching fibers from the rifle and Oswald's shirt and I have never said that anyone can make a "positive match", it's the prohibitive probability that it's highly unlikely that someone else would randomly come into contact with Oswald's rifle.

That's Bugliosi rhetoric.  He doesn't know what the probability is.

P.S. "Oswald's rifle".  LOL.

[John Iacoletti]

Stop with the bullying!

You edited my post when you replied to me, here's my answer in full

A stack of that evidence occurred way back in March, it's highly unlikely Oswald was being set up for the Kennedy assassination so far in advance, isn't it far more likely it was simply Oswald himself? Because without a shred of evidence to the contrary there's no reason to consider a fantasy scenario? Facts convince Juries and me and presumably you!

"far more likely it was simply Oswald himself" is also a fantasy scenario.