Time for Truth

[Alan J. Ford]

None of this provides even a single iota of evidence to support your silly claim that Oswald was still in DP as late as 1:12.   Much less rebut the mountain of evidence to the contrary. Multiple witnesses place him at the Tippit scene with the gun. Witnesses place him on the bus and cab and at his boardinghouse in the timeframe after the assassination.  In addition:   

"Oswald told Captain Fritz that he rode a bus to a stop near his home and then walked to his roominghouse.483 When queried the following morning concerning a bus transfer found in his possession at the time of his arrest, he admitted receiving it.484 And when interrogated about a cab ride, Oswald also admitted that he left the slow-moving bus and took a cab to his roominghouse."

A mountain of "evidence" alright, Mr. Smith,

and guess what? You nor any other LN can actually produce any authentic genuine evidence what the wrongly accused actually said on that fateful day. There's a reason for that:

IF they dared to actually utilize Video and/or Audio recording of those rubber-stamp proceedings the whole world would know the genuine Truth as opposed to those charged with "investigating" this sordid ordeal putting words in someone's mouth (major difference between hearing someone actually say something as opposed to others merely putting words in his/her mouth)

“Oh, what a tangled web we weave...when first we practice to deceive.” -- Sir Walter Scott

Now, in fairness to you, go ahead and share a single instance where the wrongly accused can be actually heard saying anything you claim he said...you're on the clock, Mr. Smith...

Cannot do it, can you? There's a reason for that...

*Sidebar/self-reminder: Upon returning next week, please note/share the 3.7 miles distance from Fire Station 3 to Dealey Plaza to confirm the 1:12PM time that records the wrongly-accused still in Dealey Plaza.

[David Von Pein]

...the wrongly-accused still in Dealey Plaza as late as 1:12PM...

Then who did Earlene Roberts see dash in and out of the Beckley roominghouse at approx. 1:00 PM, Alan?

Did she see an "Oswald imposter"?

Or do you want to brand Mrs. Roberts as a teller of tall tales?

[Martin Weidmann]

Then who did Earlene Roberts see dash in and out of the Beckley roominghouse at approx. 1:00 PM, Alan?

Did she see an "Oswald imposter"?

Or do you want to brand Mrs. Roberts as a teller of tall tales?

Or do you want to brand Mrs. Roberts as a teller of tall tales?

Her employer did!

Do you also accept her story about a police car honking twice in front of the house?

Did she see an "Oswald imposter"?

No, she probably did see Oswald, just like she saw him standing at the bus stop several minutes past 1 PM.

Which of course makes it completely impossible for Oswald to have been at 10th/Patton when Tippit was killed.

[David Von Pein]

Do you also accept her [Earlene Roberts'] story about a police car honking twice in front of the house?

Well, that's another matter entirely. The topic I was referring to earlier was whether or not Earlene Roberts had really seen Lee Harvey Oswald enter and leave the Beckley roominghouse at about 1:00 PM on November 22.

Apparently the originator of this discussion, Alan J. Ford, thinks Mrs. Roberts did lie about that subject (or maybe Alan thinks Roberts saw one of the many "Oswald doubles" that so many CTers think were running around Dallas in circa 1963).

But whether or not Mrs. Roberts was telling the truth about the police car honking its horn outside the roominghouse has no bearing on whether she was telling the truth about seeing Oswald on 11/22, and that's because her story about seeing Oswald that day was verified by Lee Oswald himself, who told the police after his arrest that he had, indeed, gone to his Beckley room shortly after the assassination occurred.

Regarding Mrs. Roberts and the alleged horn-honking incident, here's what I had to say about that subject several years ago:

---------------------------

"It must be kept in mind that Mrs. Roberts testified that it was not unusual at all for a police car to stop in front of the roominghouse and toot its horn. It happened on multiple OTHER days, according to Roberts. So even if such an occurrence DID take place on November 22nd, it could be looked upon as a NORMAL occurrence, not an ABNORMAL or unusual one.

Or do some conspiracy theorists think that the Dallas Police were so shrewd in their advanced planning of the so-called "Frame-Up" of Lee Harvey Oswald that they had a police car stop in front of 1026 N. Beckley Avenue every so often in the weeks and/or months BEFORE the assassination, just so the car could honk its horn in front of the house...in order to make it look like an ordinary occurrence?

I'd like to know how the conspiracy theorists who think that a police car was "signalling" to Oswald on November 22 can possibly explain away the very same kind of horn-honking which took place at that exact same residence on multiple OTHER days when Presidents WEREN'T being murdered?

When we look at the horn-honking topic from that point-of-view, it makes any 11/22 horn-honking incident seem much less sinister. And if it WAS "sinister", then it's an awfully strange coincidence that the horn was honked ("tip-tip", says Roberts) in the exact same manner in which it was honked by other policemen on OTHER days prior to November 22nd. Wouldn't you agree?"

-- DVP; April 17, 2008

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2012/05/jfk-assassination-arguments-part-195.html

Also See:

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2010/06/in-lee-harvey-oswalds-room.html

---------------------------

BTW, here's how author Vincent Bugliosi handled Earlene Roberts' story about the police car:

[Gerry Down]

Well, that's another matter entirely. The topic I was referring to earlier was whether or not Earlene Roberts had really seen Lee Harvey Oswald enter and leave the Beckley roominghouse at about 1:00 PM on November 22.

Apparently the originator of this discussion, Alan J. Ford, thinks Mrs. Roberts did lie about that subject (or maybe Alan thinks Roberts saw one of the many "Oswald doubles" that so many CTers think were running around Dallas in circa 1963).

But whether or not Mrs. Roberts was telling the truth about the police car honking its horn outside the roominghouse has no bearing on whether she was telling the truth about seeing Oswald on 11/22, and that's because her story about seeing Oswald that day was verified by Lee Oswald himself, who told the police after his arrest that he had, indeed, gone to his Beckley room shortly after the assassination occurred.

Regarding Mrs. Roberts and the alleged horn-honking incident, here's what I had to say about that subject several years ago:

---------------------------

"It must be kept in mind that Mrs. Roberts testified that it was not unusual at all for a police car to stop in front of the roominghouse and toot its horn. It happened on multiple OTHER days, according to Roberts. So even if such an occurrence DID take place on November 22nd, it could be looked upon as a NORMAL occurrence, not an ABNORMAL or unusual one.

Or do some conspiracy theorists think that the Dallas Police were so shrewd in their advanced planning of the so-called "Frame-Up" of Lee Harvey Oswald that they had a police car stop in front of 1026 N. Beckley Avenue every so often in the weeks and/or months BEFORE the assassination, just so the car could honk its horn in front of the house...in order to make it look like an ordinary occurrence?

I'd like to know how the conspiracy theorists who think that a police car was "signalling" to Oswald on November 22 can possibly explain away the very same kind of horn-honking which took place at that exact same residence on multiple OTHER days when Presidents WEREN'T being murdered?

When we look at the horn-honking topic from that point-of-view, it makes any 11/22 horn-honking incident seem much less sinister. And if it WAS "sinister", then it's an awfully strange coincidence that the horn was honked ("tip-tip", says Roberts) in the exact same manner in which it was honked by other policemen on OTHER days prior to November 22nd. Wouldn't you agree?"

-- DVP; April 17, 2008

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2012/05/jfk-assassination-arguments-part-195.html

Also See:

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2010/06/in-lee-harvey-oswalds-room.html

---------------------------

BTW, here's how author Vincent Bugliosi handled Earlene Roberts' story about the police car:

One theory is that the area outside the rooming house was a street junction and it would be common for cars to hoot the horn there when a driver in front fails to move off quickly enough at the junction. Though that would not explain why only police cars seemed to hoot the horn.

[Martin Weidmann]

Well, that's another matter entirely. The topic I was referring to earlier was whether or not Earlene Roberts had really seen Lee Harvey Oswald enter and leave the Beckley roominghouse at about 1:00 PM on November 22.

Apparently the originator of this discussion, Alan J. Ford, thinks Mrs. Roberts did lie about that subject (or maybe Alan thinks Roberts saw one of the many "Oswald doubles" that so many CTers think were running around Dallas in circa 1963).

But whether or not Mrs. Roberts was telling the truth about the police car honking its horn outside the roominghouse has no bearing on whether she was telling the truth about seeing Oswald on 11/22, and that's because her story about seeing Oswald that day was verified by Lee Oswald himself, who told the police after his arrest that he had, indeed, gone to his Beckley room shortly after the assassination occurred.

I have reduced your post to the part I want to reply to.

Well, that's another matter entirely.

Actually, no it isn't. It goes to the credibility of the witness.

But whether or not Mrs. Roberts was telling the truth about the police car honking its horn outside the roominghouse has no bearing on whether she was telling the truth about seeing Oswald on 11/22

Of course it does have a bearing on her testimony if she is shown to be lying about other things. If she doesn't completely tell the truth on everything how do you know what is true and what isn't?

her story about seeing Oswald that day was verified by Lee Oswald himself, who told the police after his arrest that he had, indeed, gone to his Beckley room shortly after the assassination occurred.


Who did Oswald tell that?

Oswald's presence at the rooming house is one of the most crucial issues in the Tippit case. If Oswald was there, but only a few minutes later than "just after 1", he could not have been at 10th & Patton on time to kill Tippit. If he didn't leave the rooming house with a jacket, or left it with a darker color jacket (as Roberts testified) he could not be the person witnesses saw wearing a light grey (or white) jackets. Yet, the investigators, just [rather selectively] took the word of a woman who was blind in one eye and had poor sight in the other and who was known to her employer as unreliable.

[David Von Pein]

If she [Earlene Roberts] doesn't completely tell the truth on everything, how do you know what is true and what isn't?

Re: the topic of "Did Mrs. Roberts Actually See Oswald Enter The Roominghouse On 11/22/63?"....

There are multiple ways to verify that she was telling the truth about that. Besides Oswald's own admission (see my next comment), there's also cab driver William Whaley, who took Oswald to the general area of his roominghouse on 11/22. (Am I now supposed to believe that Whaley took some Oswald look-alike to Oak Cliff instead of the real LHO?)

Given all the things that verify Oswald went to 1026 Beckley on 11/22, is it truly reasonable to believe otherwise? I think not.

Who did Oswald tell that?

Captain Fritz. (See WCR Page 601, below.)

https://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0313a.htm

Oswald's presence at the rooming house is one of the most crucial issues in the Tippit case. If Oswald was there, but only a few minutes later than "just after 1", he could not have been at 10th & Patton on time to kill Tippit.

Conspiracy theorists never seem to want to evaluate ALL of Earlene Roberts' testimony concerning the time that Oswald spent in his room. It's true that Mrs. Roberts testified that Oswald "went on to his room and stayed about 3 or 4 minutes" [6 H 438], but it's also a fact that she also said that Oswald was in his room "just long enough, I guess, to go in there and get a jacket and put it on" [6 H 440].

No CTer ever wants to add in that last important statement made by Roberts.

And does it really take 3 or 4 minutes to wander around a closet-sized bedroom and grab a jacket, a gun, and a few bullets?

Also.....if Oswald was walking faster than the WC investigators who timed the trip from Neely St. to 1026 Beckley at 5 min./45 sec., then Oswald would have reached his room prior to 1:00. That fact, coupled with the almost certain fact that he was only in that room (per Mrs. Roberts) "just long enough to go in there and get a jacket", plus the additional unknown factor of Oswald possibly walking very fast or even running at least part of the way from Beckley to 10th Street (we'll never know his speed for certain), gives LHO ample time to make it to the site of J.D. Tippit's murder by approx. 1:14 to 1:15 PM CST (which is the time when the sum total of evidence indicates Tippit was very likely shot).

If he didn't leave the rooming house with a jacket, or left it with a darker color jacket (as Roberts testified)....

Maybe you'd better listen again to this 11/22 interview with Mrs. Roberts. If you fast-forward to 2:40 you'll hear Roberts say that Oswald left his room wearing a "short gray coat".

Yes, Roberts said something different later on regarding the jacket color. But on Day One, she said "short gray coat".

Of course, we could now start discussing the various shades of "gray" that exist in the color spectrum—light gray vs. dark gray vs. medium gray, etc.

Bonus Link:
http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2010/06/in-lee-harvey-oswalds-room.html