JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion & Debate > JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate
Oswald's shot-1 ricochet was at Z113 or Z105.
Marjan Rynkiewicz:
--- Quote from: Jerry Organ on May 22, 2021, 03:31:46 PM ---
Life, November 24, 1967 “Now I was beginning to leave when I heard the sky fall in --
the loudest crack of a rifle I had ever heard! At that time I had
the least notion it was a gun. The truth of the matter was that
I thought it was a firecracker."
-- Teen Magazine, June 1968
"I've known Tina Towner since 1978 and my memory has been
that she said the first shot came just a second or two after she
stopped filming. However, in a March 30, 1996 oral history,
Tina said it was four to six seconds. So either I have mis-
remembered, which is possible, or her memory has changed."
-- Email, Gary Mack to Andrew Mason, March 1, 2007
"Tina has always said, and we've been good friends since 1978,
the first shot came right after she stopped filming. She has
always believed the first shot came within a second or two."
-- Email, Gary Mack to Dale K. Myers, November 21, 2011
"I believe Daddy was about to head down the hill to get another
photo, but there was not enough time before the first gunshot
sounded only a second or two, if that, after I stopped filming."
-- "Tina Towner: My Story", 2012 book
--- End quote ---
Yes it is splitting hairs, but i definitely remember a youtube of Tina saying that she woznt sure whether she stopped filming just before the first shot or just after. I think it woz in the context of talking to max Holland, in which case Tina might have said that just to make Max happy, i can understand that.
But my forensic analysis says that she heard shot1 at T141 & Tina stopped filming at T142.
Oswald shot at T137.
The slug hit at T138.
The sound hit at T139.
The ear part of Tina's brain told the main part of Tina's brain at T141.
Tina stopped filming at T142.
Marjan Rynkiewicz:
James Reston jnr has written a book saying that Oswald was aiming for Connally, not JFK.
The lead fragments in the back of JFK's head do not support Reston's theory.
The hole in the floor of the limo does not support Reston's theory.
Oswald's shot-1 ricocheted off the western side of the signal arm supporting the overhead signals, & the remnant slug made a hole in the floor of the limo tween Connally's seat & Mrs Connally's seat (hole seen in photo)(Dec1963), & some lead fragments hit JFK in the back of the head (seen in Xrays).
If Oswald was aiming for JFK's body then the above geometry makes sense.
If Oswald was aiming for Connally's body, & (1) if the ricochet was off the eastern side of the signal arm, then the ricochet would have angled back to the east & .....
(1a) the fragments of lead would have hit JFK on the top of the head (but the Xrays show fragments in the back of the head, not the top).
(1b) In addition the hole in the floor would have been tween JFK & Connally (but the hole in the floor was tween Connally & Mrs Connally).
If Oswald was aiming for Connally's body, & (2) if the ricochet was off the western side of the signal arm, then the ricochet would have angled to the west & .....
(2a) the fragments of lead might have hit Kellerman, in the passenger seat.
(2b) In addition the hole in the floor would have been tween Connally & Kellerman.
Hence, Oswald was aiming for JFK.
John Iacoletti:
That's just silly. The location of fragments tells you nothing about where somebody was aiming or who it was. And there is ZERO evidence of this alleged ricochet off the traffic light.
Marjan Rynkiewicz:
--- Quote from: John Iacoletti on August 13, 2021, 06:36:17 PM ---That's just silly. The location of fragments tells you nothing about where somebody was aiming or who it was. And there is ZERO evidence of this alleged ricochet off the traffic light.
--- End quote ---
There is a youtube of tests done on (i think Oswald kind of) bullets ricocheting off (signal arm kind of) steel tube.
The fragments hit a plywood target.
There were 3 kinds of groups of holes (ie groups of fragments).
The smallest ricochet fragments (small bits of lead) ricocheted at the shallowest angle (eg the right-back of JFK's head).
The full copper jacket always broke into 2 pieces (eg CE567 CE569)(koz the jacket was made in 2 pieces, welded together), both ricocheting at a larger angle.
The remnant lead slug ricocheted at the largest angle (this made the hole in the limo floor, found Dec 1963)(see the pix in reply#14).
If anyone knows the youtube showing the ricochet tests off steel tube then i would appreciate it if u could advise of the link.
See also #23 & #27 regarding Whatley (hearing a shot that missed)(near the signals) & Moore hearing a shot near the signals.
See also #14.
Marjan Rynkiewicz:
FORENSIC SCIENCE AND PRESIDENT KENNEDY'S HEAD WOUNDS
Michael T. Griffith 2002 @All Rights Reserved Second Edition
https://miketgriffith.com/files/forensic.htm
Another Bullet Fragment in the Back of the Head
When the HSCA had outside experts examine the autopsy skull x-rays, the experts discovered a bullet fragment that had not been noted before. Dr. G. M. McDonnel discovered the fragment. He noted it was embedded in the galea, which is a layer located between the scalp and the skull, and that it was slightly to the left of the 6.5 mm object. This fragment is further evidence that Kennedy's head was struck by ricochet material from a bullet that struck the pavement. As absurd as the shearing explanation is for the 6.5 mm object, it's even more absurd for this second fragment, since this fragment is located to the left of the 6.5 mm object and is embedded in a different layer. Donahue argued this fragment must have come from the bullet that several witnesses saw strike the pavement. He concluded there was no other credible explanation for the fragment's presence and location:
. . . details surfaced in the committee's own documents that indicated Kennedy very likely was hit by not one, but rather a barrage of ricochet fragments.
The medical evidence appendix published in early 1979 contained reports from two radiologists who'd independently examined the President's skull X rays. One of these physicians, Dr. G. M. McDonnel of Los Angeles, wrote that in addition to the Fisher fragment [the 6.5 mm object], he'd identified a second bullet piece on the exterior of Kennedy's skull. McDonnel's fragment was smaller than Fisher's and located slightly to its left. Unlike the Fisher fragment, this new shard was not attached to the bone but was embedded in the galea, the tough, rubbery membrane between the scalp and the skull.
The presence of this second bullet piece obviously strengthened Donahue's conclusions about the first-shot ricochet. So too did information provided by the second outside expert, Dr. David O. Davis, chairman of the radiology department at George Washington University Hospital. Davis wrote that his examination of the X rays revealed a number of skull fragments that appeared to be dispersed across the right side of Kennedy's head in such a way as to suggest they were located not inside the skull, but outside it, embedded in the scalp.
Davis said he was at a loss to explain where these fragments might have come from and his startling suggestion that the right side of Kennedy's scalp may have been peppered with lead did not make it into the medical panel's final report. As for the fragment discovered by McDonnel, the panel asserted this fragment, like Fisher's, had probably sheared off the fatal bullet on impact.
McDonnel, however, apparently was not totally in accord with this explanation. Instead, he proposed the two fragments may have somehow worked their way back out through the entrance wound and attached themselves to the outside of the skull and galea during the transport and handling of the President's body.
To Donahue, this explanation was even more absurd than Baden's shear interpretation, since it would have been virtually impossible for the pieces to migrate from the point of the bullet's disintegration through the shredded, semisolid brain mass all the way back to the entrance wound, then pass through the small hole to affix themselves finally outside the skull. . . .
Donahue . . . believed that the location of the fragments on both the rear and now the side of Kennedy's head precluded any possibility except a ricochet. (Menninger, Mortal Error, pp. 160-161)
There is no way to explain the presence of this additional fragment in the back of the head in the context of the Warren Commission's lone-gunman scenario. Donahue was almost certainly correct: The fragment must have come from the bullet that several witnesses saw strike the pavement near the limousine when the limousine was passing beneath the oak tree or from another additional bullet that was fired during the assassination. It most certainly did not come from an FMJ bullet that struck Kennedy in the back of the head.
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