Then went inside with the curtain rods

[Bill Chapman]

The next morning Oswald shows up with a long package that, in retrospect, is really obviously a rifle but Oswald palms it off as curtain rods and Frazier swallows it (not the sharpest tool in the shed.)

At this point you've lost me. There is nothing "really obvious" about it. A 34.8" long bag would not have fitted between the palm of Oswald's hand and underneath his shoulder nor would Oswald been able to carry the package, as described by Randle, without hitting the ground.

From this point onwards most of what you have written is pure speculation and conjecture.

I have met Frazier and he is absolutely 100% convinced that the bag he saw wasn't big enough to conceal a 34.8" broken down rifle. I have no reason to assume that he has been lying about this all his life.

Buell testified that he never saw Oswald carrying the package from the front. An honest man would acknowledge that fact.

A Buell Frazier in CYA mode is going to remain in said mode the rest of his life, at least in front of strangers. And what makes you think anybody around here is going to take you at your damn word?

So not even a selfie with Buell?

[Martin Weidmann]

Buell testified that he never saw Oswald carrying the package from the front. An honest man would acknowledge that fact.

A Buell Frazier in CYA mode is going to remain in said mode the rest of his life, at least in front of strangers. And what makes you think anybody around here is going to take you at your damn word?

So not even a selfie with Buell?

Buell testified that he never saw Oswald carrying the package from the front. An honest man would acknowledge that fact.

BS

If he hadn't seen Oswald carrying the package from the front, he wouldn't be able to describe how he held it.

Mr. BALL - When you saw him get out of the car, when you first saw him when he was out of the car before he started to walk, you noticed he had the package under the arm?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - One end of it was under the armpit and the other he had to hold it in his right hand. Did the package extend beyond the right hand?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir. Like I say if you put it under your armpits and put it down normal to the side.
Mr. BALL - But the right hand on, was it on the end or the side of the package?
Mr. FRAZIER - No; he had it cupped in his hand.
Mr. BALL - Cupped in his hand?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.

And what makes you think anybody around here is going to take you at your damn word?

Don't care if you do or not. There will always be dishonest idiots like you, who would not believe Buell if he said it to them in person.

So not even a selfie with Buell?

Oh yes, there are photographs but you will never get to see them.

[Alan Ford]

I don’t know Alan. I doubt that he bought anything in CE142. I was just going through my stuff on Linnie May and it seems her first mention of curtain rods was the day after the assassination. Given her curiosity about Oswald's unusual Thursday visit and her knowledge of the curtain rods on that day, seems strange they weren’t mentioned by her until Saturday.

I need to go back over Frazier's statements and those who interviewed him to find the first reference to curtain rods.

Just checked and curtain rods appears in his statement dated 22November. So the curtain rod story genesis had occurred by the late evening that day.

Thank you, Mr Crow! 

[Alan Ford]

Just checked and curtain rods appears in his statement dated 22November. So the curtain rod story genesis had occurred by the late evening that day.

Or, alternatively, Frazier and Randle were simply telling the truth about the curtain rods, in which case no story needed to be created.

Exactly my view of the case----------with the added detail that Mr Oswald was simply telling the truth about the curtain rods too

[Bill Chapman]

Buell testified that he never saw Oswald carrying the package from the front. An honest man would acknowledge that fact.

BS

If he hadn't seen Oswald carrying the package from the front, he wouldn't be able to describe how he held it.

Mr. BALL - When you saw him get out of the car, when you first saw him when he was out of the car before he started to walk, you noticed he had the package under the arm?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - One end of it was under the armpit and the other he had to hold it in his right hand. Did the package extend beyond the right hand?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir. Like I say if you put it under your armpits and put it down normal to the side.
Mr. BALL - But the right hand on, was it on the end or the side of the package?
Mr. FRAZIER - No; he had it cupped in his hand.
Mr. BALL - Cupped in his hand?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.

And what makes you think anybody around here is going to take you at your damn word?

Don't care if you do or not. There will always be dishonest idiots like you, who would not believe Buell if he said it to them in person.

So not even a selfie with Buell?

Oh yes, there are photographs but you will never get to see them.

There will always be dishonest idiots like you, who would not believe Buell if he said it to them in person.
I said a Buell Frazier in CYA mode. Therefore whatever a Buell Frazier in CYA mode says means nothing if indeed he was in CYA mode. There will always be an Oswald-lover who will immediately glom on to whatever a Buell Frazier in CYA mode says, and then cling onto for dear life.

Oh yes, there are photographs but you will never get to see them
'Oh yes, there are photographs'. Yeah sure. And I met Oswald, and yes there are photographs but you will never get to see them.

[Martin Weidmann]

There will always be dishonest idiots like you, who would not believe Buell if he said it to them in person.
I said a Buell Frazier in CYA mode. Therefore whatever a Buell Frazier in CYA mode says means nothing if indeed he was in CYA mode. There will always be an Oswald-lover who will immediately glom on to whatever a Buell Frazier in CYA mode says, and then cling onto for dear life.

Oh yes, there are photographs but you will never get to see them
'Oh yes, there are photographs'. Yeah sure. And I met Oswald, and yes there are photographs but you will never get to see them.

I said a Buell Frazier in CYA mode.

Nobody cares what you say. Given a choice between the words of Frazier and you, you'll always lose.

'Oh yes, there are photographs'. Yeah sure. And I met Oswald, and yes there are photographs but you will never get to see them.

Not interested in seeing a photograph of one corpse visiting another.

[Dan O'meara]

The next morning Oswald shows up with a long package that, in retrospect, is really obviously a rifle but Oswald palms it off as curtain rods and Frazier swallows it (not the sharpest tool in the shed.)

At this point you've lost me. There is nothing "really obvious" about it. A 34.8" long bag would not have fitted between the palm of Oswald's hand and underneath his shoulder nor would Oswald been able to carry the package, as described by Randle, without hitting the ground.

From this point onwards most of what you have written is pure speculation and conjecture.

I have met Frazier and he is absolutely 100% convinced that the bag he saw wasn't big enough to conceal a 34.8" broken down rifle. I have no reason to assume that he has been lying about this all his life.

You've missed the point Martin.
I was putting forward a made-up scenario to try to account for various aspects of the curtain rods.
In the scenario WBF and LMR concoct the story about the curtain rods to conceal that Oswald carried a rifle to work that day and Frazier would've been up s"^t creek for bringing the assassin of JFK and his rifle to work that morning.
One of the aspects this scenario covers is that Ruth Paine testified there was just 2 curtain rods in her garage which she had wrapped herself and that the curtain rods were still in the garage after the assassination. This means Oswald never took the curtain rods to work that morning.

Mr. JENNER - Now, that morning--if I may, Mr. Chairman, because of the entry of the police, that is a good cutoff point, I would like to go back to the morning for the moment, or the evening before. Mrs. Paine, did you then have what might be called some curtain rods in your garage?
Mrs. PAINE - I believe there were.
Mr. JENNER - Do you have a recollection?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes; they were stored in the garage, wrapped in loose brown paper.
Mr. JENNER - Is it the brown paper of the nature and character you described yesterday that you get at the market and have in a roll?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes.
Mr. JENNER - Had you wrapped that package yourself?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes.


Mr. JENNER - Now, how many of them were there?
Mrs. PAINE - Two.

Mr. JENNER - Let us return to the curtain rods first. Do you still have those curtain rods?
Mrs. PAINE - I believe so.

The curtain rods were collected from the Paine's garage, there was only two of them and both were there.

[Martin Weidmann]

You've missed the point Martin.
I was putting forward a made-up scenario to try to account for various aspects of the curtain rods.
In the scenario WBF and LMR concoct the story about the curtain rods to conceal that Oswald carried a rifle to work that day and Frazier would've been up s"^t creek for bringing the assassin of JFK and his rifle to work that morning.
One of the aspects this scenario covers is that Ruth Paine testified there was just 2 curtain rods in her garage which she had wrapped herself and that the curtain rods were still in the garage after the assassination. This means Oswald never took the curtain rods to work that morning.

Mr. JENNER - Now, that morning--if I may, Mr. Chairman, because of the entry of the police, that is a good cutoff point, I would like to go back to the morning for the moment, or the evening before. Mrs. Paine, did you then have what might be called some curtain rods in your garage?
Mrs. PAINE - I believe there were.
Mr. JENNER - Do you have a recollection?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes; they were stored in the garage, wrapped in loose brown paper.
Mr. JENNER - Is it the brown paper of the nature and character you described yesterday that you get at the market and have in a roll?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes.
Mr. JENNER - Had you wrapped that package yourself?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes.


Mr. JENNER - Now, how many of them were there?
Mrs. PAINE - Two.

Mr. JENNER - Let us return to the curtain rods first. Do you still have those curtain rods?
Mrs. PAINE - I believe so.

The curtain rods were collected from the Paine's garage, there was only two of them and both were there.

The curtain rods were collected from the Paine's garage, there was only two of them and both were there.

Which suggests that there must have been a third set, which was presented to the identification bureau of the DPD by Secret Service Agent Howlett on 5/15/64 and not collected from there until the day after Ruth Paine's testimony at her home, which was when the two sets of curtain rods were collected.

There is of course always the possibility that Oswald had a set of curtain rods stored with his belongings of which Ruth Paine knew nothing. It is speculation, but it would explain the anomaly in the evidence.