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Author Topic: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.  (Read 76180 times)

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #576 on: March 22, 2020, 09:19:18 PM »
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The nutjob in the Cuckoo's Nest amply demonstrated just how accurate the Carcano can be in practiced hands. Going 2-for-3 is a great batting average in any man's league.

Like you actually know for a fact what the shooter was aiming at, or what weapon fired the shots that hit Kennedy and Connally.

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #576 on: March 22, 2020, 09:19:18 PM »


Offline Jerry Freeman

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #577 on: March 22, 2020, 09:52:05 PM »

The other point about the curtain rod/bag story is that it originated with Frazier many hours after his sister talked to Adamcek at the Paine’s. We were told she was aware the day before of the reason for Oswald's unusual visit yet failed to mention it to the police.

Statements made in April the following year. With no cross-examination---anything could be and was said to make the story fit.

Quote
Mr. BELIN. Then what did you do?
Mr. ADAMCIK. Coming back, Mrs. Frazier, I believe it was, drove up to the house as I was coming back with--no, it was Mrs. Bill Randle. She (Mrs. Randle) was a neighbor there and she was driving up to the house, so I asked her whether she knew anything about what had happened, and whether she had seen Lee Oswald, and she did tell me that Lee Oswald rode to work with her brother, which is Wesley Frazier, who was staying with her, and he rode to work with him that morning. She told me that she saw--she was up early in the morning and was drinking coffee, and saw Lee Harvey Oswald go across the front yard, across the yard carrying like a long package wrapped in something, carrying it from the Paine house to Wesley's car.
Mr. BELIN. Did she say how he was carrying the package?
Mr. ADAMCIK. No; she didn't. I think we got an affidavit. In fact, I know we did, but I didn't take it.
Mr. BELIN. Did she say about how long the package was?
Mr. ADAMCIK. Mrs. Oswald, yes; she was. She was questioned that same evening.
Mr. BELIN. What did she say?
Mr. ADAMCIK. Well, she was questioned through an interpreter, and an affidavit was gotten from her also. I know she was showed the rifle in my presence. I was there with Captain Fritz and myself and Detective Senkel, and the rifle was showed to her then, and she looked at it, and I remember her saying through an interpreter that it did look like the rifle, but she didn't say, but it did look like the rifle that Lee Oswald, that was in the garage previous to finding the blanket eventually.
Mr. BELIN. When you say finding the blanket eventually, did she say the blanket was there? Was it simply that when you showed the blanket to the officers, apparently she made some remark that about a week or so previous to that her husband's rifle had been wrapped in a blanket?
Mr. ADAMCIK. I can't remember exactly how long. I don't remember when she said the last time was she saw it.
Mr. BELIN. Did Mrs. Paine indicate she ever saw the rifle there?
Mr. ADAMCIK. I can't remember. I took an affidavit, and I know I questioned her about the rifle, and I can't remember whether she ever said. I would have to see the affidavit. I don't have a copy. I don't believe she said she seen the rifle. I believe that she said she saw the blanket there, but I am sure that that would be in the affidavit.
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and she was driving up to the house, so I asked her whether she knew anything about what had happened?...Had she seen Oswald?

That doesn't seem plausible ...that an investigative detective would immediately start asking just the right person [who happened to be driving up to some house] to start spilling the beans on the curtain rod story.

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she did tell me that Lee Oswald rode to work with her brother, which is Wesley Frazier, who was staying with her, and he rode to work with him that morning.
I don't believe that or any of it for a second. The cops knew exactly who Wes Frazier was before they ever went out to Irving.....
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Mr. BELIN. All right.
Mr. ADAMCIK. Oh, yes, after talking to this Mrs. Randle, we wanted to talk to Wesley Frazier, and she said that he was at Parkland visiting his sick daddy. So when we got back to the station, we checked with Parkland and couldn't find anybody by that name over there, so we checked with the clinic there in Irving, I believe it was, Irving Professional Center, and found out that he was there. The nurse checked the room, and he was there at the time, so some of the detectives called out there and had him placed in custody at that time so we could get an affidavit from him or question him.

Probably--the cops told Randle that she better start refreshing her memory about some package that she saw Oswald carry that morning because in the meantime...they were taking her brother in as an accessory to murder!
Quote
I remember her saying through an interpreter that it did look like the rifle
In various other testimony it was mentioned that Marina could not identify that rifle.

Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #578 on: March 22, 2020, 10:01:05 PM »
Like you actually know for a fact what the shooter was aiming at, or what weapon fired the shots that hit Kennedy and Connally.

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« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 02:07:56 PM by Bill Chapman »

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #578 on: March 22, 2020, 10:01:05 PM »


Online James Hackerott

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #579 on: March 22, 2020, 11:26:45 PM »
Thanks James....  It certainly appears that the time that Montgomery and Johnson departed the TSBD with that huge paper sack was around 3:00pm.

I wonder if you've used the shadows to determine what time Detective Day left the TSBD with the carcano.     I believe that Day departed at about 2:10 and returned to the TSBD about an hour later.....  Or around 3:15.....  If that is true, then Montgomery left with the paper sack before Day returned, and Day never saw this bag in the imaginary "Sniper's Nest"
I found some very interesting and some new (to me) films taken as Lt. Day left by the doorway steps, walks with the rifle about half-way to the corner, stops and poses for photographers. He then walks past the corner toward his car. Quite fortunately for this subject several film frames catch the TSBD's shadow as it creeps upward with time. Richard Trask, in his “Pictures of The Pain”, states this time is about 13:45. Walter seems to like around 14:10 for the time. This new video shows the time is 1:56pm within 1 or 2 minutes.

20200323 Edit- I retract all of the next paragraph. It's just not right. and I'm very sorry.

The result follows from my 3D simulation at 13:30-14:30 showing that the shadow reaches the height of the lower DalTex ledge below the second floor.  Anyone can, and I encourage, verify this timing while in Dealey Plaza with sunshine. Note and photograph when the shadow reaches this height on the DalTex. Just record the date and accurate time. From that we can determine the sun's azimuth altitude at that time and work backwards to the equivalent time of November 22, 1963.
 
Credit Helmer Reenberg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ep-L8ZBnJxU






James
« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 06:31:53 PM by James Hackerott »

Offline Colin Crow

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #580 on: March 22, 2020, 11:48:24 PM »
Many thanks James.   Thumb1:

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #580 on: March 22, 2020, 11:48:24 PM »


Online Charles Collins

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #581 on: March 22, 2020, 11:48:42 PM »
I found some very interesting and some new (to me) films taken as Lt. Day left by the doorway steps, walks with the rifle about half-way to the corner, stops and poses for photographers. He then walks past the corner toward his car. Quite fortunately for this subject several film frames catch the TSBD's shadow as it creeps upward with time. Richard Trask, in his “Pictures of The Pain”, states this time is about 13:45. Walter seems to like around 14:10 for the time. This new video shows the time is 1:56pm within 1 or 2 minutes.

The result follows from my 3D simulation at 13:30-14:30 showing that the shadow reaches the height of the lower DalTex ledge below the second floor.  Anyone can, and I encourage, verify this timing while in Dealey Plaza with sunshine. Note and photograph when the shadow reaches this height on the DalTex. Just record the date and accurate time. From that we can determine the sun's azimuth at that time and work backwards to the equivalent time of November 22, 1963.
 
Credit Helmer Reenberg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ep-L8ZBnJxU






James

Excellent work James! I thought that I saw a movie cameraman in a blue sweater in one of the still photos. It might have even been the photo you mentioned in your last post. I wonder if that is the cameraman who filmed what is in the YouTube video?

Online James Hackerott

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #582 on: March 23, 2020, 02:27:57 AM »
Excellent work James! I thought that I saw a movie cameraman in a blue sweater in one of the still photos. It might have even been the photo you mentioned in your last post. I wonder if that is the cameraman who filmed what is in the YouTube video?
Charles, the only color photos of this scene are from Jay Skaggs, as far as I know.. The Skaggs slides all have a blue color cast-which I made a correction for. Skaggs19 shows a man in a sweater? Possibly blue. He is backlit and underexposed but this is probably the man you saw. He does have a movie camera to his eye and aiming just where Day is standing. So yes, I think he could  have filmed at least some of the YouTube film. Perhaps Denis Morrisette knows his ID.

Skaggs19:
https://emuseum.jfk.org/objects/22067/image-of-lt-j-c-carl-day-holding-rifle-outside-the-book?ctx=7aeaa966-f063-440c-9cbe-0afb9043ac16&idx=15

Cropped, enhanced view of cameraman.in Skaggs19:



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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #582 on: March 23, 2020, 02:27:57 AM »


Offline Jerry Freeman

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Re: Oswald's sack in the Sniper's nest.
« Reply #583 on: March 23, 2020, 03:20:30 AM »
Back to the sack-----
From the Warren Report.....
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Fibers in paper bag matched fibers in blanket.--When Paul M. Stombaugh of the FBI Laboratory examined the paper bag, he found, on the inside, a single brown delustered viscose fiber and several light green cotton fibers.198 The blanket in which the rifle was stored was composed of brown and green cotton, viscose and woolen fibers.199
The single brown viscose fiber found in the bag matched some of the brown viscose fibers from the blanket in all observable characteristics.200 The green cotton fibers found in the paper bag matched some of the green cotton fibers in the blanket "in all observable microscopic characteristics." 201 Despite these matches, however, Stombaugh was unable to render on opinion that the fibers which he found in the bag had probably come from the blanket, because other types of fibers present in the blanket were not found in the bag. He concluded:     All I would say here is that it is possible that these fibers could have come from this blanket., because this blanket is composed of brown and green woolen fibers, brown and green delustered viscose fibers, and brown and green cotton fibers... We found no brown cotton fibers, no green viscose fibers, and no woolen fibers.
    So if I found all of these then I would have been able to say these fibers probably had come from this blanket. But since I found so few, then I would say the possibility exists, these fibers could have come from this blanket.202 Stombaugh confirmed that the rifle could have picked up fibers from the blanket and transferred them to the paper bag.203 In light of the other evidence linking Lee Harvey Oswald, the blanket, and the rifle to the paper bag found on the sixth floor, the Commission considered Stombaugh's testimony of probative value in deciding whether Oswald carried the rifle into the building in the paper bag.
Coulda..woulda..shoulda...possibly.. maybe.. is not positive evidence.
Gee--- if we only had someone who saw Oswald conspicuously coming into the building carrying a large HEAVY paper package ::)