Paging Von P..... Hello Von P....??

[Walt Cakebread]

It is 3.3mm

Where are you measuring?   That 3.3 cannot be ACROSS the groove......

[Walt Cakebread]

The picture you are referencing is not the groove. It is the land. The land measures 1.8 mm just like Frazier stated a carcano barrel's lands and grooves are supposed to be. The barrel's groove is 3.3 mm

Frazier referring to a carcano's lands and grooves while discussing the Walker Bullet. The same as the barrel cast from CE 139

Mr. EISENBERG - Can you describe the general rifling characteristics which you referred to?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes. They consist of impressions from four lands and grooves. The bullet is mutilated on a portion of its surface. However, it can be determined that there were four land impressions and four groove impressions originally on this bullet.
The width of the land impression is 7/100ths of an inch, that is 0.07 inch--whereas the width of the groove impression is 0.13 inch, or 13/100ths of an inch.
The bullet is flattened so that it was not possible to measure its diameter. However, by adding the land width to the groove width, and multiplying by the number of lands and grooves, you can determine the circumference of the bullet and mathematically determine its diameter, which in this case corresponds to 6.5 mm. ammunition, or approximately .267 inch.
Mr. EISENBERG - What was the direction of the twist?
Mr. FRAZIER - To the right.

The LAND in the barrel creates a GROOVE in the projectile as the projectile is fired through the barrel.   

The GROOVE on the jacket is called a GROOVE .....  And that's what I'm referring to. 

I simply asked for anybody to use the scale and measure the width of the groove....Simple..... If you can't do that then ....move on.....
I had hoped that an honest person would simply measure the distance ACROSS the groove on the copper jacket.....

[Jack Nessan]

The LAND in the barrel creates a GROOVE in the projectile as the projectile is fired through the barrel.   

The GROOVE on the jacket is called a GROOVE .....  And that's what I'm referring to. 

I simply asked for anybody to use the scale and measure the width of the groove....Simple..... If you can't do that then ....move on.....
I had hoped that an honest person would simply measure the distance ACROSS the groove on the copper jacket.....

Cakebread: ...."The lands in the rifling of a Mannlicher Carcano barrel measure 2 mm across...  This bullet was NOT fired from a Mannlicher Carcano."


No, it is very specific.  The nomenclature does not change because you don't know what you are talking about. The "land impression" on the bullet fragment measures approximately(.07 inches) 1.8 mm.  The "groove impression" measures approximately(.13 inches) 3.3mm. Because you can't read a ruler doesn't mean Frazier could not. If you can read the "land impression" is 1.5mm it is only because you want to. Frazier made a Sulphur cast of CE 139's barrel he knew exactly the dimensions of the rifle's lands and grooves.

[Walt Cakebread]

Cakebread: ...."The lands in the rifling of a Mannlicher Carcano barrel measure 2 mm across...  This bullet was NOT fired from a Mannlicher Carcano."


No, it is very specific.  The nomenclature does not change because you don't know what you are talking about. The "land impression" on the bullet fragment measures approximately(.07 inches) 1.8 mm.  The "groove impression" measures approximately(.13 inches) 3.3mm. Because you can't read a ruler doesn't mean Frazier could not. If you can read the "land impression" is 1.5mm it is only because you want to. Frazier made a Sulphur cast of CE 139's barrel he knew exactly the dimensions of the rifle's lands and grooves.

Jack...Your desperation is hangin out a country mile....  The lands in the barrel create the grooves on the projectile ...Just as the treads on a tire create the track in the dirt....   Now go play marbles on the freeway....

[John Iacoletti]

What are the units on the scale?  Is there an uncropped photo available?

[Walt Cakebread]

What are the units on the scale?  Is there an uncropped photo available?

What are the units on the scale?

OMG!!.... Even an elementary school kid knows that the metric system is based on units of ten....  Get your head out and LOOK....

[Jack Nessan]

Jack...Your desperation is hangin out a country mile....  The lands in the barrel create the grooves on the projectile ...Just as the treads on a tire create the track in the dirt....   Now go play marbles on the freeway....

Cakebread Original Post: "Referring to the pic on the right....How wide is the groove that is clearly visible on the copper jacket....(hint....There is a scale right there...."

Seems you have lost your train of thought. Must be because of how lame this whole thread is to begin with and what a lame explanation you just provided instead of explain your numbers and the proper names of what is being discussed.