Oswald's High School

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Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #20 on: June 06, 2018, 02:11:53 AM »
 How was Oswald proficient in Russian before defecting to the Soviet Union


Numerous eyewitnesses provide us with a profile of Oswald?s fluency in Russian, suggesting that he was a native speaker.  According to these first-hand accounts, Oswald?s conversational and idiomatic Russian were so flawless that he could not have reached this level of fluency exclusively from the two-and-a-half years he spent in the USSR.  Mrs. Natalie Ray, who emigrated to the United States from Stalingrad and met Oswald after his return from the Soviet Union, testified to the Warren Commission that his conversational Russian was ?just perfect?.it?s just too good speaking Russian for such a short time.? [4]  Mrs. Ray was paying a posthumous compliment to Oswald while speaking in her own broken English:  ?I said, ?How come you speak so good Russian?  I been here so long and still don?t speak very well English.?? [5]  When Mrs. Ray was asked by Warren Commission attorney Wesley Liebeler, ?You thought he spoke Russian better than you would expect a person to be able to speak Russian after only living?there only 3 years??, she replied, ?Yes; I really did.? [6] 

After testing Oswald?s skills in translation, linguist Peter Gregory, who was a native Russian, dashed off a letter of recommendation for Oswald for work as a professional interpreter or translator of the Russian language.  But with no evidence of formal training other than spending two-and-half years in the Soviet Union, how was it possible for Oswald to attain this level of accomplishment?  Moreover, Gregory believed that Oswald spoke Russian with a Polish accent, which could not have been acquired from living in Minsk.

Peter Gregory?s son, Paul, was a schoolmate of Oswald?s at Stripling Junior High School in Fort Worth in the academic year 1954-55.  The school records documenting Oswald?s enrollment, which were hand-delivered to FBI agents by assistant principal Frank Kudlaty, were subsequently lost by the FBI.  By the early 1960s, Paul Gregory was a graduate student in Russian language and literature at the University of Oklahoma.  He later told the Warren Commission that, despite making grammatical errors, Oswald ?was completely fluent.  He understood more than I did and he could express any idea?that he wanted to in Russian.? [9]  Other witnesses, including George Bouhe, Mrs. Teofil (Anna ) Meller, Elena Hall, and Mrs. Dymitruk, recalled Oswald?s exceptional skills in speaking Russian. [10]  This substantial body of testimony vouching for Oswald?s Russian language skills is not casual ?hearsay? evidence, but often first-hand accounts recorded under oath for the Warren Commission.

George De Mohrenschildt was a Russian ?migr? who had taught Russian language at the university level.  He was in a perfect position to assess Oswald?s command of the language, yet was puzzled about where, how, and when Oswald could have achieved such mastery.  How was it possible for an American high school dropout in his early twenties to have read ?Gorki, Dostoevski, Golgol, Tolstoi and Turgenieff? in the original Russian language versions?  The extract above is from p. 118 of De Mohrenschildt?s memoir I Am a Patsy!: My Contact With Lee Harvey Oswald, The Warren Commission, and the JFK Assassination Conspiracy.

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #20 on: June 06, 2018, 02:11:53 AM »

Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #21 on: June 06, 2018, 02:42:05 AM »
I understand that part. And theoretically yes.
Might really mean something if someone can actually obtain it.
Who has the ability/connections to do this?
Gary Mack could have maybe.
Come back with suggestions.

 Jerry Thanks for the interest I would assume Armstrong would be taking the lead, but I see no contact info at his site DiEugenio use to be accessible on the Education discussion forum This may be to far out for a lot of CT folks, and I am not very familiar with who else out of the leading researchers is interested in the topic

It looks like Gary Mack died a few years ago
« Last Edit: June 06, 2018, 02:43:42 AM by Matt Grantham »

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #21 on: June 06, 2018, 02:42:05 AM »

Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #22 on: June 06, 2018, 03:17:37 AM »
 Rob I don't think we disagree, my comment was to try to frame it in a way lone shooter folks might be able to absorb

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #22 on: June 06, 2018, 03:17:37 AM »

Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #23 on: June 06, 2018, 04:06:28 AM »
No problems Matt as I know that we agree. This is interesting stuff.

 Thanks Rob

 Here are a couple of points of interest

n January, 1953, while HARVEY and the Marguerite Oswald imposter were living in the Bronx, there are indications of CIA involvement. The House on Un-American Activites Committee (HUAC) had a file that made reference to a "Mrs. M. Oswald" in New York City that originated from a CIA Office of Security file. This CIA file contained references to 1941, Nazi's, and New Jersey. Judge John Tunheim, of the Assassination Records Review Board (ARRB) wrote to Henry Hyde and requested the HUAC file, but his request was denied.

In February, 1953 John Pic and his family were invited to dinner at the Oswald's apartment. This was the last time Pic would see his brother for 9 years. Nine years later, in 1962 Pic was invited to Thanksgiving Dinner at Robert Oswald's home, where he met the Russian speaking HARVEY Oswald. Pic told the Warren Commission, "the Lee Harvey Oswald I met in November of 1962 [Thanksgiving] was not the Lee Harvey Oswald I had known 10 years previous [in New York]." When the Warren Commission showed John Pic photographs of HARVEY Oswald taken in 1953, 1957, and 1963 he refused to identify these photos as his brother. Robert Oswald most certainly knew that the Russian speaking HARVEY was not his brother, because Robert had lived with both HARVEY Oswald and the Marguerite Oswald impostor at 4936 Collinwood for 6 months in 1956.

  At least one source has Oswald speaking German as well, and rumored to have had a Hungarian accent or country of origin We of course know that US intelligence had been working closely with German intelligence at the closing of WW2 Could this young Oswald been part of that new collaboration?

 And to digress back to the gathering DNA. One would think that the LHO two daughter's with Marina would be sympathetic to having a DNA test Robert's Oswald's offspring not so much since he apparently identified Marina's Husband as his Brother If Pic had children they might be more willing since John Pic is on the record saying it was not his Brother
« Last Edit: June 06, 2018, 04:24:25 AM by Matt Grantham »

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #23 on: June 06, 2018, 04:06:28 AM »

Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #24 on: June 06, 2018, 06:11:39 AM »
  Robert Oswald had two children Cathy Marie and Robert Lee Edward Jr. John Pic had one Daughter born in July of 47. I  believe Robert's children were born around 1960 Lee or Harvey, had two DaughtersAudery Marina "Rachel"Oswald Porter b. Oct 20/63 and June Lee Oswald b.Feb 15/63 I was thinking that even a genetic test might show if Rachel and June had markers for Easter European heritage that that alone could be significant since the Oswald name is Anglo Saxon However  June and Rachel's Grandfather is listed as Nicolay Prusakov which throws a monkey wrench into that notion This would seemingly have to be Marguerite's Father Strangely Robert Oswald says he is not sure of his Mothers maiden name but assumes it was Claverie, which was her middle name

 Every time you look for anything in this case there has so be some strange stuff

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #24 on: June 06, 2018, 06:11:39 AM »

Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2018, 11:26:38 PM »
 Yes Armstrong included a timeline of how it was a gradual process were the heavier Marguerite slowly to takes over the position of Oswald's Mother around 1960

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2018, 11:26:38 PM »

Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #26 on: June 08, 2018, 04:09:43 AM »
Yes Armstrong included a timeline of how it was a gradual process were the heavier Marguerite slowly to takes over the position of Oswald's Mother around 1960

Weren't there two Marguerites?   ;D

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #26 on: June 08, 2018, 04:09:43 AM »

Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #27 on: June 08, 2018, 04:49:27 AM »
Actually there was no takeover according to him. The tall attractive Marguerite was the mother of Lee Oswald and the short heavyset one was the mother of Harvey Oswald. When the American Lee was taken out of the picture the Eastern European Harvey and his mom became LHO of record per Armstrong.

Today, what remains, are an overwhelming number of FBI reports relating to the Marguerite Oswald impostor. Beginning in 1955, as the number of FBI reports relating to Marguerite Claverie Oswald diminished, the number of FBI reports relating to the Marguerite Oswald imposter increased. By the spring of 1959 the Marguerite Oswald impostor became the one and only "Marguerite Oswald," mother of the young man who would soon "defect" to the Soviet Union

 It seemed like you disputed my term of taking over for in referring to this quote  Maybe your right, but so far I would think that is a reasonable summary of what is written here there was a matching correspondence between the changing frequency from Lee towards Harvey at this time So if I did not include that point that is a fair point
« Last Edit: June 08, 2018, 07:47:38 AM by Matt Grantham »

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #27 on: June 08, 2018, 04:49:27 AM »

Offline Matt Grantham

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #28 on: June 08, 2018, 10:01:15 PM »
You're being too sensitive. There was a transition and not a takeover is all that I am saying. Supposedly the transition for Lee didn't occur until he was in the USMC.

 It seems i have made two mistakes All over nothing imo Take over for, and a takeover have different connotations in my mind at least Transition is however, admittedly, is a better term

 Can anyone tell me if the JFK education Forum allows for new members? I am having trouble finding a way to do so or getting a response from the administrators I post this here because of Jerry's remark that maybe I should try to see if anyone is working on the Oswal DNA question ,and thought the Education Forum might be a possible place to in that effort
« Last Edit: June 08, 2018, 11:04:52 PM by Matt Grantham »

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #28 on: June 08, 2018, 10:01:15 PM »

Offline W. Tracy Parnell

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Re: Oswald's High School
« Reply #29 on: June 09, 2018, 01:51:45 PM »
According to Fort Worth's Strpling Junior High Assistant Principle Frank Kudlaty states the FBI seized Oswald records at the school within 24 hours of assassination The FBI apparently has no record of any such event

 Robert Oswald's WC testimony

  Mr. OSWALD. Just a minute, please.
     In 1952 Lee was 13 years old.  He would be attending W. C. Stripling
     Junior High School then.

     Mr. JENNER. I see.  For the school year 1951-52?

     Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.  Junior high school there was from the seventh to
     the ninth grades.  And as soon as he was through with his sixth year,
     he started attending W. C. Stripling Junior High School.

     Mr. JENNER. As soon as he finished the sixth year at Ridglea Elementary
     School, he entered W. C. Stripling High School, as a seventh grader?

     Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir--junior high school.

     Mr. JENNER. Now, the condition that you described as to Lee shifting
     for himself during the daytime, when your mother was away working and
     you were away working, and your brother John was in the Coast Guard,
     continued, I take it, when he began attendance and while he was
     attending W. C. Stripling Junior High School?

     Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.

 
 Nonetheless the Warren Commission has Oswald only attending and graduating from Beauregard Junior High School in New Orleans, or spending some of that time at a school in NYC 

 This alone is not proof of anything but there of course  a lot more coincidences in the tale of the two Oswald's, so I suppose the only question I am directly posing is just in regard to the contradictions in this particular part of  the story


Let's see if we can undo some of the misinformation in this thread. Frank Kudlaty never said a word to anyone about any confiscated records. At least not until he had a conversation with his friend Jack White who filled him in on the John Armstrong "Harvey & Lee" nonsense. Kudlaty then suddenly "remembered" the confiscated records. White tried to conceal the fact that he was a friend of Kudlaty in a discussion on the Education Forum, but Greg Parker got it out of him. The point is, if Kudlaty was so concerned about the "confiscated" records, why didn't he report it years before? Anyone interested in this can go to the EF and do a search or go to Greg Parker's (References & links to websites which contain pornographic images and/or abusive content directed at members of this Forum is strictly prohibited ) site.


Robert Oswald was simply wrong about Stripling:


http://wtracyparnell.blogspot.com/2017/04/robert-oswald-and-stripling.html

 

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