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Author Topic: Prayer Woman  (Read 255815 times)

Offline Barry Pollard

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #470 on: June 23, 2018, 01:10:19 AM »
That sandwich wrapper would would have to be made of some very shining material IMO Alan, comparing it to his arms in Wiegman, something ultra reflective,  I guess I'm still comfortable with the bottle or white china mug argument which he could have put down in the preceeding 20s or so. Also I considered your folded arms scenario even doing what you asked and covering up his "left hand" but I don't see it yet. The stabilized footage has him, for me, moving his arms/hands perhaps unwrapping something but since every part of him is moving due of the quality of what we have avaliable, I'm not very sure about that either.

Unrelated but relative.
Since Brian mentioned it at least three times here and concluded that it was another "death nail" before anyone(me and not everyone) knew what he was referring to I have to say it at least once, especially since his analysis is the one we're all suppposed to rely on. Someone drew a picture of a slim Oswald and placed it over PM, I like it but Brian mistook the drawing for a real image and concluded that PM could not be LHO. That's the strength of his analysis, major errors can enter into his enthusiastic approach at any time.
Now regarding what the author of this drawing wrote, he sees a slim Oswald with a reflection in the glass, making us all see a wider person, well, if you put him in a position so that his reflection is seen in that glass from Darnell's POV then he's on the landing, too short and most probably not LHO. I have no problem with just an oversized shirt, don't see any wide hips, or anyway too big to be LHO or any unaccounted for male of similar size stood with one foot down, or even a shorter one on the landing.
Like Michael said, I too would love it to be him and I wouldn't up and leave the case like someone else suggested he would.

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #470 on: June 23, 2018, 01:10:19 AM »

Offline Barry Pollard

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #471 on: June 23, 2018, 02:03:02 AM »
This was the image that in which I think Linda Zambinini found Pauline Sanders, wasn't posted in full here, not convinced it's a woman at all but from my previous mistakes it could still be, anyway worth a look.
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Offline Joe Kulik

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #472 on: June 23, 2018, 02:23:35 AM »
No offense intended, but I find your discussion of "Prayer Woman" to be quite trivial.  You seem to start with the unwarranted assumption that the identity of this person is even somehow important to the topic of the JFK assassination.  But is that necessarily so ?  There were thousands of people on the street at the time, the vast majority of whom hold no importance to the assassination.  What is most probable, therefore, is that this obscure person is just another unidentifiable spectator in the crowd, and nothing more.

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #472 on: June 23, 2018, 02:23:35 AM »

Online Jerry Freeman

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #473 on: June 23, 2018, 03:05:09 AM »
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No offense intended, but I find your discussion of "Prayer Woman" to be quite trivial.  You seem ...
Whose discussion?
There are 530 other posts in this thread.
Can you quote the one that you are referring to?
 

Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #474 on: June 23, 2018, 05:41:04 AM »
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But Baker thought the shots had come from the ROOF! Why would he waste his time going after a man just one floor up? Crazy!!

The reason he said LHO was already mobile when he first saw him through the glass door was he had to make the new story conform somehow to his original 'a man walking away from the stairway' statement.

I agree with you about Baker's language. His testimony is a lie. The footage of Baker & LHO in the DPD hallway on the Saturday which Barry Pollard has discovered also tells its own story. Baker's head goes down
-------------he doesn't want LHO to recognise him!


Don't play dumb Alan...Because he saw Oswald flinch away and Oswald had a particularly guilty look when he flinched because he was a spook and agent provocateur who had more to him than met the eye...Don't play dumb Alan...We both know who and what Oswald was and Oswald telegraphed that to Baker whose cop instincts picked right up on it...That's exactly my point...Why would Baker go after someone on the 2nd floor?...The answer is because that person did something to draw Baker's suspicion and that something was flinching away from the vestibule window and withdrawing into the lunch room...Baker gets fuzzy on exactly how he noticed Oswald because he can't tell the Commission that Oswald was calmly standing behind the vestibule door window watching the landing...He can't do that because that would make it too clear Oswald had not just ran down from the Sniper's Nest right in front of Baker & Truly...

Alan, the reason Baker describes seeing Oswald on the move is because Oswald was on the move when he flinched away from the window after seeing a cop appear on the landing...When you tell Alan that Truly told his wife of the encounter friday night he ignores it...

The correct interpretation of Baker's body language when he sees Oswald at the police station is Baker knows Oswald is on the inside and is undergoing a false arrest while maintaining cover...What I see in Baker is someone who knows Oswald is one of their own who is nodding his head both in respect and shame that he was involved in witnessing that proved Oswald's innocence...He knows Oswald's not guilty because he knows he saw Oswald in the lunch room and that he was there the whole time and not on the 6th floor...It's very simple and a very easily interpreted body language Alan...Baker feels guilty so he hangs his head because he knows he witnessed Oswald's innocence in the lunch room...

Wait a minute Alan...How could Oswald recognize Baker if the lunch room encounter never happened?


Alan shows all the classic earmarks of trolling...He snips off one point and aggressively answers it with a question...He does this with every post...We can review this thread and Alan chops off 90% of your evidence and then picks a low hanging fruit to ask a baited question over...By using this classic trolling technique Alan self-creates the illusion that he is controlling the narrative when in fact he's left most of the pertinent evidence unanswered and ignored...You can even call Alan a troll outright and he'll ignore it and continue on unphased...Serious researchers offering serious input wouldn't let you call them a troll if they are sincere in what they were posting...


   
« Last Edit: June 23, 2018, 04:08:55 PM by Brian Doyle »

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #474 on: June 23, 2018, 05:41:04 AM »

Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #475 on: June 23, 2018, 05:50:21 AM »
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You KNOW that Sarah Stanton can't be PrayerPerson, otherwise you wouldn't have speculated that she wore a wig or dyed her hair!! The only other person who still thinks Sarah=PrayerPerson is Italics Trotter, but he'll believe anything.


You're not playing chess according to the rules Alan...If Kamp had placed Sarah's chubby forearm next to the very good blow-up of Prayer Man's forearm he posted on the Education Forum its exact resemblance would be apparent...Bart Kamp could post over here if he liked...He doesn't because he knows he would be instantly shredded...Bart and Jim D only post where they can get cowardly moderators to ban the opposition where they know the opposing evidence will be filtered...

You are outright ignoring that Buell Frazier already made it clear Prayer Man is Sarah...You know as well as I do that wide-hipped Sarah is nowhere else on the landing...We both know Kamp avoided placing Sarah's forearm next to Prayer Man's because he already knew what it would show...


Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #476 on: June 23, 2018, 06:10:54 AM »
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Theory!

In Wiegman we see LHO, facing forward, raising a sandwich to his mouth with his RIGHT hand (if you look closely you see the left hand does NOT go up)...

   

? and in Darnell we see him with his arms folded, still facing forward but with head turned east, the sandwich/wrapper still in his RIGHT hand, only that hand is tucked under his left elbow and the protrusion of the sandwich/wrapper is giving the MISLEADING impression of being his left forearm! (The way to see this is to cover up the purported left forearm, take in the image of LHO with arms folded, and then return the purported left forearm to the image. It's quite startling!)




The above are garbage observations...The correct interpretation is the limousine has gone by and Sarah can't see it anymore because of the west wall of the portal...So she looks in to her purse...If you look at the Davidson enhancement that honest Alan omits you can clearly see Sarah Stanton's face and she clearly has her purse in front of her face and is looking down in to it...

Of the two Wiegman frames the first one had her hands up by her face and looking in to the purse...In the second one her hands lower...

If you are a good photo analyst you will notice the sun illuminates Sarah's right elbow area of her forearm...That means the glowing hand is also illuminated by sun and is simply that - a hand glowing in sun because it is furthest forward and in to the sun/shade plane...For years this has been misinterpreted by researchers who lack photo analysis skill...And the left hand does go up too because it is also holding the purse...

In Darnell Prayer Man pivots to "his" left and faces Frazier...This was very apparent in the stabilized clip of all Prayer Man images in Wiegman and Darnell that was posted on this board over two years ago...Prayer Man pivots towards Frazier because "he" is Sarah Stanton who is reacting to Frazier asking her what Calvery said, as Frazier made more than clear in his 2013 video interview and honest Alan outright ignores...

Alan cannot be trusted for correct interpretation of evidence and always regresses to what Larry Trotter describes as his "stupid game"...

Honest Alan omits the Davidson enhancement that Duncan posted at the end of his original post...It shows the best version of the Wiegman clear frame above and there is no doubt it depicts Sarah Stanton peering in to her purse...


 
   

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #476 on: June 23, 2018, 06:10:54 AM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #477 on: June 23, 2018, 09:27:01 AM »
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That sandwich wrapper would would have to be made of some very shining material IMO Alan, comparing it to his arms in Wiegman, something ultra reflective,  I guess I'm still comfortable with the bottle or white china mug argument which he could have put down in the preceeding 20s or so.

Might be parchment paper, Barry, of the sort used to wrap sandwiches (from memory, there was some found in the Paine house). LHO is recorded as telling Captain Fritz he had a cheese sandwich and apple for lunch that day.


Quote
Also I considered your folded arms scenario even doing what you asked and covering up his "left hand" but I don't see it yet. The stabilized footage has him, for me, moving his arms/hands perhaps unwrapping something but since every part of him is moving due of the quality of what we have avaliable, I'm not very sure about that either.

That footage isn't stabilized. The wall moves as much as the hands because Darnell's camera is moving:



Taking a single frame makes it a bit easier to 'see' the folded arms idea:




Quote
Unrelated but relative.
Since Brian mentioned it at least three times here and concluded that it was another "death nail" before anyone(me and not everyone) knew what he was referring to I have to say it at least once, especially since his analysis is the one we're all suppposed to rely on. Someone drew a picture of a slim Oswald and placed it over PM, I like it but Brian mistook the drawing for a real image and concluded that PM could not be LHO. That's the strength of his analysis, major errors can enter into his enthusiastic approach at any time.
Now regarding what the author of this drawing wrote, he sees a slim Oswald with a reflection in the glass, making us all see a wider person, well, if you put him in a position so that his reflection is seen in that glass from Darnell's POV then he's on the landing, too short and most probably not LHO. I have no problem with just an oversized shirt, don't see any wide hips, or anyway too big to be LHO or any unaccounted for male of similar size stood with one foot down, or even a shorter one on the landing.
Like Michael said, I too would love it to be him and I wouldn't up and leave the case like someone else suggested he would.

I just can't see it being a reflection either. In one of the Allen photos a motorcycle cop's white helmet is reflected in the glass door and the reflection is dark. And yes, PrayerPerson's too far from the glass to cast a reflection like that (& what would the reflection be of??). He seems to me to be one step down.

Brian's approach certainly is "enthusiastic", but his incompetence is staggering!
« Last Edit: June 23, 2018, 09:48:45 AM by Alan Ford »

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #477 on: June 23, 2018, 09:27:01 AM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #478 on: June 23, 2018, 09:30:03 AM »
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No offense intended, but I find your discussion of "Prayer Woman" to be quite trivial.  You seem to start with the unwarranted assumption that the identity of this person is even somehow important to the topic of the JFK assassination.  But is that necessarily so ?  There were thousands of people on the street at the time, the vast majority of whom hold no importance to the assassination.  What is most probable, therefore, is that this obscure person is just another unidentifiable spectator in the crowd, and nothing more.

Most improbable any non-TSBD person would have been amongst all those employees and gone unnoticed. A LOT of work has gone into establishing who's who up there and no one has been able to offer a realistic alternative candidate to LHO!

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #479 on: June 23, 2018, 09:35:49 AM »
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Don't play dumb Alan...We both know who and what Oswald was

Well it would be easier for the rest of us to know who you think Oswald was if you stopped multiplying him by 2!

Quote
Wait a minute Alan...How could Oswald recognize Baker if the lunch room encounter never happened?

Anyone familiar with the original Prayer Man theory will feel their jaw drop to the floor all over again at the depth of ignorance revealed in your question. The theory stipulated that Baker encountered LHO on the FIRST floor! He was LHO's alibi! THAT's why we see him putting his head down in the DPD hallway footage!

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #479 on: June 23, 2018, 09:35:49 AM »

 

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