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Author Topic: Prayer Woman  (Read 230206 times)

Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #300 on: June 16, 2018, 05:14:04 PM »
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Who cares about the history behind what you call the 'Prayer Man cult'? A theory was developed back in 2013 and you have just exposed the fact that you're pig ignorant of one of its major elements (Carolyn Arnold seeing Oswald in the lunchroom). Sad!

I think this can be safely interpreted as Alan ignoring the gist of what has been established that Kamp took the side of FBI and its lies against a main witness...That makes Kamp a Warren Commission apologist when he needs their deception to get him out of evidence he knows refutes him...

Since Alan is making no effort at honestly addressing this I think we can thank him for the quick victory and his folding by refusing to answer the point that is being made and therefore indirectly conceding...

I hope the JFK research community has the sense to see the danger this sort of person and material poses to the credible assassination research world and its conspiracy evidence...

Alan is dodging that the current Prayer Man theory on the JFK internet is claiming Carolyn Arnold lied and did not see Oswald in the 2nd floor lunch room... 

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #300 on: June 16, 2018, 05:14:04 PM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #301 on: June 16, 2018, 05:21:20 PM »
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I think this can be safely interpreted as Alan ignoring the gist of what has been established that Kamp took the side of FBI and its lies against a main witness...That makes Kamp a Warren Commission apologist when he needs their deception to get him out of evidence he knows refutes him...

Since Alan is making no effort at honestly addressing this I think we can thank him for the quick victory and his folding by refusing to answer the point that is being made and therefore indirectly conceding...

I hope the JFK research community has the sense to see the danger this sort of person and material poses to the credible assassination research world and its conspiracy evidence...

Alan is dodging that the current Prayer Man theory on the JFK internet is claiming Carolyn Arnold lied and did not see Oswald in the 2nd floor lunch room...


I'll take this as a concession that you are unfamiliar with the original PrayerMan theory and, in your strange obsession with a number of individuals elsewhere, have spent the last ages fighting a complete straw man.

You have quite the knack for destroying your own theories. First you rule out Sarah Stanton as PM by publishing a 1962-4 photo of her. Then you give a huge shot in the arm to the LHO=PM theory by uncovering Sarah Stanton's encounter with LHO near the second floor lunchroom which supports what Carolyn Arnold was telling people back in 1978.

Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #302 on: June 16, 2018, 05:31:01 PM »
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No, I've quoted him accurately which you didn't do. When are you going to deal with Barry's point that twice Frazier gestures left with his left hand when mentioning Sarah at the top of the steps as the motorcade was passing? How many more times are you going to avoid addressing it?

I don't think Alan should be taken seriously...Duncan pointed-out that the time period mentioned by Frazier near the 5 minute mark is before Wiegman and may be as much as 1 minute before Darnell...It has been made clear already that even if Frazier gestured to his left that the time period in question makes his movements irrelevant...I don't think Frazier was gesturing Sarah's location at that point...

To ignore that Frazier's movements during his description of the Darnell scene are THE most relevant and try to force evidence that has been reasonably considered irrelevant in its place shows an outward contempt towards honest argument and site conduct...A modicum of reasoned, gentlemanly debate is assumed in this community and a person who tries to force such dubious contempt in the face of sound logic and evidence should have his ability to participate considered...

Alan is being deliberately dishonest here and his deceit does not deserve the dignity of a response...He knows as well as I do that the accuracy of Frazier's exact words was not was I was discussing...I was clearly saying he and Barry were misconstruing his words and there was good evidence to prove it...We can assume that Alan's shameful attempt to avoid addressing that evidence is a tacit admission of its correctness and therefore dispense with the need of answering Alan's rank dishonesty...

The film evidence shows that Frazier did not have time to go to the bottom step and get back up without being seen in Darnell...Frazier's further words that Alan is deliberately ignoring prove that he was on the landing the whole time and never left it...If we follow Frazier's words with the accuracy Alan appeals to he clearly says that when he encountered Calvery's information at that step he immediately turned to Sarah to confront her on it...He couldn't have turned to Sarah immediately if he were on the bottom step...It is clear from Frazier's further words that Alan ignores that he was talking about the first step down from the landing...I think we can safely interpret Alan's sloppy ignoring of this as a tacit admission of its rightness...



 
« Last Edit: June 16, 2018, 05:55:15 PM by Brian Doyle »

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #302 on: June 16, 2018, 05:31:01 PM »

Offline Larry Trotter

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #303 on: June 16, 2018, 05:35:30 PM »
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Which is exactly what Otis Williams, who was standing to the west of the entrance railing, also said.

Are you seriously trying to tell us that the white/blonde haired woman identified as Sarah Stanton in a photo from 1962-4 could possibly be Prayer Person? Are you blind?

Of course no surprise at insults coming, again, from AlanFord.

You cannot place LeeHarveyOswald on the TSBD Elm St stairs/landing, in shadow, in the corner, as filmed at and/or very close to the time of the shooting that fatally wounded USP JohnKennedySr, and critically wounded TxG JohnConnallyJr.

For the record, I am not "telling" you anything. I have expressed my evidence/study/familiarity based conclusions about certain aspects of the events of 11/22/'63, through 11/24/'63.

As I can, and do, recall that weekend, that means familiarity exceeds 50 years.

 And, serious study exceeds 30 years.

But, I do not post and/or make statements about the event as if I were there and an eyewitness to the event itself, as well as an eyewitness to various statements/testimonial activities.

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #304 on: June 16, 2018, 05:38:03 PM »
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Of course no surprise at insults coming, again, from AlanFord.

You cannot place LeeHarveyOswald on the TSBD Elm St stairs/landing, in shadow, in the corner, as filmed at and/or very close to the time of the shooting that fatally wounded USP JohnKennedySr, and critically wounded TxG JohnConnallyJr.

For the record, I am not "telling" you anything. I have expressed my evidence/study/familiarity based conclusions about certain aspects of the events of 11/22/'63, through 11/24/'63.

As I can, and do, recall that weekend, that means familiarity exceeds 50 years.

 And, serious study exceeds 30 years.

But, I do not post and/or make statements about the event as if I were there and an eyewitness to the event itself, as well as an eyewitness to various statements/testimonial activities.


But you are an eyewitness to a photo of Sarah Stanton from 1962-4 and to the images of PrayerPerson in the Darnell film. Are you actually claiming that they could be one and the same person?

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #304 on: June 16, 2018, 05:38:03 PM »

Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #305 on: June 16, 2018, 05:42:34 PM »
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you give a huge shot in the arm to the LHO=PM theory by uncovering Sarah Stanton's encounter with LHO near the second floor lunchroom which supports what Carolyn Arnold was telling people back in 1978.

Alan:  You are ignoring that Kamp and the main Prayer Man posters are saying Carolyn Arnold lied about seeing Oswald in the 2nd floor lunch room...If you and Murphy say Oswald was in the 2nd floor lunch room at 12:25 and Carolyn Arnold was telling the truth then you are on our side and backing what we are posting...You seem to be having difficulty honestly responding to the fact the current Kamp-led Prayer Man supporters, including DiEugenio, are saying Arnold lied...

You operate by the very dishonest method of shouted propaganda and obnoxious 'gotcha' points instead of practicing the more credible intelligent discussion of facts...You just outright ignore the fact that Jake Sykes' avatar makes it more than clear that Oswald, when overlain on to Prayer Man, only takes up about 2/3rd's of Prayer Man's girth and therefore refutes Oswald being Prayer Man in one single visual example...Prayer Man has Sarah's wide hips and anyone who denies that is either unskilled at photo analysis or lying...

Prayer Man is also Sarah Stanton's known 5 foot 5 in height...(Which Alan repeatedly ignores)






Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #306 on: June 16, 2018, 05:45:58 PM »
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Alan:  You are ignoring that Kamp and the main Prayer Man posters are saying...

Going to stop you there, Brian. As long as you continue to ignore the basic elements of the original PrayerMan theory you will remain uncredible on this topic. Stop fighting the straw man and start studying up!

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #306 on: June 16, 2018, 05:45:58 PM »

Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #307 on: June 16, 2018, 05:48:57 PM »

Thank you Alan...We'll take your inability to honestly answer the serious points of evidence I posted as to Frazier's location as the concession it is...

Alan publicly refuses to answer Frazier clearly gesturing to his right when talking about speaking to Sarah in Darnell because he knows it is sound and he can't refute it...It is so sound he is forced to ignore and troll it...

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #307 on: June 16, 2018, 05:48:57 PM »

Online Brian Doyle

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #308 on: June 16, 2018, 05:53:26 PM »
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Going to stop you there, Brian. As long as you continue to ignore the basic elements of the original PrayerMan theory you will remain uncredible on this topic. Stop fighting the straw man and start studying up!

You're a fraud Alan...You have proven that you are dishonestly trying to seize the narrative with trolling points in order to avoid answering good evidence you know refutes you...

You never took on the Prayer Man people to correct them on the accuracy of their entries towards the original theory...You're a fraud who is trying to divert the subject to cheap contrivances instead of honestly answering the germane points...You show a good example of how the Prayer Man nuttery came about and is currently being supported...DiEugenio has some serious answering to do...

What the Prayer Man people run from like the devil and refuse to answer is the fact Frazier more than clearly describes the TIMING of Calvery's coming to the steps saying the president has been shot...Couch/Darnell proves the timing seen in that clip is exactly at the moment Calvery has finished her run and would be exactly when Frazier was looking at Sarah...There is no doubt Couch/Darnell shows Prayer Man and Frazier facing and looking at each other so that makes Prayer Man Sarah by Frazier's own words... "So Sarah and I, the lady I was standing by up at the top step back in the shadows, we looked at each other"...
 
« Last Edit: June 16, 2018, 06:22:16 PM by Brian Doyle »

Offline Larry Trotter

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #309 on: June 16, 2018, 07:15:40 PM »
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I'll take this as a concession that you are unfamiliar with the original PrayerMan theory and, in your strange obsession with a number of individuals elsewhere, have spent the last ages fighting a complete straw man.

You have quite the knack for destroying your own theories. First you rule out Sarah Stanton as PM by publishing a 1962-4 photo of her. Then you give a huge shot in the arm to the LHO=PM theory by uncovering Sarah Stanton's encounter with LHO near the second floor lunchroom which supports what Carolyn Arnold was telling people back in 1978.

I am quite sure that BrianDoyle can speak for himself. But, I do have to ask, what is "the original PrayerMan theory", and what is it based on? And, what is "a complete straw man" that you say he is "fighting"? If seeking StrawMan, I have to conclude that there is no need to look any further than PrayerMan.

Just how is SarahDeanStanton "ruled out" as the person represented by PrayerPersonImage? Considering a time frame is stated of 1962-1964 for the published photograph of SarahDeanStanton and her son, LarryDaniel, has to indicate an estimate, even though it does not rule out Ms Stanton.

Certainly, the PrayerPersonImage as viewed appears to represent someone shorter and stockier than 5'9'' tall slightly built LeeHarveyOswald.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2018, 07:17:51 PM by Larry Trotter »

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #309 on: June 16, 2018, 07:15:40 PM »

 

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