Prayer Woman

[Brian Doyle]

The story Carolyn Arnold told Anthony Summers in 1978 about seeing LHO in the lunchroom was 100% believed. If Stanton told family members she saw Oswald up there before the shooting, then that only strengthens the idea that the interrogation reports put words in LHO's mouth. He never said anything to Will Fritz about going up to the second floor for a coke AFTER the shooting.

This source of this rubbish is the uncredible Australian fantasist Greg Parker whose specialty is going deeply into the known assassination evidence and rewiring everything according to his fanciful imagination and then appealing to the public that he has figured out what really happened...Greg Parker is not a credible researcher and his "work" is just the silly efforts of a person who likes to take complex conspiracies apart and re-assemble them like a young boy who takes his dad's radio apart and can't put it back together...

The trouble with the rot Alan Ford is posting here is Carolyn Arnold was a real witness who was there at the time and did witness Oswald in the lunch room at 12:25...Alan Ford, Bart Kamp and the Prayer Man cult are just contemporary internet assassination "researchers" who speak with authority and assure us what they say is factual, but the truth is they are just a lunatic fringe with keyboard access who have grouped together under Parker's nuttery...Anyone can read Bart Kamp's postings and realize he is a punk who should not be taken seriously...He has the nerve to place himself over major witness Carolyn Arnold and tell people what she was really thinking and what really happened...Thanks to DiEugenio the research community has lost its mind and actually taken these kooks seriously and signed-on with their mangling of the evidence...Anyone who reads what Kamp offers will see it is just a parroting of Sean Murphy...The only reason Kamp takes the side of FBI and their altering of Carolyn Arnold's statement is because he knows that Oswald's being in the lunch room at 12:25 makes it impossible that he was Prayer Man...A simple-minded thread exists in Parker and Kamp's sickly spun web of needing to discredit any witnessing that threatens the Prayer Man theory...That is why Parker and Murphy attacked the 2nd floor lunch room encounter...It is because they were aware that when it was connected to Carolyn Arnold's witnessing it made it clear that Oswald was in the lunch room during the shooting for the 6 minutes in between...

Anyone with a skilled and honest approach to the witnessing will see subtle hints that Oswald told Fritz he was in the lunch room during the shooting...When Ball tried to get Fritz to say Oswald went upstairs to the lunch room to get the Coke Fritz wouldn't bite...Linguistic forensics pay very careful attention to wording...Fritz's answer to Ball was that Oswald just said he had a Coke...What Fritz was obviously indirectly saying to Ball there was Oswald said he was there the whole time...

In the Prayer Man cult's mind Sarah Stanton seeing Oswald by the lunch room; Carolyn Arnold seeing Oswald IN the lunch room; Fritz confirming his being in the lunch room and not going up there; Baker & Truly seeing Oswald there 6 minutes after Carolyn Arnold; and Oswald himself saying he was in the vicinity all adds up to everyone lying with Greg Parker figuring out how, and Oswald being Prayer Man, who has already been identified as Sarah Stanton with the Prayer Man cultists ignoring the evidence...

It angers me that Carolyn Arnold and Earl Golz couldn't be around to rip these Prayer Man people and Kamp a new one for insulting them this way...

Ford ignores that FBI potentially removed Stanton's story not because Oswald was on the front steps but because he was in the 2nd floor lunch room where they were already recorded as having erased Carolyn Arnold's account...

[Larry Trotter]

The more I look at this image the more I wonder...

Is PrayerPerson a slim man with his body facing forward (=south), his arms folded and his head turned a good bit to the left?

One giveaway here would be the white 'V' of his open shirt collar, which is not directly under his chin.


Place your finger over his supposed 'left arm/hand' (=the 'arm/hand' we see to his right as we look at the image) and you should see what I mean. Takes a bit of getting used to seeing as we've been thinking of this figure as 'Prayer Wo/Man' for so long.


I think that 'left arm/hand' may actually be something he's clutching in his right hand, which is tucked under his left elbow. This something (paper bag? newspaper?) is sticking out from the left side of his body.

As time goes by, it becomes more and more evident to me that PrayerPersonImage represents a female then employed at the TexasSchoolBookDepository. And, said image appears to be looking somewhat to her right, most likely just after, or before, a head turn.

It appears to me that PrayerPersonImage has a cup in hand, and standing at an angle that blocks view of her left forearm, but her purse is likely seen hanging tightly to said left forearm.

SarahDeanStanton stated that she could not see the President's limousine during the shooting, due to her location, and did not indicate it being blocked from view by some "little wall".

I see no way possible to confirm seeing, on the photo/film, any v-neck/open shirt collar on PrayerPersonImage.

I do hope that any claim that PrayerPersonImage represents a male, especially any claim that said image represents LeeHarveyOswald, is accompanied by something other than now deceased"witnesses are liars" as evidence.

[Alan Ford]

Anyone who reads what Kamp offers will see it is just a parroting of Sean Murphy...The only reason Kamp takes the side of FBI and their altering of Carolyn Arnold's statement is because he knows that Oswald's being in the lunch room at 12:25 makes it impossible that he was Prayer Man...

What are you talking about? Murphy sided 100% with Carolyn Arnold. His whole argument was that Oswald's being in the lunch room a few minutes before the assassination makes a joke of what the interrogation reports claimed he said.

It seems you've never even read the original Oswald Leaving TSBD? thread on the other forum. Uncredible!

[Alan Ford]

SarahDeanStanton stated that she could not see the President's limousine during the shooting, due to her location,

Which is exactly what Otis Williams, who was standing to the east of the entrance railing, also said.

Are you seriously trying to tell us that the white/blonde haired woman identified as Sarah Stanton in a photo from 1962-4 could possibly be Prayer Person? Are you blind?

[Brian Doyle]

Yes, but he's talking about an interaction with Sarah down at the bottom of the steps. Why did you leave this detail out? Do you lack quotation analysis skills?

No, you and Barry are wrong...Go back and listen again...Because the Prayer Man nuts are so desperate to focus on specks that they can use to ignore the rest of the overwhelming evidence they are assuming Frazier is talking about walking down the steps to the bottom step in order to encounter Gloria Calvery...He's not...What he is saying there is he walked up to the edge of the landing by the first step down...Proof of this is when he describes encountering Calvery he then tells of turning to Sarah up on the landing in order to absorb what Calvery had said...Frazier doesn't say "I walked back up to the landing and then confronted Sarah"...Watch the video...Frazier goes from encountering Calvery to turning to Sarah on the landing immediately...That is because he is on the landing the whole time...The testimony says Shelley & Lovelady spoke to Calvery before leaving the steps...Not Shelley, Lovelady and Frazier...

Sorry Alan but anyone who had a skilled and competent grasp of the evidence and detective work would realize that for Frazier to be on the bottom step while encountering Calvery would require him to be caught in Darnell going back up to the landing...There isn't enough time for Frazier to travel down to the bottom step and back up and the only reason you are not realizing this is because your circuits are corrupted by desperation to bend everything towards Prayer Man...This is good evidence of how the Prayer Man theory came about and the minds that created it and how...

You tried to seize on this in order to ignore the nod to the right Frazier made that you omitted in your response...

[Alan Ford]

No, you and Barry are wrong...Go back and listen again...Because the Prayer Man nuts are so desperate to focus on specks that they can use to ignore the rest of the overwhelming evidence they are assuming Frazier is talking about walking down the steps to the bottom step in order to encounter Gloria Calvery...He's not...What he is saying there is he walked up to the edge of the landing by the first step down...Proof of this is when he describes encountering Calvery he then tells of turning to Sarah up on the landing in order to absorb what Calvery had said...Frazier doesn't say "I walked back up to the landing and then confronted Sarah"...Watch the video...Frazier goes from encountering Calvery to turning to Sarah on the landing immediately...That is because he is on the landing the whole time...The testimony says Shelley & Lovelady spoke to Calvery before leaving the steps...Not Shelley, Lovelady and Frazier...

Sorry Alan but anyone who had a skilled and competent grasp of the evidence and detective work would realize that for Frazier to be on the bottom step while encountering Calvery would require him to be caught in Darnell going back up to the landing...There isn't enough time for Frazier to travel down to the bottom step and back up and the only reason you are not realizing this is because your circuits are corrupted by desperation to bend everything towards Prayer Man...This is good evidence of how the Prayer Man theory came about and the minds that created it and how...

You tried to seize on this in order to ignore the nod to the right Frazier made that you omitted in your response...

Here is what Frazier actually says: "I had walked down and was standing in front of the first step". A different scene to what Darnell shows. Stop wriggling!

[Brian Doyle]

What are you talking about? Murphy sided 100% with Carolyn Arnold. His whole argument was that Oswald's being in the lunch room a few minutes before the assassination makes a joke of what the interrogation reports claimed he said.

It seems you've never even read the original Oswald Leaving TSBD? thread on the other forum. Uncredible!

Alan gets out of town quicker than Sean Murphy before he has to answer the entire post and all the evidence in it...

The Prayer Man cult has no problem with Murphy disappearing in 2013...The same year that Frazier came out in public with his identifying the person next to him as being Sarah Stanton...What a coincidence!

No credible assassination theorist has ever just disappeared...Murphy scooted because he knew he couldn't answer to his BS once non-cultists caught up to it...

Moderated debate would say "Wait a minute Mr Ford...Not so fast...Answer the rest of what he said"...Refusal or dishonest answers would then result in penalties...

[Alan Ford]

Alan gets out of town quicker than Sean Murphy before he has to answer the entire post and all the evidence in it...

The Prayer Man cult has no problem with Murphy disappearing in 2013...The same year that Frazier came out in public with his identifying the person next to him as being Sarah Stanton...What a coincidence!

No credible assassination theorist has ever just disappeared...Murphy scooted because he knew he couldn't answer to his BS once non-cultists caught up to it...

Moderated debate would say "Wait a minute Mr Ford...Not so fast...Answer the rest of what he said"...Refusal or dishonest answers would then result in penalties...

Who cares about the history behind what you call the 'Prayer Man cult'? A theory was developed back in 2013 and you have just exposed the fact that you're pig ignorant of one of its major elements (Carolyn Arnold seeing Oswald in the lunchroom). Sad!

[Brian Doyle]

Here is what Frazier actually says: "I had walked down and was standing in front of the first step". A different scene to what Darnell shows. Stop wriggling!

You are deliberately not answering the rest of what I said...You're not credible...

Frazier did not have time to make that trip and get back up to the landing in Darnell...

Yes, a different scene than what Darnell shows...You Prayer Man crazies are so divorced from reality, and so self-deluded by your lies, that you make fools of yourselves by not realizing that YES the Darnell film shows reality and proves my point...That Frazier isn't seen going back up to the landing like would be required if he had walked down to the bottom step...Your logic is so perverted that you strongly make my point for me yet phrase it as if it backed you...

The "first step" Frazier is referencing is the first step down from the landing...You are deliberately ignoring that the video shows Frazier saying he immediately looked at Sarah after hearing this from Calvery...If Frazier was at the bottom step he couldn't immediately turn to Sarah like he says...He would have had to walk back up to the landing to do so...

You and Barry use references to Frazier's actions in the video to make your bogus points but ignore those same clear actions when they prove what I am saying...

Twice now you have avoided addressing how Frazier nods to his right and shifts his eyes rightward when referring to Sarah...

[Alan Ford]

You are deliberately not answering the rest of what I said...You're not credible...

Frazier did not have time to make that trip and get back up to the landing in Darnell...

Yes, a different scene than what Darnell shows...You Prayer Man crazies are so divorced from reality, and so self-deluded by your lies, that you make fools of yourselves by not realizing that YES the Darnell film shows reality and proves my point...That Frazier isn't seen going back up to the landing like would be required if he had walked down to the bottom step...Your logic is so perverted that you strongly make my point for me yet phrase it as if it backed you...

The "first step" Frazier is referencing is the first step down from the landing...You are deliberately ignoring that the video shows Frazier saying he immediately looked at Sarah after hearing this from Calvery...If Frazier was at the bottom step he couldn't immediately turn to Sarah like he says...He would have had to walk back up to the landing to do so...

You and Barry use references to Frazier's actions in the video to make your bogus points but ignore those same clear actions when they prove what I am saying...

Twice now you have avoided addressing how Frazier nods to his right and shifts his eyes rightward when referring to Sarah...

No, I've quoted him accurately which you didn't do. When are you going to deal with Barry's point that twice Frazier gestures left with his left hand when mentioning Sarah at the top of the steps as the motorcade was passing? How many more times are you going to avoid addressing it?