Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
0 Members and 6 Guests are viewing this topic.

Author Topic: Prayer Woman  (Read 355805 times)

Offline Barry Pollard

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 600
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #300 on: June 28, 2018, 12:58:40 AM »
...

SOMEONE SHOW ME! Draw an X on the spot in Stancak's entrance where you think Lovelady is in either of these Wiegman frames. That way, I can finally understand how the shadow will run down his right side!

OR! If the answer is------------Stancak's placed the edge of the shadow in the wrong place!  >:( -------------then show us where you think it SHOULD go!

 Thumb1:

Seconded and nicely put, Andrej, Chris,  please help us out and if of you can pin down Lovelady's leaning position on the step from the images.
Does Reese move directly up into BL's position in Darnell? I think she does more or less.

Offline Alan Ford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2146
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #301 on: June 28, 2018, 01:51:29 AM »
Sun, sun, sun, here it comes...


Offline Alan Ford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2146
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #302 on: June 28, 2018, 02:33:15 AM »
In Altgens 6 we see Lovelady...



? and behind him the vertical strip from the door



Let's apply this to Stancak's overhead model to get a sense of Altgens's line of sight into the entrance area:



Thus, if Altgens had taken his photo at the time of the Darnell frame Stancak is working from, he would only have captured Frazier from the left shoulder down.

Now! Altgens 6 corresponds with elevated Lovelady in Wiegman:



So-----------------how exactly do people arguing for a shadow from the west pillar on Lovelady propose to place him within the west pillar's shadow? Where in the picture below would you put him?



 
« Last Edit: June 28, 2018, 03:36:40 AM by Alan Ford »

Offline Ray Mitcham

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1045
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #303 on: June 28, 2018, 06:36:01 PM »
I agree that the azimuth calculations are trivial, but there is a lot of indicative reliance on sunlight shadow calculations relative to the TSBD Bldg Elm St entrance portal and/or the occupants at about 12:01pm/01:00pm CST (12:01/13:00) on 11/22/'63. Therefor, my questions are, as stated, an effort for, hopefully, some discussion clarification indicative of actual assertion(s) ramification(s).

The azimuth of the sun is not trivial if you are trying to work out the angles of shadows caused by the entrance columns. The sun's elevation is important for calculating the shadow cast by the horizontal lintel over the entrance. If you can't see that I can't be bothered explaining any more. It's like casting pearls before swine.
as it happens, Stancek has the shadows exactly right in his creations.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2018, 06:43:03 PM by Ray Mitcham »

Offline Barry Pollard

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 600
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #304 on: June 28, 2018, 07:42:25 PM »
I cannot see how Andej might claim that's real shadow on BL without moving his own shadow line, that's why it's so on-topic.
Also, we have to find the blow up of Lovelady in Hughes because in it he actually pops out and then back in the shadows's true posion close to the west wall and everyone who's seen it assumes Lovelady moved well to his left before Wiegman reacted.

Offline Barry Pollard

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 600
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #305 on: June 28, 2018, 07:50:54 PM »
I was reminded of this poor chap.

Probably just following his wife or friend back to the TSBD after she took off running.

Offline Larry Trotter

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 445
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #306 on: June 28, 2018, 07:56:37 PM »
The azimuth of the sun is not trivial if you are trying to work out the angles of shadows caused by the entrance columns. The sun's elevation is important for calculating the shadow cast by the horizontal lintel over the entrance. If you can't see that I can't be bothered explaining any more. It's like casting pearls before swine.
as it happens, Stancek has the shadows exactly right in his creations.

It appears to me that the sunlight angles are important to someone wishing to qualify mannequin placement on a virtual landing/stairway portal. But, azimuth calculations are trivial to most of us that study the reliable provable evidence indicative of said portal occupants as the area was filmed. To state Stancek has "the shadows exactly right in his creations", can only be a conclusion, nothing more. I certainly question his "insertions" of images, especially those not seen otherwise, and as well his "to scale measurements".
And, I do not recall ever stating that sunlight origin calculations had no bearing on shadow length and/or shadow angle. What I have not seen is, any calculations allowing for the angle of the TSBD Building and/or entrance portal.
Most important though, when you say that if I can't see something you state, you can't be bothered anymore, and "It's like casting pearls before swine", tell me, exactly what are you saying? Are you indicating something negative about my character?
« Last Edit: June 28, 2018, 08:09:15 PM by Larry Trotter »

Offline Barry Pollard

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 600
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #307 on: June 28, 2018, 08:10:07 PM »
Larry do you have the full stabilzed Darnell footage?
Concentrate on the east corner at the very end, there's some noise there, could be someone tucked out of sight, or not...
That's the only "insertion" you're talking about correct? In that same general area Andrej sees a small head and shoulders in a frame or two.

Offline Barry Pollard

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 600
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #308 on: June 28, 2018, 08:56:51 PM »
Alan, Page 182 of Oswald leaving TSBD thread, Thomas Graves posted the Hughes gif.
Might be another one even more zoomed in somewhere, that's what I remember anyway.

Offline Alan Ford

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2146
Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #309 on: June 28, 2018, 10:06:22 PM »
Alan, Page 182 of Oswald leaving TSBD thread, Thomas Graves posted the Hughes gif.
Might be another one even more zoomed in somewhere, that's what I remember anyway.

Here we are, Barry. Seems to be shielding his eyes from the sun then going back into the shadows.



I'd always just assumed it was Lovelady, but now----------with the west pillar shadow in Wiegman ruled out-----------I'm not so sure...

Maybe it's Sarah Stanton!

 

Mobile View