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Author Topic: Prayer Woman  (Read 226733 times)

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2640 on: February 13, 2019, 08:21:09 PM »
Now! Most of the attention these past few days has for obvious reasons focused on the bit about Mr Oswald going "outside to watch P. Parade".

But! The bit before that-------"He went to 2nd floor to get Coca Cola to eat with lunch and returned to 1st floor to eat lunch"-------is in its own way just as significant. Why, oh why, I hear you ask!

Simple----------it kills dead the notion that Mr Oswald himself confirmed the 2nd floor lunchroom encounter with Officer Baker.

Think about it, friends! The Hosty note makes it plainer than plainest day that Mr Oswald's claim per the Bookhout solo-run report------------

Oswald stated that on November 22, 1963, at the time of the search of the Texas School Book Depository building by Dallas police officers, he was on the second floor of said building, having just purchased a Coca-cola form the soft-drink machine, at which time a police officer came into the room with pistol drawn and asked him if he worked there.

------------is a claim that Mr Oswald never made!

Think about it! For Mr Oswald to have said this would amount to the following piece of gibberish:

OSWALD: "At the time of the search of the building by police officers I was on the second floor, having just purchased a Coca Cola from the machine. A police officer came in but my boss told him I was alright. Then I brought the coke back down to the first floor to eat my lunch."
FRITZ: "OK, what did you do next?"
OSWALD: "Then I went outside to watch the Presidential parade."

Went outside to watch the Presidential Parade------Parade!! not 'excitement' or 'commotion', but Parade!!--------after being challenged by a police officer with pistol drawn???

  :D
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 08:24:40 PM by Alan Ford »

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2640 on: February 13, 2019, 08:21:09 PM »

Online Brian Doyle

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Prayer Woman
« Reply #2641 on: February 13, 2019, 08:42:32 PM »
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Buell certainly said that Oswald left by the rear entrance (in the 2002 C-Span interview which is readily available online). Some people here would call you a fabricator rather than revisit that interview.

Thanks...It starts at time mark 12:50 of Part II of Frazier's 2002 interview with Gary Mack...

Mack:   Have you heard subsequently how he left the building?

Frazier:  When we were outside the building before we'd gone in...I remember Lee coming from the, ahh, dock area...And walk up the street beside the Texas School Book Depository building...And there were so many things going on...And I saw him as he walked up...And he went across Houston Street...And I thought he may have been going to get him a sandwich or something...So I really didn't think anything about it...And I lost him in the crowd and I don't know what happened from there...

Mack:  How long after the assassination do you think this was?

Frazier:  Oh probably, 5 to 10 minutes probably...

Mack:  So you remember seeing him briefly coming down Houston Street along the side of the building?

Frazier:  Yes...

Mack:  So that told you that he must have gone out the back door by the loading dock?

Frazier:  Yes...By the loading dock...That's exactly right...

Mack:  And did you see him cross Houston Street?

Frazier:  Ahh, he crossed Houston Street and then started across Elm St...And I turned because someone said something to me...And I turned to answer them and then when I turned back and looked in that direction he was gone...

Mack:  Could he have come out the front door of the Depository?

Frazier  No...

Mack:  No...So how far away from him do you think you were when you saw him?

Frazier:  The closest I got to him...When he was walking up...Along side the Texas School Book Depository...Coming from the dock area...Was probably 10-12 feet...

Mack:  Do you remember anything about him?...Did he look...

Frazier:  No...He didn't look any different or act any different then he <interruption> did...There was so many people and so much chaos and everything all around by then...That I thought maybe he was just going somewhere to get him a sandwich...

Mack:  And how was he dressed?...Do you remember?...Was he in his T-shirt or did he have a shirt on?...

Frazier:  Ahh, he had his jacket on... 

Mack:  He had his jacket...

Frazier:   He had his jacket on that day...

Mack:  Let me regroup here...So at some point you finally went back in the building...And then went downstairs into the basement...To eat your lunch...You were down in the basement when some investigators...Police or whatever came in...

Frazier:  Yes...
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 08:45:11 PM by Brian Doyle »

Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2642 on: February 13, 2019, 10:03:00 PM »
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Tim:   I gave a lengthy reply to this that showed Oswald left by the rear exit 10 minutes after the shots but it was deleted...

Nothing that you could have said in that lengthy reply would have made the signed sworn affidavit of Wesley Frazier go away.

"I did not see Lee anymore after about 11:00 AM today, and at that time, we were both working, and we were on the first floor."

Wesley Frazier
SUBSCRIBED AND SWORN BEFORE ME THIS 22 DAY OF November A.D. 1963
/s/Mary Rattan
Notary Public, Dallas County, Texas

You cannot dismiss that in favour of a 40 year old recollection.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 10:04:39 PM by Tim Nickerson »

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2642 on: February 13, 2019, 10:03:00 PM »

Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2643 on: February 13, 2019, 10:07:27 PM »
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Nice dodging of the evidence-connected detail Tim...What is your opinion on my claim that Kamp and the Prayer Man cultists are ignoring the obvious chronology established in Fritz's interview where Oswald's locating of himself starts at the lunch room encounter and any mention of being outside is minutes later when he left the Depository?...It is highly dishonest for them to try to say these outside with Shelley or watching the parade claims are during the shooting...

Any attempt to create a chronology based on notes or reports on what Oswald said during his interrogations and interviews is a fool's errand. Both you and the Prayer Man clique have done just that. You both are so desperate to establish an alibi for Oswald that you've abandoned all reason in the process. And you both laughingly declare success, when in reality, you both fail miserably. To establish an alibi, not only do you need to present evidence that Oswald was somewhere other than the sniper's nest at the time of the shooting at the time, you need to deal with evidence that indicates that he was not where you claim that he was. Neither you nor the Prayer Man clique can do so with any credibility because you dismiss sworn statements and official documents and instead embrace decades old recollections and third person accounts.

I tend to believe that Sarah Stanton was the heavy set person standing in the shadow on the steps of the building. I'm 90 % certain that it was her. However, the argument that Oswald was in the Second floor lunchroom at the time of the shooting has no real basis of support. That's why Sean Murphy had to come up with Oswald as Prayer Man. As he said on the ED Forum back in Sept of 2013, "The Second floor lunchroom story doesn't exonerate Oswald,..it cruelly robs him of his 100% watertight alibi."

Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2644 on: February 13, 2019, 10:16:09 PM »
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Friends, I've been reading back through the momentous "Oswald Leaving TSBD?" thread at the Education Forum!

On 21 August 2013, Mr Sean Murphy wrote the following:

Carolyn Arnold insisted--to Anthony Summers, Earl Golz, Gary Mack and others--that she spotted Oswald in the second-floor lunchroom several minutes before the assassination.

Murphy nailed it Thumb1:

About a quarter of an hour before the assassination, she said in 1978, "I went into the lunchroom on the second floor for a moment..."--Not In Your Lifetime, By Anthony Summers, pg 92.

Murphy nailed it, did he?  :D

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2644 on: February 13, 2019, 10:16:09 PM »

Online Brian Doyle

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Prayer Woman
« Reply #2645 on: February 13, 2019, 10:29:08 PM »
I just got a response from NBC on my formal request for access to the Darnell and Wiegman films...I believe they have the Darnell and Wiegman originals but are requiring a serious production application to meet eligibility requirements and approval for licensing...

Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2646 on: February 13, 2019, 10:33:21 PM »
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I just got a response from NBC on my formal request for access to the Darnell and Wiegman films...I believe they have the Darnell and Wiegman originals but are requiring a serious production application to meet eligibility requirements and approval for licensing...

Good on you for trying. Either they have them or they do not. Did they even say that they had them?

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2646 on: February 13, 2019, 10:33:21 PM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2647 on: February 13, 2019, 10:38:29 PM »
The sudden frequency with which Mr Nickerson has been posting on this thread over the last few days tells us how completely unconcerned he is about this latest development.

We look forward with breathless excitement to Chapter 67 of Gullible's Travels. Should be up within the next few minutes, folks! :D

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2647 on: February 13, 2019, 10:38:29 PM »

Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2648 on: February 13, 2019, 10:44:23 PM »
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The sudden frequency with which Mr Nickerson has been posting on this thread over the last few days tells us how completely unconcerned he is about this latest development.

We look forward with breathless excitement to Chapter 67 of Gullible's Travels. Should be up within the next few minutes, folks! :D

Yes, it's been keeping awake at night.  :(  Whatever shall I do? Maybe I should start drinking again. Do you think that'll help?

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2649 on: February 13, 2019, 10:48:54 PM »
Friends, the fact that the alleged Arnold & Stanton sighting of Mr Oswald in the second-floor lunchroom before the P. Parade tells the same story that the Hosty note has Mr Oswald tell is of no moment. It was either one of those super-lucky guesses that happen all the time to sociopathic fantasists, or the two ladies simply got the necessary information directly from Mr Oswald's ghost by attending a local seance. Nothing to see here!

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2649 on: February 13, 2019, 10:48:54 PM »

 

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