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Author Topic: Prayer Woman  (Read 226678 times)

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2630 on: February 13, 2019, 05:56:40 PM »
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Buell Frazier:   "Oswald never left the Depository by the front door"...

That sounds like another Brian Doyle fabrication.

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2630 on: February 13, 2019, 05:56:40 PM »

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2631 on: February 13, 2019, 06:01:24 PM »
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Jim and Sandy Larsen are saying Kamp deserves praise for presenting now 2 or 3 solid examples of Oswald being out front during the motorcade...Never mind that the real evidence shows the opposite...When you do several years of hard work to show the evidence actually shows the opposite and shows Oswald was in the 2nd floor lunch room Jim and Sandy ignore it and repeat their Kamp claims...


Offline Tim Nickerson

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2632 on: February 13, 2019, 06:48:56 PM »
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If anyone wants to see a good example of dirty players in action I advise them to go read the Education Forum thread on Kamp's Hosty notes...It is being led by lynch mob ring-leader Jim DiEugenio and is a good example of organized dishonesty and shameful deceit...

Jim and Sandy Larsen are saying Kamp deserves praise for presenting now 2 or 3 solid examples of Oswald being out front during the motorcade...Never mind that the real evidence shows the opposite...When you do several years of hard work to show the evidence actually shows the opposite and shows Oswald was in the 2nd floor lunch room Jim and Sandy ignore it and repeat their Kamp claims...

We have adequately shown that "Out with Bill Shelley in front" comes from a time period where Oswald is describing leaving the building several minutes after the shots and is therefore not describing being out front during the shots as they are claiming...The evidence scofflaws DiEugenio and Larsen ignore this and claim it anyway while banning anyone who disagrees...

We have also adequately proven Kamp's latest offering of deception in the form of the Hosty notes is a direct reflection of that same interview and therefore the same internal chronology of that interview...Hosty is covering the same interview, so when he writes "Then went outside to watch the presidential parade" he is also referring to a time period that has to be many minutes after the time of Prayer Man being seen in Darnell...The Prayer Man people know this but are ignoring it...That means they are deliberately lying about evidence and joining Kamp in his level of corrupted, delinquent research all with the enthusiastic support of DiEugenio...

The particular murder the Prayer Man people are trying to get away with at present is the ignoring of Carolyn Arnold's witnessing of Oswald in the 2nd floor lunch room at 12:25...Carolyn Arnold is a key conspiracy witness whom Kamp and Jim D are now disallowing her important witnessing so they can mangle the evidence and force their already-disproven Prayer Man claim to work...You can't do that and still be a credible researcher but there they are doing it and getting away with it by numbers...Very simply Carolyn Arnold's witnessing puts the kaibosh on any faulty claims that Oswald was in the Prayer Man spot so they ignore it and hope you don't notice...If you dare mention this inconvenient witnessing you'll be piled-on and defamed by dirty Jim D and ushered off the site in order to enforce Bart Kamp's taking over of the research internet...Carolyn Arnold's very real witnessing means Oswald can't be on the front steps so the Kamp mob does what they do with anyone who contradicts their crazy evidence re-working, they attack her and dismiss her witnessing - even though she was there at the time and was a main witness...Nobody points-out that they are joining Von Pein and the Lone Nutters by doing this...Both of them stridently deny Carolyn Arnold's witnessing in order to maintain their claims...

Ray Mitcham has quoted Gary Savage's book...He quotes a line that makes it sound like Baker & Truly saw Oswald as they immediately went inside...The Prayer Man mob is now hoping that you won't notice that they are no longer offering their previous uproar of Bart Kamp denial over Baker & Truly going inside...For years now Kamp and Larsen have been claiming that Baker never went inside...And they got warlord Jim D's stamp of approval on it to boot...Now all of a sudden when Ray presents quotes that need Baker to have rushed right in to encounter Oswald they hope you don't notice that this previous position for years that Baker never went inside is suddenly dropped and the Prayer Man cultists have no problem with Baker going in as long as it supports their fantasy claims and evidence-bending...Ray asks you to disengage your mind and not notice that there were many people in the lobby by that time who would have witnessed a Depository employee having a gun aimed at him...Never mind common sense reality when you are entertaining Prayer Man fantasy...

But Ray's quote does contain something interesting that is of value...Baker says clearly that the steps were crowded and it took him a while to get through the crowd in order to go inside...A responsible researcher would not miss this valuable quote and how it affects the timing...

How is what they're doing over there any different than what you've been doing here? Both cases are weak in the extreme and the hype is the same.

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2632 on: February 13, 2019, 06:48:56 PM »

Online Brian Doyle

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Prayer Woman
« Reply #2633 on: February 13, 2019, 06:54:43 PM »
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How is what they're doing over there any different than what you've been doing here? Both cases are weak in the extreme and the hype is the same.

Nice dodging of the evidence-connected detail Tim...What is your opinion on my claim that Kamp and the Prayer Man cultists are ignoring the obvious chronology established in Fritz's interview where Oswald's locating of himself starts at the lunch room encounter and any mention of being outside is minutes later when he left the Depository?...It is highly dishonest for them to try to say these outside with Shelley or watching the parade claims are during the shooting...

I'm ignoring Iacoletti's trolling...
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 07:00:28 PM by Brian Doyle »

Online Brian Doyle

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Prayer Woman
« Reply #2634 on: February 13, 2019, 07:04:06 PM »
Jim D thinks about this forum a lot:

Quote
But I still think you and he belong at Duncan's.  That is more like WWE.  We are more evidence based here.

People were focused on JFK but it isn't honest to ignore the numerous examples of portal occupants naming all the other portal occupants in numerous examples of testimony, witnessings,  and police interviews...

Jim's contemptuous ignoring of Davidson's image of a woman's face on Prayer Man is an example of his strict "evidence-based" discipline?
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 07:05:35 PM by Brian Doyle »

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Prayer Woman
« Reply #2634 on: February 13, 2019, 07:04:06 PM »

Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2635 on: February 13, 2019, 07:10:29 PM »
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Tim:   I gave a lengthy reply to this that showed Oswald left by the rear exit 10 minutes after the shots but it was deleted...


Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2636 on: February 13, 2019, 07:12:00 PM »
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Nice dodging of the evidence-connected detail Tim...What is your opinion on my claim that Kamp and the Prayer Man cultists are ignoring the obvious chronology established in Fritz's interview where Oswald's locating of himself starts at the lunch room encounter and any mention of being outside is minutes later when he left the Depository?...It is highly dishonest for them to try to say these outside with Shelley or watching the parade claims are during the shooting...

I'm ignoring Iacoletti's trolling...

Of course you are.  You want to continue to lie about the evidence without being accountable.

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2636 on: February 13, 2019, 07:12:00 PM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2637 on: February 13, 2019, 07:15:18 PM »
Friends, I've been reading back through the momentous "Oswald Leaving TSBD?" thread at the Education Forum!

On 21 August 2013, Mr Sean Murphy wrote the following:

Carolyn Arnold insisted--to Anthony Summers, Earl Golz, Gary Mack and others--that she spotted Oswald in the second-floor lunchroom several minutes before the assassination.

Now put the case that Arnold's claim is true and then read the following section of FBI agents Bookhout & Hosty's co-written first interrogation report (11/22/63):

"Oswald stated that he went to lunch at approximately noon and he claimed he ate his lunch on the first floor in the lunchroom; however he went to the second floor where the Coca-Cola machine was located and obtained a bottle of Coca-Cola for his lunch. Oswald claimed to be on the first floor when President John F. Kennedy passed this building."

The startling possibility arises that Bookhout and Hosty are giving Oswald's three claims in simple chronological sequence:

    I went to lunch in the domino room
    Then I went up to the second-floor lunchroom and bought a coke
    Then I went back down to the first floor, which is where I was when the President passed the building

Claim 1 comes with a precise location--the domino room--and is supported by Oswald's noticing two black co-workers passing through (i.e. Norman & Jarman coming in the back entrance of the first floor and proceeding across to the freight elevator)

Claim 2 comes with a precise location--the second-floor lunchroom--and is supported by Carolyn Arnold's recollection

Claim 3 comes without any precise location, a fact which just may be explained by the utterly calamitous location of the Prayer Man figure in Wiegman & Darnell.

Did Lee Oswald offer Will Fritz a very precisely localised Claim 3 and were the details of this alibi-sealing claim suppressed?



Mr Murphy's question was answered this week with a resounding Yes:



Murphy nailed it Thumb1:

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2637 on: February 13, 2019, 07:15:18 PM »

Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: Prayer Woman
« Reply #2638 on: February 13, 2019, 07:21:24 PM »
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Tim:   I gave a lengthy reply to this that showed Oswald left by the rear exit 10 minutes after the shots but it was deleted...

Buell certainly said that Oswald left by the rear entrance (in the 2002 C-Span interview which is readily available online). Some people here would call you a fabricator rather than revisit that interview.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 07:23:39 PM by Bill Chapman »

Online Brian Doyle

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Prayer Woman
« Reply #2639 on: February 13, 2019, 07:58:08 PM »
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    Then I went back down to the first floor, which is where I was when the President passed the building

Which ignores that Oswald could not get back upstairs to get to the 2nd floor lunch room encounter without being seen and without being out of breath...

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Prayer Woman
« Reply #2639 on: February 13, 2019, 07:58:08 PM »

 

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