Was the Rifle that Lt. Day carried out of the TSBD the same as in evidence?

[Mark Ulrik]

A lot of detail in the DP images is washed out by sunlight, but this mark (near the edge of a less exposed area) seems a fairy good match to the NARA images.

[Benjamin Cole]

MU-

In the excellent images you have provided...it appears the slots in the two screws are not aligned in the same way. Especially the bottom screw. Not sure what this means, if anything.

[Charles Collins]

Robert Frazier testified about finding a significant scrape on the rear of the scope:

Mr. FRAZIER - No; I do not. However, on the back end of the scope tube there is a rather severe scrape which was on this weapon when we received it in the laboratory, in which some of the metal has been removed, and the scope tube could have been bent or damaged.

Has anyone found that scrape in any photos of the rifle? If so, is there a photo that was taken earlier than that photo that indicates that the scrape wasn’t there at that point in time? I am trying find any evidence that might indicate when that scrape on the scope happened. Can it be determined from any of the photos if the scrape was it there (or not there) when the rifle was found on the sixth floor of the TSBD?

I think that a definitive answer to this question might help with the question asked in the title of this thread. And also help with answering the question of what condition the scope might have been on 11/22/63.

Thanks!

[Mark Ulrik]

Robert Frazier testified about finding a significant scrape on the rear of the scope:

Mr. FRAZIER - No; I do not. However, on the back end of the scope tube there is a rather severe scrape which was on this weapon when we received it in the laboratory, in which some of the metal has been removed, and the scope tube could have been bent or damaged.

Has anyone found that scrape in any photos of the rifle? If so, is there a photo that was taken earlier than that photo that indicates that the scrape wasn’t there at that point in time? I am trying find any evidence that might indicate when that scrape on the scope happened. Can it be determined from any of the photos if the scrape was it there (or not there) when the rifle was found on the sixth floor of the TSBD?

I think that a definitive answer to this question might help with the question asked in the title of this thread. And also help with answering the question of what condition the scope might have been on 11/22/63.

Thanks!

Has to be this one.



It's easy enough to see in the photos of Day holding the rifle up for the press.



The question is whether the light spot in the same place in Alyea is the scrape or just a random reflection.

[Charles Collins]

Has to be this one.



It's easy enough to see in the photos of Day holding the rifle up for the press.



The question is whether the light spot in the same place in Alyea is the scrape or just a random reflection.

Thank you very much Mark. That’s a very interesting scrape. It looks to me like the Alyea image is showing the same scrape.

In trying to imagine how this might have occurred, my best guess is when LHO reportedly buried the rifle before/after the Walker attempt. If I remember correctly, it was supposed to have been near some railroad tracks. There is typically a lot of gravel used in railroad tracks. Gravel or some similar rough stone would be much harder than the aluminum alloy used for the scope. And so that might be when the scrape happened. LHO could have been excited enough to have hurriedly laid the rifle down onto a rock or some gravel. Either laying it down onto or picking it up off of a rough rock(s) haphazardly could have caused that scrape in my opinion.

[Mark Ulrik]

MU-

In the excellent images you have provided...it appears the slots in the two screws are not aligned in the same way. Especially the bottom screw. Not sure what this means, if anything.

This sort of stuff can probably be explained by the rifle having been taken apart and put back together again an unknown number of times. The head alignment can be somewhat unpredictable, I suspect, because it depends on how the screw connects with the wood (which can vary with age, wear, whether the screw has been oiled, etc.). Not to mention on how tightly you tighten the screw.

[Mark Ulrik]

Btw, I don't know how many are aware of this, but NARA in 2023 produced a set of 33 UHQ photos of CE 139 that is available for download (they are the ones numbered 13-45). Included are also 12 HQ photos from 2013.

https://catalog.archives.gov/id/305134?objectPage=45

[Mark Ulrik]

Thank you very much Mark. That’s a very interesting scrape. It looks to me like the Alyea image is showing the same scrape.

In trying to imagine how this might have occurred, my best guess is when LHO reportedly buried the rifle before/after the Walker attempt. If I remember correctly, it was supposed to have been near some railroad tracks. There is typically a lot of gravel used in railroad tracks. Gravel or some similar rough stone would be much harder than the aluminum alloy used for the scope. And so that might be when the scrape happened. LHO could have been excited enough to have hurriedly laid the rifle down onto a rock or some gravel. Either laying it down onto or picking it up off of a rough rock(s) haphazardly could have caused that scrape in my opinion.

Sounds plausible. Btw, and I'm just speculating freely here, I've always wondered if our sixth floor shooter knocked the scope out of alignment when he ditched the weapon, maybe on purpose, to sow the seed of doubt in the minds of our CT friends potential jurors.

Scrape not visible even in the best available scans of the backyard photos (but general likeness still pretty good).