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Author Topic: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?  (Read 4523 times)

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2018, 03:53:02 PM »
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As I figured, you have NONE. No surprise there since the evidence shows that Day lifted nothing off of CE 139.

No Rob...  As usual you refuse to accept information and believe BS....

I could cite you chapter and verse that reveals the FACT that Day lifted that smudge from the wooden foregrip of the carcano while he was examining the rifle in the TSBD at about 1:45 that afternoon...and Tom Alyea is on record as watching detective Day lift the smudge that later became CE 634 .....  But to present that again would be a waste of my time just as our debate about the clip being ejected like the clip from an M-1 was a waste of time ....

You will accept BS if it fits with some theory you like.....while ignoring solid facts.

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2018, 03:53:02 PM »


Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2018, 06:55:52 PM »
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As I figured, you have NONE. No surprise there since the evidence shows that Day lifted nothing off of CE 139.

Tom Alyea wrote:

Shortly after we arrived back on the 6th floor, Deputy Eugene Boone located the assassin's rifle almost completely hidden by some overhanging boxes near the stairwell. I filmed it as it was found. In my shot, the figure of Captain Fritz is standing within the enclosure next to the rifle. He knew then that the possibility of a fire fight with the sniper had greatly diminished. He dispatched one of his men to go down and call for the crime lab. About fifteen minutes later, Lt. Day and Studebaker arrived. Still pictures were taken of the positioning of the rifle, then Lt. Day slid it out from its hiding place and held it up for all of us to see. The world has seen my shot of this many times. Lt. Day immediately turned toward the window behind him and started dusting the weapon for fingerprints. Day was still within the enclosure formed by the surrounding boxes. I filmed him lifting prints from the rifle. He lifted them off with scotch tape and placed them on little white cards.


We know that only partial prints were found on the rifle's trigger guard and Day did not lift those partial prints...He merely placed cellophane tape on them to protect them from being damaged before he could examine them in the police lab.  So that cannot be what Alyea saw Day lift and place on white card......

What print do we have that might be the one that Alyea saw Day lift??

The only print of a lift is the so called "palm print" ( CE 634) and it was listed on the evidence list of the evidence that was turned over to the FBI at midnight.

The story of detective Day disassembling the rifle and discovering a palm print on the small diameter metal barrel is simply a fabrication and a damned lie.....     

Offline Jack Trojan

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #22 on: May 08, 2018, 09:25:29 PM »
How does the infrequency of Oswald's prints compare to someone who was actually there and did the deed? The only explanation for you LNers is that Oswald must have worn gloves. So are you sticking with that?

Offline Steve M. Galbraith

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #23 on: May 08, 2018, 10:32:43 PM »
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How does the infrequency of Oswald's prints compare to someone who was actually there and did the deed? The only explanation for you LNers is that Oswald must have worn gloves. So are you sticking with that?

What do criminologists and forensic scientists say about finding identifiable prints on weapons? Or in general at crime scenes? . Let's limit it to firearms since that's the issue you raised. Not only today but fifty plus years ago? This is not the movies; this is real life.

So, what do the experts say? Have you researched the issue? Yes, this is a challenge because I've read what they say. And you won't like it.

For example, from a 1997 article published in "The Journal of Forensic Identification":
"Latent fingerprint examiners generally know that even when cutting edge technology such as cyanoacrylate fuming and laser/forensic light source examination are utilized, successful development of latent prints on firearms is difficult to achieve. In reality, very few identifiable latent prints are found on firearms, a fact that has been discussed in both the literature and the judicial system."

And that's not an anecdote.




« Last Edit: May 08, 2018, 11:34:42 PM by Steve M. Galbraith »

Offline Jack Trojan

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2018, 12:21:02 AM »
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What do criminologists and forensic scientists say about finding identifiable prints on weapons? Or in general at crime scenes? . Let's limit it to firearms since that's the issue you raised. Not only today but fifty plus years ago? This is not the movies; this is real life.

So, what do the experts say? Have you researched the issue? Yes, this is a challenge because I've read what they say. And you won't like it.

For example, from a 1997 article published in "The Journal of Forensic Identification":
"Latent fingerprint examiners generally know that even when cutting edge technology such as cyanoacrylate fuming and laser/forensic light source examination are utilized, successful development of latent prints on firearms is difficult to achieve. In reality, very few identifiable latent prints are found on firearms, a fact that has been discussed in both the literature and the judicial system."

And that's not an anecdote.

So that explains why Oswald didn't leave a single print on the stock, barrel, trigger, clip, ammo and scope of the MC after he disassembled then reassembled it in the TSBD. Is that what those latent fingerprint examiners are suggesting or are you?

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2018, 12:21:02 AM »


Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2018, 12:36:19 PM »
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So that explains why Oswald didn't leave a single print on the stock, barrel, trigger, clip, ammo and scope of the MC after he disassembled then reassembled it in the TSBD. Is that what those latent fingerprint examiners are suggesting or are you?

Lee Oswald didn't leave a print on the stock, barrel, trigger, clip, ammo or scope of the MC after he disassembled then reassembled it in the TSBD.....because he never disassembled or reassembled that Carcano that day.

If anybody has solid proof that Lee Oswald handled that Carcano that day, then please... please....   present the proof.

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #26 on: May 09, 2018, 12:43:45 PM »
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As I figured, you have NONE. No surprise there since the evidence shows that Day lifted nothing off of CE 139.

Tom Alyea wrote:

"Shortly after we arrived back on the 6th floor, Deputy Eugene Boone located the assassin's rifle almost completely hidden by some overhanging boxes near the stairwell. I filmed it as it was found. In my shot, the figure of Captain Fritz is standing within the enclosure next to the rifle. He knew then that the possibility of a fire fight with the sniper had greatly diminished. He dispatched one of his men to go down and call for the crime lab. About fifteen minutes later, Lt. Day and Studebaker arrived. Still pictures were taken of the positioning of the rifle, then Lt. Day slid it out from its hiding place and held it up for all of us to see. The world has seen my shot of this many times. Lt. Day immediately turned toward the window behind him and started dusting the weapon for fingerprints. Day was still within the enclosure formed by the surrounding boxes. I FILMED HIM LIFTING PRINTS FROM THE RIFLE He lifted them off with scotch tape and placed them on little white cards."

Online Tom Sorensen

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #27 on: May 09, 2018, 01:04:25 PM »
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Tom Alyea wrote:

"Shortly after we arrived back on the 6th floor, Deputy Eugene Boone located the assassin's rifle almost completely hidden by some overhanging boxes near the stairwell. I filmed it as it was found. In my shot, the figure of Captain Fritz is standing within the enclosure next to the rifle. He knew then that the possibility of a fire fight with the sniper had greatly diminished. He dispatched one of his men to go down and call for the crime lab. About fifteen minutes later, Lt. Day and Studebaker arrived. Still pictures were taken of the positioning of the rifle, then Lt. Day slid it out from its hiding place and held it up for all of us to see. The world has seen my shot of this many times. Lt. Day immediately turned toward the window behind him and started dusting the weapon for fingerprints. Day was still within the enclosure formed by the surrounding boxes. I FILMED HIM LIFTING PRINTS FROM THE RIFLE He lifted them off with scotch tape and placed them on little white cards."

He dispatched one of his men to go down and call for the crime lab. About fifteen minutes later, Lt. Day and Studebaker arrived.

But Day/Studebaker were already there in the SN...

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #27 on: May 09, 2018, 01:04:25 PM »


Online Tony Fratini

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #28 on: May 09, 2018, 02:34:20 PM »
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He dispatched one of his men to go down and call for the crime lab. About fifteen minutes later, Lt. Day and Studebaker arrived.

But Day/Studebaker were already there in the SN...

Yes, they were called over (by Sims) to come to where the rifle was to photograph it. Both Day and Studebaker were at the SE corner.

Online Tom Sorensen

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #29 on: May 09, 2018, 04:14:26 PM »
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Yes, they were called over (by Sims) to come to where the rifle was to photograph it. Both Day and Studebaker were at the SE corner.

Tony,

You may have missed my point:

He dispatched one of his men to go down and call for the crime lab. About fifteen minutes later, Lt. Day and Studebaker arrived.

Mr. DAY. Yes, sir; I went out of my office almost straight up 1 o'clock. I arrived at the location on Elm about 1:12.

and

Mr. McCLOY. In order to make the record perfectly clear, at least my understanding perfectly clear, did I understand that you testified that your initial which appears on that Exhibit was--not your initial but your signature which appears on that Exhibit was--put on there before the other writing, namely to the effect that there were two of the three hulls enclosed, that was put on the envelope?
Mr. BELIN. You are referring, Mr. McCloy, to the signature on the bottom of Commission Exhibit 717, "Lieutenant J. C. Day."
Mr. McCLOY. That is what I am referring to.
Mr. DAY. That was put on there before.
Mr. McCLOY. That was put on there----
Mr. DAY. At 1:23 p.m.
Mr. BELIN. And the remainder of the writing was put on that night at the Dallas Police Department, is that right?
Mr. DAY. Yes, sir; about the same time that I marked those two hulls.
Mr. BELIN. Could you tell us what exactly you did in testing those hulls for fingerprints?
Mr. DAY. I used fingerprint powder, dusted them with the powder, a dark powder. No legible prints were found.
Mr. BELIN. After you did this, you dusted the prints and you put them in the envelope, 717, and then what did you do?
Mr. DAY. I released them to Detective Sims or rather he took them.
Mr. BELIN. And then what did you do?
Mr. DAY. At that time I was summoned to the northwest corner of the building.


Did it take 15 minutes to move across the floor?

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Re: Oswald fingerprints on the live shell?
« Reply #29 on: May 09, 2018, 04:14:26 PM »