Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"

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Online Jerry Organ

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2022, 02:11:20 AM »
Now the leftists are lock step with the FBI and anything espoused by left wing politicians.  There is a Stasi-like compliance to authority fueled by the media and social media propaganda.  No one dares to question what they are told.

Conservatives were defenders of the FBI, of the military, of the national security state during the Cold War



Ahh. The Glory Days of McCarthyism, and complying dossiers on homosexuals and "uppity" blacks. But then the FBI "went after" the Klan and then Nixon over Watergate. That's really when the Republicans started to suspect the Bureau.

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2022, 02:11:20 AM »

Online Richard Smith

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2022, 02:49:53 PM »


Ahh. The Glory Days of McCarthyism, and complying dossiers on homosexuals and "uppity" blacks. But then the FBI "went after" the Klan and then Nixon over Watergate. That's really when the Republicans started to suspect the Bureau.

Your understanding of American history is lacking.  It was a group of Dems including LBJ in the senate who held up any advancement of civil rights for almost a hundred years.  Republicans from Grant to Eisenhower were advocates of equality.  There also was a real threat of Communist infiltration of the government.  The Russians had an extensive intelligence operation that had infiltrated many areas of the government because so many leftists in government were sympathetic to the cause.  Academics, scientists and others actively provided information to the Soviets.   All that has little to do with the point under discussion which was that the questioning of the government was once a leftist trait.  LBJ was a favorite target of liberals even though he was a Democrat with the most liberal agenda until Biden.  There would be no criticism of him under the modern liberals.  They walk in lock step, Stasi-like compliance.

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2022, 02:49:53 PM »

Online Jerry Organ

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2022, 09:19:02 PM »
Your understanding of American history is lacking.  It was a group of Dems including LBJ in the senate who held up any advancement of civil rights for almost a hundred years.  Republicans from Grant to Eisenhower were advocates of equality.

Yet they failed to act on it. Between 1860 and the Great Depression, Republicans controlled the White House and, at the same time, Congress more than half the time. Something about the blacks ought to be content with having the vote and businessmen didn't want to be forced to open up to blacks. Blaming inaction on the Democrats during that time is just more gaslighting from the current weird GOP.

Eisenhower entered office with a Republican majority in the House and control of the Senate. The two Civil Rights Bills passed in Ike's second term had support from the majority of Democrats in both Houses (most Southern Democrats holding out).

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There also was a real threat of Communist infiltration of the government.  The Russians had an extensive intelligence operation that had infiltrated many areas of the government because so many leftists in government were sympathetic to the cause.  Academics, scientists and others actively provided information to the Soviets.   All that has little to do with the point under discussion which was that the questioning of the government was once a leftist trait.  LBJ was a favorite target of liberals even though he was a Democrat with the most liberal agenda until Biden.  There would be no criticism of him under the modern liberals.  They walk in lock step, Stasi-like compliance.

Richard does so well at seeing how he was once deluded and conned by the JFK Assassination Conspiracy mind-benders. Now Poor Richard has become all radicalized by the soul-sucking Fox News and alt-right-web echo chamber.

"Stasi-like" is the du jour dog-whistle at Fox since Trump stooge Jeffrey Clark used the term at a Jan-6th hearing last June. Now the Trump raid has inspired such effusive-though-inapplicable terms as "preemptive coup", "Third World bullspombleprofglidnoctobuns", "Partisan witch hunt", "dark day for our republic" and "Gestapo". Gee, some poor person literally getting their door kicked in or hauled out of their car window are supposed to be compliant and not complain. Now we know who the marshmallows really are.

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2022, 09:19:02 PM »

Online Richard Smith

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2022, 01:32:13 AM »
Yet they failed to act on it. Between 1860 and the Great Depression, Republicans controlled the White House and, at the same time, Congress more than half the time. Something about the blacks ought to be content with having the vote and businessmen didn't want to be forced to open up to blacks. Blaming inaction on the Democrats during that time is just more gaslighting from the current weird GOP.

Eisenhower entered office with a Republican majority in the House and control of the Senate. The two Civil Rights Bills passed in Ike's second term had support from the majority of Democrats in both Houses (most Southern Democrats holding out).

Richard does so well at seeing how he was once deluded and conned by the JFK Assassination Conspiracy mind-benders. Now Poor Richard has become all radicalized by the soul-sucking Fox News and alt-right-web echo chamber.

"Stasi-like" is the du jour dog-whistle at Fox since Trump stooge Jeffrey Clark used the term at a Jan-6th hearing last June. Now the Trump raid has inspired such effusive-though-inapplicable terms as "preemptive coup", "Third World bullspombleprofglidnoctobuns", "Partisan witch hunt", "dark day for our republic" and "Gestapo". Gee, some poor person literally getting their door kicked in or hauled out of their car window are supposed to be compliant and not complain. Now we know who the marshmallows really are.

Jerry has a very low opinion of America.  Ironic for someone who lives in Canada of all places. Unfortunately, he is correct on the current status.  Things in the US are a royal mess.  Maybe read Robert Caro's books, though.  You don't understand the first thing about how the US Senate works.  A handful of powerful Southern Dems were able to hold up Civil Rights legislation for nearly 100 years.  It's not a question of having a "majority."  LBJ played a big part in that.  It was only when he decided to run for national office (i.e. President) that he saw the light.  While running for state office in Texas, LBJ towed the racist line for decades because that is what got him elected.

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2022, 01:32:13 AM »

Offline Jon Banks

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2022, 12:08:51 AM »
I think that was because Oliver Stone and Jim D are not far left liberals. I think they might even be considered somewhat conservative.

Stone and Jim D are both very Liberal.

The great thing about JFK assassination research is that itís totally non-partisan. Itís one of those neutral topics where political partisanship is not much of a factorÖ

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2022, 12:08:51 AM »

Offline Jon Banks

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2022, 12:21:34 AM »

As to Stone: But he doesn't question governments; he only questions the US (or western) governments. He's been an apologist for decades for the Castros and the Chavezs and other authoritarian governments that are hostile to the US. His rule is that if they oppose the US - or the US opposes them - then they must be defended. He really does view the US as a thoroughly corrupt country - he calls the US the "wild beast" that must be tamed. And if a government, no matter how corrupt it is, opposes the US then he'll defend it. Go watch his HBO movie on the history of the US. He believes that the Cold Was was caused solely by the US and that if we had elected Henry Wallace none of that conflict would have followed. Stalin gets a pass.

BTW, to relate this to the assassination: One of Wallace's top advisers in his presidential campaign was John Abt. Yes, that John Abt.

I consider my political views to be very close to that of Oliver Stone so in his defense, itís not that he apologizes for autocrats or US adversaries. Itís more a point of view that ďthe Cold War didnít need to happenĒ, meaning , it couldíve been avoided; The Military Industrial Complex practices ďThreat InflationĒ and exaggerates threats from adversarial countries in order to justify insane levels of defense spending; There are powerful people in our government who seem to not want peace.

I donít think Stone agrees with Chavez, Castro, or Putinís political ideologies. As you know or maybe donít know, Chavez and Castro were authoritarian Left while Putin is authoritarian Right. Having watched Stoneís interviews with Castro and Putin, it seemed more like he was genuinely curious about who they were and what drives them. Thereís value in knowing and understanding people like that even if you hate their guts.

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2022, 12:21:34 AM »

Offline Michael T. Griffith

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2022, 10:31:24 AM »
JFK Revisited is the short version of the four-hour documentary JFK: Destiny Betrayed. Thankfully, the short version leaves out most of the liberal preaching found in the long version. The long version contains a lot more material on each subject than does the short version, but the long version also contains an unfortunate dose of ultra-liberal politics.

Conspiracy theorists need to understand that you do not have to be an ultra-liberal to regret JFK's death, to reject the lone-gunman theory, and to admire the good things that JFK did as president. Sadly, most conspiracy theorists act like if you believe JFK was killed by a conspiracy, you must also believe that the Vietnam War was evil, that JFK would have done nothing to prevent the fall of South Vietnam, that the CIA should be abolished, that Edward Snowden and Bradley Manning are heroes, that even Obama's anti-terrorist drone program was wrong, that the PATRIOT Act was a tyrannical violation of constitutional rights, that Reagan was a bad president, etc., etc.

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2022, 10:31:24 AM »

Online Jerry Organ

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #17 on: August 14, 2022, 02:51:36 PM »
JFK Revisited is the short version of the four-hour documentary JFK: Destiny Betrayed. Thankfully, the short version leaves out most of the liberal preaching found in the long version. The long version contains a lot more material on each subject than does the short version, but the long version also contains an unfortunate dose of ultra-liberal politics.

Conspiracy theorists need to understand that you do not have to be an ultra-liberal to regret JFK's death, to reject the lone-gunman theory, and to admire the good things that JFK did as president. Sadly, most conspiracy theorists act like if you believe JFK was killed by a conspiracy, you must also believe that the Vietnam War was evil, that JFK would have done nothing to prevent the fall of South Vietnam, that the CIA should be abolished, that Edward Snowden and Bradley Manning are heroes, that even Obama's anti-terrorist drone program was wrong, that the PATRIOT Act was a tyrannical violation of constitutional rights, that Reagan was a bad president, etc., etc.

Why is the Griffith always proselytizing Ailes-like for Trump and the neo-facist Republicans? Must think every vote will help this November.

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Re: Finally Watched Oliver Stone's "JFK Revisited"
« Reply #17 on: August 14, 2022, 02:51:36 PM »

 

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