A Rock Solid Alibi.....

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Online Charles Collins

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2022, 11:51:25 PM »
Where does Oswald obtain his lunch that day?  He tells Frazier, in direct response to his question, that he didn't bring his lunch that morning.  There is no place in the TSBD to buy a lunch.  Oswald makes no mention of leaving the building to buy his lunch.  No one sees him do so.  And with the motorcade due in the area, he would have to do so in the midst of crowd (including his coworkers) and police outside.


Being the frugal type that he is, he decided to wait and bum something from the DPD...    ;)

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2022, 11:51:25 PM »

Online Richard Smith

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2022, 12:06:34 AM »

Being the frugal type that he is, he decided to wait and bum something from the DPD...    ;)

Yes, or maybe he lifted a piece of BRW's chicken.  It was fowl play.  A contrarian here once suggested that perhaps Oswald didn't sneak into the Texas Theatre without buying a ticket because no one could rule out that he bought a ticket in advance!  As though they had Fandango in 1963 and Oswald could somehow know in advance that he would be knocking off early for the movie that day after the president was assassinated from his building.  Nothing ever has to make sense.  The sole objective is to cast doubt on Oswald's guilt by any means.

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2022, 12:06:34 AM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2022, 12:38:09 AM »
Mr Oswald did not claim to have been eating his lunch in the domino room at the time of the P. Parade.

Lee Oswald most certainly DID tell Captain Fritz that he was eating his lunch in the 1st floor lunchroom (Domino Room)  at the time of the P. parade.    That is what Fritz jotted down in his scribbled notes which he wrote while interrogating Lee.

You have notes in Captain Fritz's handwriting that say this? Amazing! Do show us!  Thumb1:

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2022, 12:38:09 AM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2022, 12:41:41 AM »
Where does Oswald obtain his lunch that day?  He tells Frazier, in direct response to his question, that he didn't bring his lunch that morning.  There is no place in the TSBD to buy a lunch.  Oswald makes no mention of leaving the building to buy his lunch.  No one sees him do so.  And with the motorcade due in the area, he would have to do so in the midst of crowd (including his coworkers) and police outside.

Mr Oswald brought an apple and cheese sandwich to work with him. And, several minutes before the P. Parade, he purchased a Coca-Cola from the machine to have with his lunch.

Maybe he told Mr Frazier he didn't bring his lunch with him because he didn't want to spend his lunch break eating with him. Or maybe Mr Frazier misremembered exactly what he said. Who knows? But by all means, do enjoy tucking into this delicious nothing burger you've cooked up!  Thumb1:
« Last Edit: August 01, 2022, 12:43:35 AM by Alan Ford »

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2022, 12:41:41 AM »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2022, 12:49:58 AM »
Is there a full moon or something?  How do you get a "rock solid alibi" by putting yourself in the location from which the crime was committed (i.e. TSBD)?  And a suspect doesn't get an alibi from claiming to see others.  They get an alibi when some neutral witness can put the suspect at a different location at the time the crime was committed.  Oswald claiming to see someone in the lunchroom who didn't see him doesn't do that.  Obviously, Oswald knows his coworkers, who they hung out with, and what they look like from weeks of working in the building.  It wouldn't take Nostradamus to come up with that tale.  He has no alibi. 

No person can reasonably believe that LHO, a person with a well-documented history of interest in politics, who checked out and read JFK's book from the library, wouldn't so much as go outside to watch the motorcade go by his workplace if he was innocent.  If he was part of some conspiracy that involved framing him for the crime, the conspirators wouldn't risk allowing him to be in the lunchroom where he might be seen by someone at the time of the crime.

a suspect doesn't get an alibi from claiming to see others.

Oh, Really ?......  Let's pretend that you are a suspect in a murder case.    But You know that you weren't anywhere near the murder site at the time it happened.  Let's say the time was 10:30 pm Saturday night....  And you had said that you had seen a police car stopped with the red lights flashing and the cop was  testing the driver for drunk driving.  The cop never saw you but you had witnessed the arrest of the driver.   

Of course what you witnessed would have been a matter of police record....and the only way you could have described the event was because you had seen it.....  Would you think that you had a rock solid alibi?

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2022, 12:49:58 AM »

Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2022, 01:17:09 AM »
Is there a full moon or something?  How do you get a "rock solid alibi" by putting yourself in the location from which the crime was committed (i.e. TSBD)?  And a suspect doesn't get an alibi from claiming to see others.  They get an alibi when some neutral witness can put the suspect at a different location at the time the crime was committed.  Oswald claiming to see someone in the lunchroom who didn't see him doesn't do that.  Obviously, Oswald knows his coworkers, who they hung out with, and what they look like from weeks of working in the building.  It wouldn't take Nostradamus to come up with that tale.  He has no alibi. 

No person can reasonably believe that LHO, a person with a well-documented history of interest in politics, who checked out and read JFK's book from the library, wouldn't so much as go outside to watch the motorcade go by his workplace if he was innocent.  If he was part of some conspiracy that involved framing him for the crime, the conspirators wouldn't risk allowing him to be in the lunchroom where he might be seen by someone at the time of the crime.

And a suspect doesn't get an alibi from claiming to see others.

There are many ways an alibi can be established. If, as Walt says, he sees two particular individuals at a specific location and time and it turns out they were indeed there at that time that clearly confirms that Oswald must have been near the location at that time in order to see them.

They get an alibi when some neutral witness can put the suspect at a different location at the time the crime was committed.

That's another way to get an alibi but most certainly not the only one

Oswald claiming to see someone in the lunchroom who didn't see him doesn't do that.

Claiming to see someone might not do it, but seeing two particular individuals at a specific location and time does.

Obviously, Oswald knows his coworkers, who they hung out with, and what they look like from weeks of working in the building.  It wouldn't take Nostradamus to come up with that tale. 

Utter stupidity. It doesn't matter if Oswald knew his co-workers and who they hung out with. This was a singular event and Oswald could not have known these two particular individuals were at that location at that particular time unless he was there to see them.

No person can reasonably believe that LHO, a person with a well-documented history of interest in politics, who checked out and read JFK's book from the library, wouldn't so much as go outside to watch the motorcade go by his workplace if he was innocent.  If he was part of some conspiracy that involved framing him for the crime, the conspirators wouldn't risk allowing him to be in the lunchroom where he might be seen by someone at the time of the crime.

There you go again with another classic meaningless strawman.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2022, 01:39:02 AM by Martin Weidmann »

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2022, 01:17:09 AM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2022, 01:20:37 AM »
a suspect doesn't get an alibi from claiming to see others.

Oh, Really ?......  Let's pretend that you are a suspect in a murder case.    But You know that you weren't anywhere near the murder site at the time it happened.  Let's say the time was 10:30 pm Saturday night....  And you had said that you had seen a police car stopped with the red lights flashing and the cop was  testing the driver for drunk driving.  The cop never saw you but you had witnessed the arrest of the driver.   

Of course what you witnessed would have been a matter of police record....and the only way you could have described the event was because you had seen it.....  Would you think that you had a rock solid alibi?

Of course, Mr Oswald had already given his alibi------------he went outside to watch the P. Parade. He assumed that other employees would vouch for his presence there.

He had no idea that he was in the frame for pulling any trigger in Dealey Plaza. Such an idea would have been too absurd for words. He was given to understand only that he was being accused of killing Officer Tippit and (at most) having some involvement in the events in Dealey Plaza.

It therefore follows as a distinct possiblity that his mention of Messrs Jarman & Norman was not meant as an alibi (which he didn't even think he needed) but as potentially helpful information: I saw those two guys come in shortly before the motorcade. Maybe you need to talk to them, not me.

This would be similar to his mention of having seen a/the rifle being handled by Mr Truly on the first floor a couple of days ago. Again the implication is: Maybe you need to talk to him, not me.

 Thumb1:

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2022, 01:20:37 AM »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2022, 01:33:13 AM »
Of course, Mr Oswald had already given his alibi------------he went outside to watch the P. Parade. He assumed that other employees would vouch for his presence there.

He had no idea that he was in the frame for pulling any trigger in Dealey Plaza. Such an idea would have been too absurd for words. He was given to understand only that he was being accused of killing Officer Tippit and (at most) having some involvement in the events in Dealey Plaza.

It therefore follows as a distinct possiblity that his mention of Messrs Jarman & Norman was not meant as an alibi (which he didn't even think he needed) but as potentially helpful information: I saw those two guys come in shortly before the motorcade. Maybe you need to talk to them, not me.

This would be similar to his mention of having seen a/the rifle being handled by Mr Truly on the first floor a couple of days ago. Again the implication is: Maybe you need to talk to him, not me.

 Thumb1:

He was given to understand only that he was being accused of killing Officer Tippit and (at most) having some involvement in the events in Dealey Plaza.

Not according to FBI agent James Hosty.   Hosty said that Fritz asked Lee Oswald point blank.   "Lee, Did you shoot the president?"   Lee responded with an emphatic "NO".... 

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2022, 01:33:13 AM »

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2022, 01:41:49 AM »
He was given to understand only that he was being accused of killing Officer Tippit and (at most) having some involvement in the events in Dealey Plaza.

Not according to FBI agent James Hosty.   Hosty said that Fritz asked Lee Oswald point blank.   "Lee, Did you shoot the president?"   Lee responded with an emphatic "NO"....

-----"Did you shoot the President?"
-----"No, I have not been charged with that. The first thing I heard about that was when the newspaper reporters in the hall axed me that question."

In the first interrogation, Captain Fritz asked Mr Oswald to account for his movements earlier that day. Mr Oswald did that, and the question of his having actually pulled a trigger in Dealey Plaza was not seriously raised thereafter.

However, Captain Fritz was thereby hoodwinking Mr Oswald into thinking he had been ruled out as the Depository gunman. Thus Mr Oswald felt no need to explain his rock-solid front-entrance alibi to the press.

And his bombshell claim to have gone outside to watch the P. Parade was buried.

You're free to keep on partying like it's 2018 by ignoring the game-changing information contained in Agent Hosty's handwritten draft interrogation report, but in doing so you will be condemning your analysis to irrelevance.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2022, 01:47:37 AM by Alan Ford »

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2022, 01:41:49 AM »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: A Rock Solid Alibi.....
« Reply #19 on: August 01, 2022, 02:20:18 AM »
Of course, Mr Oswald had already given his alibi------------he went outside to watch the P. Parade. He assumed that other employees would vouch for his presence there.

He had no idea that he was in the frame for pulling any trigger in Dealey Plaza. Such an idea would have been too absurd for words. He was given to understand only that he was being accused of killing Officer Tippit and (at most) having some involvement in the events in Dealey Plaza.

It therefore follows as a distinct possiblity that his mention of Messrs Jarman & Norman was not meant as an alibi (which he didn't even think he needed) but as potentially helpful information: I saw those two guys come in shortly before the motorcade. Maybe you need to talk to them, not me.

This would be similar to his mention of having seen a/the rifle being handled by Mr Truly on the first floor a couple of days ago. Again the implication is: Maybe you need to talk to him, not me.

 Thumb1:

He assumed that other employees would vouch for his presence there.

If he had been there, don't you think other employees would have told the police that they had seen him 
there?



Mr Ford....You're reading something into Hosty's notes that simply isn't specific...

 

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