The Position of the Bolt on the MC

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Offline Zeon Mason

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #240 on: August 02, 2022, 04:28:35 PM »
So what the conclusion here? If the bolt handle should have been  locked by reflex action of a shooter trying to operate this MC rifle as quickly as possible to fire 3 shots, ( which still requires about 7-8 secs by most experiments not withstanding the dubious CBS time trial alleged feat of one old timer getting 3 hits in 5.1sec) , then why is the bolt handle open and why  did a round just “ fall out” when Fritz takes the rifle from Day?

Is there possibility of the bolt handle being rotated upward and unlocking the bolt via pushing or dropping the rifle in the gap between the 2 parallel rows of boxes?

Could the action of Fritz slowly pulling the bolt back have not been sufficient force  to eject the round properly, thus the round was pulled  partly out and then fell out ?

If the extractor never had a grip on the rim of the cartridge because the cartridge was  placed by hand into the breech with the bolt open, and the bolt only pushed forward about 90% and the bolt handle up. Then what’s the reason for that?

Responding to the notion it was “smart” to carry a rifle across the 6th floor being in LOS of the rear staircase to gain time:

Why risk being seen carrying the rifle when there are plenty of other rows of boxes that  could have obscured the rifle even better and were NOT in LOS to the staircase .and would have probably taken just as long to find.

Other things that Oswald allegedly did that (imo) do NOT seem smart:

1. supposedly using his own handwriting to spell a fake name on a mail order form for a rifle supposedly to be sent by mail .

2.Oswald supposedly using his own P.O. Box address for the rifle ordered by fake name to be sent to also.

3. Oswald supposedly carrying his fake ID while he was supposedly  shooting JFK and also while he was supposedly shooting Tippet and then dropping the billfold with that fake ID at the scene ( along with spent shells)

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #240 on: August 02, 2022, 04:28:35 PM »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #241 on: August 09, 2022, 02:32:33 AM »
So what the conclusion here? If the bolt handle should have been  locked by reflex action of a shooter trying to operate this MC rifle as quickly as possible to fire 3 shots, ( which still requires about 7-8 secs by most experiments not withstanding the dubious CBS time trial alleged feat of one old timer getting 3 hits in 5.1sec) , then why is the bolt handle open and why  did a round just “ fall out” when Fritz takes the rifle from Day?

Is there possibility of the bolt handle being rotated upward and unlocking the bolt via pushing or dropping the rifle in the gap between the 2 parallel rows of boxes?

Could the action of Fritz slowly pulling the bolt back have not been sufficient force  to eject the round properly, thus the round was pulled  partly out and then fell out ?

If the extractor never had a grip on the rim of the cartridge because the cartridge was  placed by hand into the breech with the bolt open, and the bolt only pushed forward about 90% and the bolt handle up. Then what’s the reason for that?

Responding to the notion it was “smart” to carry a rifle across the 6th floor being in LOS of the rear staircase to gain time:

Why risk being seen carrying the rifle when there are plenty of other rows of boxes that  could have obscured the rifle even better and were NOT in LOS to the staircase .and would have probably taken just as long to find.

Other things that Oswald allegedly did that (imo) do NOT seem smart:

1. supposedly using his own handwriting to spell a fake name on a mail order form for a rifle supposedly to be sent by mail .

2.Oswald supposedly using his own P.O. Box address for the rifle ordered by fake name to be sent to also.

3. Oswald supposedly carrying his fake ID while he was supposedly  shooting JFK and also while he was supposedly shooting Tippet and then dropping the billfold with that fake ID at the scene ( along with spent shells)

Why risk being seen carrying the rifle when there are plenty of other rows of boxes that  could have obscured the rifle even better and were NOT in LOS to the staircase .and would have probably taken just as long to find.

You raise an interesting point , Zeon...   The rifle was hidden where it was, because the site was along the logical path that a fleeing attempted assassin would use in leaving the sixth floor.   ( in fact that is the reason that Boone and Weitzman found the rifle. They calculated that if there was a gun left behind by the fleeing gunman, it would probably be found along his logical escape route. )

The person who hid that rifle knew that he should hide it along the escape route....

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #241 on: August 09, 2022, 02:32:33 AM »

Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #242 on: August 10, 2022, 09:52:42 AM »
Why risk being seen carrying the rifle when there are plenty of other rows of boxes that  could have obscured the rifle even better and were NOT in LOS to the staircase .and would have probably taken just as long to find.

You raise an interesting point , Zeon...   The rifle was hidden where it was, because the site was along the logical path that a fleeing attempted assassin would use in leaving the sixth floor.   ( in fact that is the reason that Boone and Weitzman found the rifle. They calculated that if there was a gun left behind by the fleeing gunman, it would probably be found along his logical escape route. )

The person who hid that rifle knew that he should hide it along the escape route....

And why bother going to the trouble of building a hiding place for the rifle, try to wipe it clean of all prints but leave the empty shells just lying there.

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #242 on: August 10, 2022, 09:52:42 AM »

Online Michael Walton

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #243 on: August 10, 2022, 02:57:02 PM »
And why bother going to the trouble of building a hiding place for the rifle, try to wipe it clean of all prints but leave the empty shells just lying there.

Yes, exactly. Great point. It makes no sense. Here we have a guy supposedly doing the deed up there, lets the shells fly all over the place [and one shell's rim was dented BTW] but takes the time to wipe down the gun and hide it. If there really had been someone up there and they took the shells too, think of the interesting ramifications that would entail about the official narrative. So I've always thought of the throw down shells as being like breadcrumbs for the story.

It reminds me of the Jeff MacDonald case - three strangers go into the home and cause all kinds of havoc on the women in there, leave old Jeff with a scratch, he supposedly fights them off, the coffee table is turned over, but all of the nick knacks on the curio shelf are undisturbed.

As for the gun itself, here's a variant of the rifle. I'm no gun expert but creaky to use. And per Pat Speer looking through the misaligned scope would have caused even more time per shot to look through it and find the target because of the warped view in a scope. He supposedly hit Kennedy in the back, loads, looks through the scope, scores a supposedly wild shot way off and downwind, loads and looks in it again and scores the head shot.

Sure, sure he did.


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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #243 on: August 10, 2022, 02:57:02 PM »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #244 on: August 10, 2022, 06:54:20 PM »
Yes, exactly. Great point. It makes no sense. Here we have a guy supposedly doing the deed up there, lets the shells fly all over the place [and one shell's rim was dented BTW] but takes the time to wipe down the gun and hide it. If there really had been someone up there and they took the shells too, think of the interesting ramifications that would entail about the official narrative. So I've always thought of the throw down shells as being like breadcrumbs for the story.

It reminds me of the Jeff MacDonald case - three strangers go into the home and cause all kinds of havoc on the women in there, leave old Jeff with a scratch, he supposedly fights them off, the coffee table is turned over, but all of the nick knacks on the curio shelf are undisturbed.

As for the gun itself, here's a variant of the rifle. I'm no gun expert but creaky to use. And per Pat Speer looking through the misaligned scope would have caused even more time per shot to look through it and find the target because of the warped view in a scope. He supposedly hit Kennedy in the back, loads, looks through the scope, scores a supposedly wild shot way off and downwind, loads and looks in it again and scores the head shot.

Sure, sure he did.


I believe that when the rifle was found, the fact that the bolt was not closed and latched is a very strong indicator that the rifle was not fired that day.... Because if it had been fired, the shooter would have closed and latched the bolt by reflex action.   Don't believe it?.... Watch the video....   The man opens the bolt to extract and eject the spent round and then closes and latches the bolt, by reflex action, and re-aims the rifle and fires



The bolt was not closed and latched because it couldn't be closed and latched...And the reason it couldn't be closed and latched is because the yokel who hid the rifle beneath the pallet of boxes of books simply dropped the live round into the chamber.....and the carcano cannot be loaded in that manner.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2022, 10:06:22 PM by Walt Cakebread »

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #244 on: August 10, 2022, 06:54:20 PM »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #245 on: August 10, 2022, 07:46:51 PM »
And why bother going to the trouble of building a hiding place for the rifle, try to wipe it clean of all prints but leave the empty shells just lying there.

Because ...as another poster pointed out the spent shells were "bread crumbs".... To lead investigators into believing that the shots had been fired from that site and at the same time lure the cops away from the picket fence.

I believe that Lee Oswald was the person who threw down the "bread crumbs" because he wanted investigators who would come looking for the person who had taken a pot shot at JFK to believe that the shots had been fired from that site.   And he also hid the rifle beneath that pallet of books because if he had left the rifle right there at the window it would have been found and traced to his PO box.   He wanted the rifle to be found but not until he had sufficient time to get out of the U.S. and on his way to Cuba. 

Lee had no part in luring the cops away from the Grassy Knoll....But the plotters who set him up most certainly wanted the cops lured away from the picket fence where one of the gunmen could have inadvertently left some evidence ..... Like a spent shell for example.

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #245 on: August 10, 2022, 07:46:51 PM »

Offline Dan O'meara

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #246 on: August 11, 2022, 02:39:37 AM »
Because ...as another poster pointed out the spent shells were "bread crumbs"

This is a genuine possibility.
There is something so suspicious about the testimony involving the shells that it rings alarm bells.
It's why I raised the question of why a shooter should be so concerned about building a hiding place for the rifle, trying to wipe the rifle clean to destroy fingerprints, but then to leave the three shells lying there [and thereby giving away the location from where the shooting took place and connecting that location to the rifle].
It seems suspicious.







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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #246 on: August 11, 2022, 02:39:37 AM »

Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #247 on: August 11, 2022, 04:54:16 AM »
Leaving the shells = 'In-your-face' from Smirky

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #247 on: August 11, 2022, 04:54:16 AM »

Online Richard Smith

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #248 on: August 11, 2022, 02:34:50 PM »
And why bother going to the trouble of building a hiding place for the rifle, try to wipe it clean of all prints but leave the empty shells just lying there.

The rifle was in hand and useful in case Oswald encountered someone on the floor.  The shells were scattered about on the floor in front of the window from which he had just assassinated the president.  I'm not sure there is any reason to believe Oswald took the "trouble of building a hiding place for the rifle" on his way off the floor or tried to wipe it clean of prints.   My guess is that Oswald had placed the rifle on the 6th floor that morning when he first arrived.  The last thing he did before retrieving the rifle was to put his clipboard down.  He is holding the clipboard as a sort of prop to make it look as though he had some work-related reason to be on the 6th floor after noon should he encounter anyone.  He puts it down when he decides to get his rifle.  So he may have prepared some "hiding" place in advance and used it again on his way off the floor.  Isn't the better question always why his rifle was there in the first place? 

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #248 on: August 11, 2022, 02:34:50 PM »

Online Michael Walton

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Re: The Position of the Bolt on the MC
« Reply #249 on: August 11, 2022, 03:59:57 PM »
I believe that when the rifle was found, the fact that the bolt was not closed and latched is a very strong indicator that the rifle was not fired that day.... Because if it had been fired, the shooter would have closed and latched the bolt by reflex action.   Don't believe it?.... Watch the video....   The man opens the bolt to extract and eject the spent round and then closes and latches the bolt, by reflex action, and re-aims the rifle and fires

The bolt was not closed and latched because it couldn't be closed and latched...And the reason it couldn't be closed and latched is because the yokel who hid the rifle beneath the pallet of boxes of books simply dropped the live round into the chamber.....and the carcano cannot be loaded in that manner.

Nice catch Walt. Very nice catch. To add further - and the breadcrumb shells - it's almost like they didn't want to hide a fully empty gun. So they just jammed one more bullet in there, perhaps to ensure that bullet matched the shells. And like the fake backyard photos, they got really greedy with those photos. It's one think to have a guy standing there with Lee's head pasted over it perhaps holding just the rifle. But no - they added in the pistol and even the left-wing newspapers too. Funnily enough, it goes against everything we know about Oswald.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2022, 04:04:12 PM by Michael Walton »

 

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