Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?


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Offline Bill Brown

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Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« on: April 13, 2022, 11:37:24 PM »
I say Ted Callaway helped load Tippit's body into the ambulance and then went over to the patrol car radio to report the shooting to the police dispatcher.

Martin Weidmann says I am wrong, that Callaway got on the patrol car radio first... and then helped load the body into the ambulance.

This matters when trying to explain Callaway's timeline between hearing the shots ring out and reporting the shooting on the patrol car radio.

Martin Wedimann said this, about me....

We've seen a good example of that so-called "curb stomping" when Brown ran from the discussion we had about Callaway and Bowley helping to load Tippit into the ambulance after Callaway made his radio call. Despite all the conclusive evidence against it, Billy argued - to explain away a 2 minute gap in the timeline - that Callaway helped to load Tippit into the ambulance before he made his call, which by it itself is idiotic as the presence of the ambulance would have made Callaway's radio call superfluous. When asked for evidence to back up his silly claim all he could say was that it was in the transcripts (which it wasn't), just before he ran away from the conversation.  :D

Weidmann, care to discuss this issue here in this new thread so that it is all in one place?  I created the thread and therefore, it'd be kinda difficult for me to "run away". 

Fair enough?

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Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« on: April 13, 2022, 11:37:24 PM »


Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2022, 11:50:44 PM »
I say Ted Callaway helped load Tippit's body into the ambulance and then went over to the patrol car radio to report the shooting to the police dispatcher.

Martin Weidmann says I am wrong, that Callaway got on the patrol car radio first... and then helped load the body into the ambulance.

This matters when trying to explain Callaway's timeline between hearing the shots ring out and reporting the shooting on the patrol car radio.

Martin Wedimann said this, about me....

Weidmann, care to discuss this issue here in this new thread so that it is all in one place?  I created the thread and therefore, it'd be kinda difficult for me to "run away". 

Fair enough?

I wanted to discuss this when we were having to original conversation, but you "lost interest" and merely said something like"it's all there in the DPD recordings, you just don't interpret it correct".

So, if you are now interested again, and are not going to lose your interest again, present your case and I will respond.

Take you time though, because I will be gone for a few days on an Easter break
« Last Edit: April 14, 2022, 12:20:25 AM by Martin Weidmann »

Offline Bill Brown

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2022, 12:56:23 AM »
By the way, if Callaway got on the patrol car radio BEFORE helping to load the body into the ambulance (he didn't), then all it really does is help the false narrative that the shooting occurred earlier than 1:14/1:15.

In other words, Callaway helping with the body before getting on the police radio does not support my argument that the shooting occurred around 1:14/1:15; it would support the idea the shooting occurred a bit earlier than the official version.  Nevertheless, that is what happened.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2022, 06:36:38 AM by Bill Brown »

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2022, 12:56:23 AM »


Offline Bill Brown

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2022, 01:52:32 AM »
Ted Callaway testified that after hearing the five gun shots, he ran out to the sidewalk on Patton.  This was a little over a half block south of the shooting scene.  Callaway saw a man (who he later identified as Oswald) cutting across Patton as he (Oswald) made his way south on Patton (towards Callaway's position).  Callaway hollered out to the man  as the man continued south on Patton past Callaway's position.  Callaway testified that the man was running and holding a gun.  Callaway saw the man head west on Jefferson (the same direction as the theater).

Once the man turned west onto Jefferson, Callaway ran a "good hard run" up to the corner of Tenth and Patton.  Callaway, noticing the stopped patrol car, went to the car and saw the officer (Tippit) lying dead in the street.  Callaway helped load Tippit's body into the ambulance and then grabbed the police car radio and report the shooting.  He said he didn't know if anyone had reported it yet, so he decided to report it himself.

To recap, Callaway hears the shots.  Runs to the sidewalk.  Sees the gunman run south on Patton the entire block from Tenth to Jefferson.  Runs the two-thirds of a block up to the shooting scene.  Helps load the body into the ambulance.  Goes over to the police car and reports the shooting to the police dispatcher.

How much time do you believe passed from the time Callaway heard the shots to the time he reported the shooting on the police radio?

Let's say two minutes pass from the time Oswald shoots Tippit to the time Oswald turns the corner from Patton onto Jefferson.  This is a little over one long block and Oswald was running.

Let's say it takes Callaway one minute when he made the "good hard run" the two-thirds of a block from his location to the patrol car.  Add one minute to help load the body into the ambulance.

If these time estimates are anywhere close to being correct, then Callaway is at the patrol car roughly four minutes after the shots rang out.  Let's add another full minute for error.  So we have Callaway at the patrol car using the police radio about five minutes after the shots rang out.

Here's the thing... Callaway's report to the dispatcher while using the patrol car radio took place at 1:19/1:20.

Do the math and work it backwards.  At 1:19/1:20, Callaway makes the call.  If five minutes have passed (and that's being generous, in my opinion) since the shots rang out, then the shots rang out around 1:14/1:15.

Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2022, 02:30:33 AM »
Ted Callaway testified that after hearing the five gun shots, he ran out to the sidewalk on Patton.  This was a little over a half block south of the shooting scene.  Callaway saw a man (who he later identified as Oswald) cutting across Patton as he (Oswald) made his way south on Patton (towards Callaway's position).  Callaway hollered out to the man  as the man continued south on Patton past Callaway's position.  Callaway testified that the man was running and holding a gun.  Callaway saw the man head west on Jefferson (the same direction as the theater).

Once the man turned west onto Jefferson, Callaway ran a "good hard run" up to the corner of Tenth and Patton.  Callaway, noticing the stopped patrol car, went to the car and saw the officer (Tippit) lying dead in the street.  Callaway helped load Tippit's body into the ambulance and then grabbed the police car radio and report the shooting.  He said he didn't know if anyone had reported it yet, so he decided to report it himself.

To recap, Callaway hears the shots.  Runs to the sidewalk.  Sees the gunman run south on Patton the entire block from Tenth to Jefferson.  Runs the two-thirds of a block up to the shooting scene.  Helps load the body into the ambulance.  Goes over to the police car and reports the shooting to the police dispatcher.

How much time do you believe passed from the time Callaway heard the shots to the time he reported the shooting on the police radio?

Let's say two minutes pass from the time Oswald shoots Tippit to the time Oswald turns the corner from Patton onto Jefferson.  This is a little over one long block and Oswald was running.

Let's say it takes Callaway one minute when he made the "good hard run" the two-thirds of a block from his location to the patrol car.  Add one minute to help load the body into the ambulance.

If these time estimates are anywhere close to being correct, then Callaway is at the patrol car roughly four minutes after the shots rang out.  Let's add another full minute for error.  So we have Callaway at the patrol car using the police radio about five minutes after the shots rang out.

Here's the thing... Callaway's report to the dispatcher while using the patrol car radio took place at 1:19/1:20.

Do the math and work it backwards.  At 1:19/1:20, Callaway makes the call.  If five minutes have passed (and that's being generous, in my opinion) since the shots rang out, then the shots rang out around 1:14/1:15.

I will reply in more detail after Easter, but here's something for you to consider in the meantime;

The official narrative states that the funeral home on Jefferson received a call to dispatch an ambulance at 1:18.
According to Butler, the driver of the ambulance, it took him about a minute to get to 10th street, which (going by the transcript times) means he arrived there at 1:19, which in turn - according to the DPD transcripts - is the time Callaway made his call.


Offline Bill Brown

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2022, 03:07:55 AM »
I will reply in more detail after Easter, but here's something for you to consider in the meantime;

The official narrative states that the funeral home on Jefferson received a call to dispatch an ambulance at 1:18.
According to Butler, the driver of the ambulance, it took him about a minute to get to 10th street, which (going by the transcript times) means he arrived there at 1:19, which in turn - according to the DPD transcripts - is the time Callaway made his call.

The ambulance arrived almost right at 1:19.  Shortly after 1:19, the ambulance was gone.  Then Callaway goes over to the patrol car and makes his report to the dispatcher; 1:19/1:20.

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2022, 03:07:55 AM »


Offline Bill Brown

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2022, 06:42:16 AM »
Except he didn't go by the office at all, but instead, according to Callaway, ran down an alley halfway down Patton, between 10th and Jefferson.

Um, No.

Mr. DULLES. May I ask what course he was taking when you last saw him?
Mr. CALLAWAY. He was going west on Jefferson Street.
Mr. DULLES. West on Jefferson Street?
Mr. CALLAWAY. Yes, sir.

Offline Bill Brown

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2022, 07:01:35 AM »
I say Callaway helped load the body into the ambulance and then went over to the patrol car to report the shooting to the police dispatcher.  Weidmann insists that I am wrong about this.

The police tapes obviously don't mention the body being loaded into the ambulance, but the tapes do tell us when the ambulance was leaving the scene en route to Methodist Hospital.  The tapes tell us that the ambulance was leaving the scene as Callaway was making his report on the squad car radio.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2022, 07:02:29 AM by Bill Brown »

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Re: Brown/Weidmann, Mini-Debate?
« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2022, 07:01:35 AM »


 

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