Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?


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Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2021, 04:28:05 AM »
The youtube footage is 0:14 long & shows a single shot (notice the smoke) & a few 3-shot bursts (lots of smoke).
Some AR-15 3 round burst fun going CRAZY!  ….. 6,963 views …•Jul 10, 2017 …SHOOTRIDELIVE
Hickey's AR15 might have had 3 modes, SINGLE -- BURST -- AUTO. I dont remember. It was a long time ago.
There are youtubes of auto bursts of 6 shots or more.  A 6-shot burst sounds similar to a 3-shot burst, but modern AR15 autos fire at i think 12 rps compared to the oldendays 6.7 rps.
I dont rule out the possibility that Hickey used auto, in which case he might have fired 4 shots, or more.  Actually 4 shots is very appealing, it allows an extra shot that hits the tarmac of Elm Street (as seen by Skelton), in addition to one shot hitting the tarmac of Mains St (& of course one hit the chrome trim, & one hit JFK).

« Last Edit: March 17, 2021, 06:11:13 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2021, 04:28:05 AM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2021, 11:33:38 AM »
I calculate that the needed veer in JFK's skull is 11.4deg.
That is the needed exit angle from the skull (or i should say the needed veer angle tween entry & exit) for the remnant slug to crack the windshield.  This is based on the glass impact being 7" left of center,  the JFK impact being 9" right of center, & the AR15 being 9" left of center.  Distance glass to JFK is 115.4",  JFK to AR15 is 297".  This ignores the vertical angle from the AR15 to JFK (5.21% grade)(which is shown in the pix below).  The glass impact (49.6"above road) is almost exactly at the same level as the JFK impact (49" above road).  The glass impact was 1" above the center of the windshield, & 7" left of center. 

These offsets & angles look reasonable to me, & i think that 11.4deg is possible. A hollow point slug has very little veer in ballistic gel, but as i pointed out yesterday a hollow point can have a large quick veer if it passes throo an angled windshield before the gel, or in the present case angled bone.

If Queen Mary was not exactly in line with the JFK limo (ie exactly behind)(horizontally speaking) then that would increase or decrease that there 11.4deg.  If Queen Mary were 18" right of the JFK limo then the AR15 might be directly behind JFK (JFK is 9" off center) in which case the needed veer for the remnant slug would be 6.5deg.
I did see mention that Queen Mary had swerved across to the right at about the time of the head-shot, & that it was for a while right of the JFK limo, but i havent looked into that stuff. I can add that if Queen Mary is at an angle to the JFK limo then that would place the AR15 further right which would reduce the needed veer or it would place the AR15 further left which would increase the needed veer.
[edit][see #19 for corrected angles][see #37 for corrected angles].


« Last Edit: May 02, 2021, 03:08:04 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #18 on: March 17, 2021, 03:38:24 AM »
Roy H. Kellerman, Special Agent, Secret Service, sitting in the front passenger seat in the JFK limo, said at the Warren Commission that the fatal head-shot was shot-2, & that shot-2 was a part of a flurry of at least 2 almost simultaneous shots.   The word flurry (ie an auto burst) came up 22 times during Kellerman's testimony.  Here are some snippets. 
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/kellerma.htm
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes. Good. There was enough for me to verify that the man was hit. So, in the same motion I come right back and grabbed the speaker and said to the driver, "Let's get out of here; we are hit," and grabbed the mike and I said, "Lawson, this is Kellerman,"--this is Lawson, who is in the front car. "We are hit; get us to the hospital immediately." Now, in the seconds that I talked just now, a flurry of shells come into the car. I then looked back and this time Mr. Hill, who was riding on the left front bumper of our followup car, was on the back trunk of that car; the President was sideways down into. the back seat.
Mr. KELLERMAN. But after the flurry of shots, I recall her saying, "What are they doing to you?" Now again, of course, my comparison of the voice of her speech--certainly, I have heard it many times, and in the car there was conversation she was carrying on through shock, I am sure.
Mr. SPECTER. Now, in your prior testimony you described a flurry of shells into the car. How many shots did you hear after the first noise which you described as sounding like a firecracker?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Mr. Specter, these shells came in all together.
Mr. SPECTER. Are you able to say how many you heard?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I am going to say two, and it was like a double bang--bang, bang.
Mr. SPECTER. You mean now two shots in addition to the first noise?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes, sir; yes, sir; at least.
Mr. KELLERMAN. Let me give you an illustration, sir, before I can give you an answer. You have heard the sound barrier, of a plane breaking the sound barrier, bang, bang? That is it.
Mr. KELLERMAN. Our car accelerated immediately on the time-at the time--this flurry of shots came into it.
Mr. SPECTER. Can you describe the sound of the flurry of shots by way of distinction with the way you have described the sound of the first shot?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Well, having heard all types of guns fired, most of them, rather, if I recall correctly these were two sharp reports, sir. Again, I am going to refer to it as like a plane going through a sound barrier; bang, bang.
Mr. SPECTER. Now, you are referring to the flurry?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right.
Mr. SPECTER. Did it sound differently from the first noise you have described as being a firecracker?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes; definitely; very much so.
Mr. SPECTER. You have testified about the impression you had as to the source of the first shot, which sounded to you like a firecracker. Did you have any impression as to the source of the other shots, which you described as being a flurry?.................
Mr. SPECTER. The question which I had then started to ask you was whether you had any impression at the time of the second and third shots, which you described as a flurry of shots, as to the point of origin or source of those shots.
Mr. KELLERMAN. The only answer I can give to that is that they would have to come from the rear.
Mr. SPECTER. Well, is that the impression or reaction you had at the time of the flurry?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right, sir.

Kellerman's testimony covered his needs, (1) there was no very early shot (a very early shot would require an explanation of why no early action had been taken), (2) there were 3 shots (this made everyone happy), (3) there were at least 3 shots, including a flurry of shots, & the flurry sounded different (hence Kellerman wouldnt look silly if the truth ever came out that Hickey fired).

Greer the driver mentioned in effect an almost simultaneous burst, & concussion (the AR15 muzzle was 28ft from his earhole, & aiming say 20" right of his earhole)(& a 3-shot burst would have 3 times the concussion).

Mr. SPECTER. To the best of your ability to recollect and estimate, how much time elapsed from the first noise which you have described as being similar to the backfire of a motor vehicle until you heard the second noise?
Mr. GREER. It seems a matter of seconds, I really couldn't say. Three or four seconds.
Mr. SPECTER. How much time elapsed, to the best of your ability to estimate and recollect, between the time of the second noise and the time of the third noise?
Mr. GREER. The last two seemed to be just simultaneously, one behind the other, but I don't recollect just how much, how many seconds were between the two. I couldn't really say.
Mr. SPECTER. Describe as best you can the types of sound of the second report, as distinguished from the first noise which you said was similar to a motorcycle backfire?
Mr. GREER. The second one didn't sound any different much than the first one but I kind of got, by turning around, I don't know whether I got a little concussion of it, maybe when it hit something or not, I may have gotten a little concussion that made me think there was something different to it. But so far as the noise is concerned, I haven't got any memory of any difference in them at all.


Mary Moorman was the closest spectator, she heard a 3 or 4 shot burst.
"No, I didn’t. There was, oh, three or four real close together, and it must have been the first one that shot him, because that was the time I took the picture, and it was during that time after I took the picture, and the shots were still being fired, I decided I better get on the ground. . . . I was no more than fifteen foot from the car and in line of fire evidently."
« Last Edit: March 20, 2021, 10:28:37 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #18 on: March 17, 2021, 03:38:24 AM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #19 on: March 17, 2021, 08:15:02 AM »
At 14:47 of the 21:37 long youtube "1964 secret service film (jfk assassination reconstruction)" the SS show that JFK's head was a little left of center when the fatal head-shot happened, as shown in the printscreen pix below.  They used Queen Mary (the Cadillac limo that Hickey was actually in) for their footage, ie they didnt use JFK's Lincoln Continental.  That new info re the pozzy of JFK's head changes the needed angles, yesterday when i did my calcs (see #17) i had assumed that JFK's head was 6" or 9" right of center, & that the remnant slug had to veer 10deg or even 11.4deg.
The corrected calcs give a needed veer of only 6deg inside the skull to then hit the windshield at the necessary point.
This 6deg is based on Hickey's AR15 being 9" left of center, JFK's head 0" off center, & the impact on the windshield 7" left of center.  In my pix the Secret Service had naturally showed the crosshair view seen by Oswald, but Hickey was standing or half-standing in the left rear seat of the followup car (Queen Mary).  And the AR15 didnt have a scope.


« Last Edit: March 20, 2021, 10:40:07 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #20 on: March 18, 2021, 07:54:01 AM »
Agent Youngblood saw a grayish blur in the air above JFK's limo.
"We had straightened on Elm now and were beginning to move easily down the incline in the wake of the cars ahead. Suddenly there was an explosive noise--distinct, sharp, resounding. Nothing that could be mistaken for the incessant popping and backfiring of the motorcycles, but in the instant I heard it I could not be certain if it had been a firecracker, bullet, bomb or some other explosive. I looked around quickly but saw nothing to indicate its source. But the movements in the President's car were not normal. Kennedy seemed to be falling to his left and there was sudden movement among the agents in the car directly ahead of us. I turned instinctively in my seat and with my left hand I grasped Lyndon Johnson's right shoulder and with all the leverage I could exert from a sitting position I forced him downward. "Get down!" I shouted. "Get down!" The vice-president reacted immediately. Still not seeing the source of the explosion, I swung across the back seat and sat on top of him. There were two more explosions in rapid succession, only seconds after the first. From my crouched position I saw a grayish blur in the air above the right side of the President's car. George Hickey, standing in the follow-up car just ahead of us, was poised with the AR-15 rifle, swinging back toward the building we had just passed. People along the sides of the street were scattering in panic."

I reckon that Hickey never swung his AR15 towards the TSBD. Earlier he had swung around & looked in that direction, he then picked up the AR15 & stood up to swing around, at which time Queen Mary braked & Hickey stumbled forward onto Donnelly, & he accidentally squeezed the trigger firing an auto burst, & after releasing the trigger he fell back to his original half sitting half standing pozzy in the back seat, &, shocked, he lost interest in any snipers for a few seconds, & by then Queen Mary was accelerating out of Dealey Plaza.

Young Rosemary Willis saw the smoke & the fragments meet in the air.
https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipPoMuaSnDAzApynTFe8JHHAORuPj6MAsjBu5M7j

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/uzLZuje-8XnbHTzbmFyrltrR9dCGQ7_WnmBTqqmaLDQNebCQYqqV3F8sY-GCiQ-1U27N1FA_EBzyA_fJdxiDa19aLVv7JANDobMUXf2MfW3PjcS4bGMEfxiBkrUV3ANrFw=w1280
« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 02:31:58 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2021, 03:24:54 AM »
Greer didnt notice any impact&cracks on the windshield or indent on the chrome strip until shown the next day.  Hence Greer cant help us re when they happened, ie which shot.
https://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/greer.htm

Mr. SPECTER. Did you observe any bullets or fragments of bullets at rest in the car after the shooting terminated?
Mr. GREER. No, sir; I didn't, I left the car at the hospital and I didn't see it any more until the next day.
Mr. SPECTER. I hand you Commission Exhibit No. 349, Mr. Greer, and ask if you are able to identify what that picture represents?
Mr. GREER. That represents the windshield of the car.
Mr. SPECTER. Of the President's car?
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir; it looks like the windshield of the President's car.
Mr. SPECTER. Now calling your attention to a small arrow--
Mr. GREER. Arrow.
Mr. SPECTER. Which points up on what appears to be an indentation, I ask you if you--when was the first time, if at all, that you observed that indentation?
Mr. GREER. I didn't observe that--
Mr. SPECTER. On the car?
Mr. GREER. Until after I got back to Washington, until the car came back to Washington, I saw it at the White House garage. It was the first time I had ever noticed that.
Mr. SPECTER. On what date did you observe that indentation on the car?
Mr. GREER. That was the day after, the 23, would be it. It would be the day after the shooting. We got back from Dallas.
Mr. SPECTER. And what time of the day did you observe the car at the White House garage on that date?
Mr. GREER. It was in the afternoon, I believe. I believe it was in the afternoon, I believe.
Mr. SPECTER. Did anyone call that indentation to your attention at that time?
Mr. GREER. Yes; I was asked if I knew about it.
Mr. SPECTER. Who was it who asked you?
Mr. GREER. I can't remember now who did say that, but I was shown that indentation at the same time I was the break in the glass. I was shown both and asked if I had known but I can't remember who might have asked me.
Mr. SPECTER. Had you ever observed that indentation before the assassination occurred?
Mr. GREER. No, sir. I had never noticed it before at any time. I had never seen it before.
Mr. SPECTER. Had you ever had any occasion to examine closely that metallic area to ascertain whether or not there was such an indentation prior to the assassination?
Mr. GREER. Well, it seems to me I would have prior to that had it been there because I do take care of the car sometimes, and it had never been--I had never noticed it at any previous time.
Mr. SPECTER. I hand you Commission Exhibit 350 and ask you if you are able to state what that depicts?
Mr. GREER. That depicts a break or a shatter in the windshield of it.
Mr. SPECTER. Does that picture accurately represent the status of the windshield on the President's car at sometime?
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir; that windshield looks real familiar to me on the way it--
Mr. SPECTER. At what time, based on your observation, did the windshield of the President's car look like that picture?
Mr. GREER. I had never seen that until the following day after it came back from Dallas.
Mr. SPECTER. But on November 23, did the President's car windshield look like that?
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir; it looked like there was a break that had a diamond, in the windshield whenever I was shown that at the garage, the White House garage.
Mr. SPECTER. Was the size and scope of the crack the same as that which is shown on that exhibit?
Mr. GREER. That I wouldn't remember whether it was quite that large or not. I don't believe it was that big. It might not have been but I wouldn't say for sure.
Mr. SPECTER. Did you observe any crack on the windshield after the time of the shooting on November 22?
Mr. GREER. No, sir; I didn't see it at all. I didn't know anything about it until I came back, until the car came back and I was shown that.
Mr. SPECTER. Did you have any occasion on November 22, after the shooting, to observe closely the windshield?
Mr. GREER. No, sir. The only time I was in the car was going to the hospital and I never--I didn't see the car any more. It was just from the shooting until we got to Parkland that I was with the car. I left the car there and never did see it until it was back at the White House garage.
Mr. SPECTER. Are you able to state with certainty there was no crack in that windshield prior to the shooting on November 22?
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir; I am sure there was nothing wrong with that windshield prior to that because I would have it was almost in front of me and I examined the car, I looked it all over when I got there, I saw it was clean and everything, the windshield. I didn't see this ever at any time previous.
Mr. SPECTER. Mr. Greer, I now call your attention to a windshield which has been marked as Commission Exhibit No. 351, and I will ask you to take a look at it and identify it for us, if you can, calling your attention first of all to the windshield itself. Are you able to state--
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir; this is the windshield that came out of the Lincoln.
Mr. SPECTER. That you were operating on the day of the assassination?
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir.
Mr. SPECTER. Can you describe what cracks, if any, which you see now on that windshield were present?
Mr. GREER. When I looked--
Mr. SPECTER. When you observed the automobile windshield on November 23, the next day?
Mr. GREER. This little star, the star in here with the little star. These cracks were not there.
Mr. SPECTER. Now by these cracks you are indicating--
Mr. GREER. These.
Mr. SPECTER. The long cracks which radiate off from the center?
Mr. GREER. That is right. This was the only cracks that I could see was this star-type fragment.
Mr. SPECTER. There you are indicating what would be described as the principal point of contact which was present when you observed it on November 23?
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir.
Mr. SPECTER. Give me your best estimate on the diameter of the cracking of the windshield as it existed on November 23?
Mr. GREER. To the best of my estimate it would be these little stars that are here, the little shatters that are here.
Mr. SPECTER. Would it be fair to say that you are indicating a circle with a circumference or diameter of approximately an inch to an inch and a half?
Mr. GREER. I don't think--it probably would be an inch. The whole diameter.
Mr. SPECTER. Approximately 1 inch as you estimate it?
Mr. GREER. Yes, sir.
Representative BOGGS. Excuse me, did you say you did not notice this crack from the time that you drove the car after the shooting to the hospital?
Mr. GREER. No, sir; I had flags on the car and you know they were waving at a high rate of speed and you have the Presidential flag and the American flag in front of you there; you know when you are going at a fast speed you get a lot of, well, I don't know how you would say it, it attracts you so much that I didn't have any recollection of what happened on the windshield.
Representative BOGGS. There was no glass or anything that spattered on you in any way?
Mr. GREER. No, sir; I didn't feel anything at all. I didn't feel a thing hit me.
I was kind of shocked at the time, I guess anything could have and I wouldn't have known what hit me. You are tense, I was pretty tense, and naturally my thoughts were the hospital, and how fast I could get there, and probably I could have been injured and not even known I was injured. I was in that position.

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2021, 03:24:54 AM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #22 on: March 20, 2021, 06:15:40 AM »
Here are a printscreen from the youtube of a Hickey cartoon showing the likely happenings at Z313.
14 mistakes.
Not only did Hill jump off the running board but Ready & Landis also jumped down briefly (Nix footage).
Hickey was earlier drawn sitting low down in the seat, in fact we know he was half-sitting half-standing on 2 cases placed on the rear seat for that purpose.
Hickey is shown flicking the AR15 from SAFE to SEMI, no, he flicked all the way to AUTO.
Hickey should be shown stumbling forward onto Donnelly, due to Queen Mary braking, at which time Hickey accidentally fires.
And instead of one shot there were a number of auto shots.
And Agent McIntyre on the left running board watched Hickey picking up the AR15 & shooting (Bronson footage).
And then after the shots McIntyre quickly looks towards JFK (Bronson footage).
And after the shots the Queen Mary driver Kinney looks around to his right & back towards Bennett on the back seat (Nix footage).
During the shots driver Greer has turned around & is looking at JFK, & he then turns to look forward & he lowers his head & keeps it low for a while (Zapruder footage).
After the shots Kellerman in the front passenger seat in the JFK limo ducks down & puts his head against the dash & stays down for a while (Zapruder footage).
And Agent Youngblood should be shown covering LBJ (statements).
JFK The Smoking Gun – 5:11 long -- 75,916 views -- •Dec 5, 2013 -- Szymon Wojteczek

https://sites.google.com/view/jfkhickeycartoons/home
https://www.flickr.com/photos/192566201@N05/51064827901/in/album-72157718751599323/
« Last Edit: May 09, 2021, 02:30:58 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #23 on: March 22, 2021, 04:41:09 AM »
I have drawn 3 puffs of smoke in the pix showing the view from the witnesses on the underpass.
One puff is from Oswald's 2 shots, one is from Hickey's 3 or 4 or 5  shots, one is near the picket fence.
The 3 puffs are fairly close together anglewise for the witnesses on the underpass, especially any witnesses standing at the northern end of that group.
Perhaps Oswald's or Hickey's smoke was confused as being from the picket fence.
More likely it was Hickey's smoke.
This pix was i think in 2019, the trees would have been smaller & thinner in winter 1963.
The pix shows the view from i reckon over the line tween the center lane & the southern lane.
The 3 puffs would look closer together from over the northern lane.

https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOAdMzVh_2GEe6Fpmxa9tAEz6h6GvopIlsjYO0ncYdGBdptUE57ABIKozR5StzDSg?key=QTUxMnVnVW54a19acUFkcHRDNTNHcjZudXFIcndB

« Last Edit: May 12, 2021, 02:09:01 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

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Re: Was Hickey's AR15 in burst mode?
« Reply #23 on: March 22, 2021, 04:41:09 AM »


 

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